The grouper you've all been waiting for (and more)

[JustinReef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13517663#post13517663 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Grouperhead
Did yall see any banded or yellow bellied sea snakes?

No these were th only ones. Just the Aipysurus laevis. Part of me was glad because I was pretty scared of them even though our guide insisted that they are "harmless" and "never bite mate". He said the giant sea turtles were more likely to bite A joke of course. They were incredible as well. Couldn't get too close or they would move away but wow.

Australia and more specifically the GBR was one trip we HAD to make. In the end, backpacking around and staying in hostels instead of hotels made the trip very affordable and incredible. I don't think the trip would have been half as good if we had stayed in hotels and had "luggage". It was so nice to be able to just go wherever and not spend a bunch of money on a fancy room that was never going to get used for more than a few hours a day.

 

[danorth]

Great colors on that grouper, and love the niger as well, how big did you say the niger is?

 

[JustinReef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13518594#post13518594 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by danorth
Great colors on that grouper, and love the niger as well, how big did you say the niger is?

About 6" I would say. Just compared to the grouper who I have measured. The Trigger just never stays still enough to measure properly.

 

[JustinReef]

So tonight the grouper was picking up very large mouthfuls of sand from the corner he sleeps in and swimming about half way down the tank and dropping it. He moved a very large amount of sand in a short period of time and created quite the sandstorm. I guess he felt the need to redecorate

Has anyone else seen their grouper do this?

 

[predator 1]

Yes Justin, my Panther Grouper does it every day. It drives me to distraction!!! I put the sand back, he moves it again, even the Golden Arothron has picked up the habit now. I give up now, I just leave them to get on with it.

 

[JustinReef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13518826#post13518826 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by predator 1
Yes Justin, my Panther Grouper does it every day. It drives me to distraction!!! I put the sand back, he moves it again, even the Golden Arothron has picked up the habit now. I give up now, I just leave them to get on with it.

Oh ok...I really wasn't sure. I figured it must be normal but I just haven't had much experience with groupers yet. He was still doing it this morning when I woke up. He has dug right down to the glass and also seems to be very protective over his corner. Not really aggressively but if the other fish go near it, he darts over and lays down before they can :lol: Kind of like "Go away! I was here first!!!"

He's quite the character! Getting very friendly too. My fiance thinks he is the smartest fish in the tank and I think I have to agree.

 

[predator 1]

Exactly Justin!! My "Maculatus" is just the same, but instead of shifting sand with his mouth, like the "Panther" and the "Golden Arothron" he makes a nest with his tail. With ferocious body movements, and if any of the fish venture near the cleared area, "All of hell is unleashed"!!!!

 

[JustinReef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13521579#post13521579 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by predator 1
Exactly Justin!! My "Maculatus" is just the same, but instead of shifting sand with his mouth, like the "Panther" and the "Golden Arothron" he makes a nest with his tail. With ferocious body movements, and if any of the fish venture near the cleared area, "All of hell is unleashed"!!!!

Mine is not quite there yet...I have noticed that the Niger Trigger is still boss of the tank If he doesn't want the grouper around, he will chase him away. Doesn't happen much but once in a while. The niger is smaller but more aggressive for sure.

 

[predator 1]

Please take on board advice from a person from the "Old School" Justin. Your Grouper will eventually "Befriend" that Trigger. They will get along fine for a while, and then "BANG" the Trigger will be history. You trust my words my friend, I have been keeping these fish for "4 decades".
I am sure I mentioned to you before, I had searched international suppliers to get my beloved "Sphyraena" (Barracuda) imported into the UK. After many, many, years I finally manged to purchase a pair. After quarantine them in my home, I introduced them into the main display system during the dead of night, when the Groupers had been fed very well, and the system and room lights were off.
My god, you have never seen anything like it(and I hope you dont) My beloved Barracuda, that I had spent so many years searching for, where destroyed in front of my, and the wife's eyes so fast by the "Maculatus" it was unbelievable and heartbreaking.
So please Justin, keep an eye on that situation, you may get lucky, but the probability is that Trigger will soon be a "Dead Fish walking"

 

[JustinReef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13522476#post13522476 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by predator 1
Please take on board advice from a person from the "Old School" Justin. Your Grouper will eventually "Befriend" that Trigger. They will get along fine for a while, and then "BANG" the Trigger will be history. You trust my words my friend, I have been keeping these fish for "4 decades".
I am sure I mentioned to you before, I had searched international suppliers to get my beloved "Sphyraena" (Barracuda) imported into the UK. After many, many, years I finally manged to purchase a pair. After quarantine them in my home, I introduced them into the main display system during the dead of night, when the Groupers had been fed very well, and the system and room lights were off.
My god, you have never seen anything like it(and I hope you dont) My beloved Barracuda, that I had spent so many years searching for, where destroyed in front of my, and the wife's eyes so fast by the "Maculatus" it was unbelievable and heartbreaking.
So please Justin, keep an eye on that situation, you may get lucky, but the probability is that Trigger will soon be a "Dead Fish walking"

Well...You may be right but I think Epinephelus maculatus may be much more aggressive than Variola albimarginata. For one, yours gets double the size of mine! Im not saying your necessarily wrong but from all everything I have heard, Variola albimarginata are not aggressive but of course can be opportunistic if small fish are in the tank. Not to mention my grouper and trigger should end up relatively close in size. The grouper will be a little bigger but shouldn't be too much. Yours, would be massive compared to my trigger though and WAY too big for my tank anyways.

Maybe someone who actually owns a Variola albimarginata can chime in on this. Sorry but I just don't think the two different species can really be compared fairly.

 

[predator 1]

I do not have a "Epinephelus Maculatus" Justin!! I keep a "Plectropomus Maculatus" Perhaps I should have been more precise, my apologies!

 

[LisaD]

Predator, that's too bad about your barracudas. Do you still have the grouper, or did you decide to have a fish fry?

You had me worried, I have Epinephelus fasciatus, which so far, is a pretty passive tankmate.

 

[JustinReef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13523385#post13523385 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by predator 1
I do not have a "Epinephelus Maculatus" Justin!! I keep a "Plectropomus Maculatus" Perhaps I should have been more precise, my apologies!

Oh ok, well then an even bigger fish than mine. Have you kept Variola albimarginata and had these problems?

Honestly you have me worried too. If this is a real problem, I will think of selling him because I have had the trigger for quite a while now and don't want to loose him. Just want to be sure the two species are similar enough to have the same concerns though.

 

[billsreef]

The biggest problem with keeping any of our predator's with other fish, their diet is typically based on "do you fit in my mouth?". If the answer is yes, it's dinner. If the answers no, well, "I'll just have to wait till I grow bigger".

 

[JustinReef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13523865#post13523865 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by billsreef
The biggest problem with keeping any of our predator's with other fish, their diet is typically based on "do you fit in my mouth?". If the answer is yes, it's dinner. If the answers no, well, "I'll just have to wait till I grow bigger".

Right and this is what I have based my choices on. But to hear that my Niger "will" be killed by my grouper makes me a little uneasy. This is much different from the advice I have been given.

My understanding was that my species of grouper (and most other species) were NOT too aggressive in terms of territory or tank space but aggressive in terms of eating and being "opportunistic". So he would eat anything he could fit in his mouth but not attack fish that are clearly too big to eaten. I mean there is absolutely no way my Niger could fit in his mouth

Im also curious as to why my Niger "will" be killed? What about the other fish? Many of them are smaller than the Niger and will stay much smaller than the grouper...still not small enough to fit in his mouth though.

 

[billsreef]

There's never any guarantees with mixing predators, just the odds. IMO the odds for your grouper not eating the Niger are fairly good. The Niger gets pretty big itself. As for small enough to eat, keep an eye on just how wide that groupers mouth opens. In general, if it's the least bit smaller than the grouper, it can be made to fit in the mouth...even if it takes two bites. Keeping them adequately fed does reduce the temptation for such large mouthfuls and therefore gives the rest of the fish better odds, but it's still always a chance. It's also why my Snowy Grouper is in a tank all by itself...it ate the filefish that was it's tankmate. The filefish was the same size :eek1:

 

[JustinReef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13524028#post13524028 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by billsreef
There's never any guarantees with mixing predators, just the odds. IMO the odds for your grouper not eating the Niger are fairly good. The Niger gets pretty big itself. As for small enough to eat, keep an eye on just how wide that groupers mouth opens. In general, if it's the least bit smaller than the grouper, it can be made to fit in the mouth...even if it takes two bites. Keeping them adequately fed does reduce the temptation for such large mouthfuls and therefore gives the rest of the fish better odds, but it's still always a chance. It's also why my Snowy Grouper is in a tank all by itself...it ate the filefish that was it's tankmate. The filefish was the same size :eek1:

Hmmmm...makes sense. I am super worried now! I think he will easily be able to eat the following then:

Coral Beauty
Blue Spotted Rabbitfish
Burrfish
Dogface Puffer
Lined Cardinal

Basically everything in the tank! As hard as it is to say this, I may find a home for him then. I am getting super attached to him already and maybe its better to give him up now rather than waiting for a disaster. I do know someone with a 300G (420G total water volume) system willing to take him...

 

[LisaD]

I think the coral beauty and the lined cardinal would be in the greatest danger. can you hang on for a year or two, and keep a tank dedicated to the grouper and larger tankmates, and reserve a tank for the smaller fish?

 

[billsreef]

Yup, I'd look to move the Coral Beauty and the Cardinal to a smaller tank. The others will grow large enough that the odds are good for them being safe.

 

[LisaD]

maybe plumb in a second "sump" (since you won't let yourself get another "tank"?