The T5 Q&a Thread - split

[mhucasey]

Has anyone out there ever used a sorta "reverse" cycle where you burn the large amount of bulbs for a long time - and those are Blue+ - ish bulbs, and then burn the 2x dawn/dusk bulbs as "mid day" tubes rather than dawn/dusk and populate them with your full spectrum / white bulbs like GE6500k etc.

Kinda like you would burn your halides for 6 hours or so in the middle of the day, but run the actinics etc for longer.

I've been toying with burning 6 tubes for the long run (10-12 hours) all Blue+ and then the 2x dawn dusk bulbs (#3 and #6) as a GE6500k and Coral+ for only 6 hours or so.

PS - new bulb time.

This is an interesting concept...I've become convinced that to the coral, pure blue light is kind of invisible in the way that many marine organisms can't see red light with their eyes. Their Zooxanthellae may start using the light but the corals don't respond to high amounts of blue light until some red light is mixed in.

When the red light is present, the corals start to react to protect themselves and regulate the amount of zooxanthellae present in their tissues as well as producing some protective pigments. I think it also triggers the coral to grow to take advantage of the increased light and the food produced from that light. However, when the coral gets too much red light it begins to "brown out".

If the coral gets almost exclusively blue light the coral will grow very slowly even though the amount of available photoynthetically active light is very high. I think of these mechanisms like when we go to the beach on a cloudy day - our eyes tell us that the sun's intensity is low, therefore we shouldn't worry about the associated UV. We cant directly notice the UV so we usually go by how intense the sun is. I think corals developed this mechanism to determine how much total light was reaching them based on the total red intensity.

The Dawn/Dusk bulbs would "wake up" the coral for the required intensity period. I just wonder if the increased photosynthesis in the dawn/dusk hours would benefit the coral or not. I'd be interested to read what you observe!

 

[Orion120]

If you go with the Aqua Blue Special you do not need the Coral Plus but can replace it with either a second Purple plus or another Blue Plus. I would move the Aqua Blue special back one position though from your selection.

Thanks!
With regards to moving the "AB special back" do you mean back towards the middle or towards the front?

 

[TropTrea]

Thanks!
With regards to moving the "AB special back" do you mean back towards the middle or towards the front?

As a general Rule I like to keep the brightest fullest spectrum bulb one spey yo the front of the center. So on an 8 bulb fixture it would be 4th from the front or a 6 bulb fixture 3rd from the front.

This will give the fuller spectrum bulb the most even coverage over the entire tank.

 

[TropTrea]

This is an interesting concept...I've become convinced that to the coral, pure blue light is kind of invisible in the way that many marine organisms can't see red light with their eyes. Their Zooxanthellae may start using the light but the corals don't respond to high amounts of blue light until some red light is mixed in.

When the red light is present, the corals start to react to protect themselves and regulate the amount of zooxanthellae present in their tissues as well as producing some protective pigments. I think it also triggers the coral to grow to take advantage of the increased light and the food produced from that light. However, when the coral gets too much red light it begins to "brown out".

If the coral gets almost exclusively blue light the coral will grow very slowly even though the amount of available photoynthetically active light is very high. I think of these mechanisms like when we go to the beach on a cloudy day - our eyes tell us that the sun's intensity is low, therefore we shouldn't worry about the associated UV. We cant directly notice the UV so we usually go by how intense the sun is. I think corals developed this mechanism to determine how much total light was reaching them based on the total red intensity.

The Dawn/Dusk bulbs would "wake up" the coral for the required intensity period. I just wonder if the increased photosynthesis in the dawn/dusk hours would benefit the coral or not. I'd be interested to read what you observe!

I have seen different ideas on this for years.

I will say experimenting with LED's you can get a much control of the spectrum because of the narrower wavelength of the spectrum. Using strictly Royal Blue LED's 455nm and Near UV 410nm on a Frag tank I was able to get extreme skeletal growth on Frog Spawn Corals however the size of the polyp heads were smaller than with full spectrum light. When I reduced the amount of near UV lighting and tried strictly 455nm lighting the skeletal growth increased however the size of the polyp heads increased slightly.

I thin started adding a small amount of full spectrum neutral white light and watched the reaction. With a ratio of about 1 neutral white to 5 Royal Blues the there was little change, But when I went to 1 neutral White to 4 Royal Blues the head size increased drastically but I also noticed the skeletal growth slightly slowing. When I went to a 1 to 3 ratio I saw the skeletal growth drastically reduced with no increase in the head size. Finally using a 1 to 2 ratio there was very minimal growth and the head sizes started getting considerably smaller even compared to when I had a lot of 410 nm LED's. Also with the 1 to 2 ration the intensity of the green and purple colors started turning from a bright color to a grayish color starting to look muddy.

My conclusion was that the red light is needed. however only in a very limited degree.

As far as the switching of bulbs go I have been running a tank now about a month and a half. Lights on at 11:30 AM with 3 Blue Plus and 1 Purple Plus, then the second Bank goes on at 12:30 AM of a GE 6,500K and a Blue Plus. The second Bank turns off at 10:00 PM and the fist Bank turns off at midnight. The only difference I'm noticing is that the polyps on candy cane are receding as soon as the lights go on while before they stayed out until the mid day lighting came on.

My curiousity now is if that single Purple Plus is causing the polyps to retract or if it is the intensity of the Blue Plus bulbs.

 

[mhucasey]

I'm not a big fan of the 100% blue tank, so I always used one white and one blue bulb for dawn/dusk. I have come to the conclusion that even the small amount of red light that was shed by the one white bulb was affecting the corals a bit. I've swallowed the Kool-aid and went to blue bulbs only for dawn and dusk and have had a noticeable improvement(noticeable to me anyway) in PE and color. Growth in general has been really good once i dialed in the right amount of red light.

 

[kevin32]

40 gallon breeder 36" aquaticlife 4x39 t5 fixture.

Would this work well...


******Front****
Blue plus
Purple plus
Blue plus
Blue plus
******Back*****


What you guy think? Or

-blue plus
+ coral plus
????

 

[rogergolf66]

40 gallon breeder 36" aquaticlife 4x39 t5 fixture.

Would this work well...


******Front****
Blue plus
Purple plus
Blue plus
Blue plus
******Back*****


What you guy think? Or

-blue plus
+ coral plus
????

I would swap the purple for a coral plus. It has purple in it

 

[TropTrea]

40 gallon breeder 36" aquaticlife 4x39 t5 fixture.

Would this work well...


******Front****
Blue plus
Purple plus
Blue plus
Blue plus
******Back*****


What you guy think? Or

-blue plus
+ coral plus
????

I agree with Roger Golf The Purple does have the needed red but you do not need much of it. With a 4 bulb fixture one Coral Plus will give you roughly the best balance of red as as the greens and yellows so you have better viewing pleasure.

With the Purple Plus you will also get an unnatural purplish glow which some people like for dawn to dusk but many other people think is too artificial for mid day.

 

[kevin32]

Cool thanks guys will give it a try.

 

[TropTrea]

mhucasey has brought out a interesting thought train from me. What really happens in nature?

As the Sun begins to light things up before it even breaks the horizon we see the red and orange light. Then as the sun finally breaks the horizon the black sky begins to radiate the blue light which eventually overcomes the red light . The true K temperature of the Sky in the shade is around 6,500K to 6,700K however this would be with a pure 100 CRI which has never been created in a commercial artificial light fixture to date. On a sunny day the Sun itself producing light at a considerable lower color temperature as its true color is in the yellow orange range which becomes more dominant as it reaches the mid day point.

So if we realy wanted to duplicate the cycle of natural light we would start with a very low K light probably in the range of 2,800K then bring the intensity up slowly with the addition of Blue Light till we reached a 5,000K to 6,500K range.

Now since Corals do not grow on the surface but at various levels of the ocean we need to consider the filtration of the water. The deeper one goes the more the red light is filtered out. With deep water corals they receive close to no red light and even a limited amount of orange and yellow light. Some of the Green light is even filtered out.

So keeping this in mind we need to modify the K temperature from what they would be at the surface. A guide might be to take the initial surface K tempos and use a multiplier to calculate the equivalent at certain levels of the ocean. So lets look at some possibilities that way.
Dawn Midday Dusk
Surface 2,800K 5,000k 2,800k
Shallow 4,900K 8,700K 4,900K
Moderate 8,800K 15,300K 8,800K
Deep 15,000K 27,000K 15,000K
Super Deep 26,000K 47,000K 26,000K

While I just fished out of the hat a 1,75 factor between the different levels The big point is perhaps we should starting with the fuller spectrum bulbs from dawn to Dusk and then actually adding the blues as the day approaches midday full lighting?

This is a just a wild thought train I do not suggest trying with expensive corals but could be considered on a smaller tank as a test. I may attempt it with LED's.

Predawn warm White 4 Watts + 4 Watts 620nm LED's
Dawn add 8 Watts Neutral White + 8 Watts 455nm
Midday add 8 Watts Cool Whites + 34 Watts 455, 24 Watts 470nm, and 12 Watts 430 nm .

The 102 Watts would be about right for a 40 to 60 gallon tank. Or I could even scale it down lower for a smaller tank.

Any thoughts from others?

 

[kevin32]

Just tried the coral plus bulb...man I like it more than purple plus. Thanks for the help fellas. Really appreciated. Happy reefing

 

[rogergolf66]

Just tried the coral plus bulb...man I like it more than purple plus. Thanks for the help fellas. Really appreciated. Happy reefing

Glad it worked out

 

[kevin32]

Glad it worked out

Thanks bud. :beer:

 

[jasony816]

Anyone ever used 5 Blue plus and 1 Coral plus?

 

[TropTrea]

Anyone ever used 5 Blue plus and 1 Coral plus?

I have not used it but have heard from some people that have. They claimed fantastic florescence and improved coral growth. But other that tried it claimed it took away all the snap from the reflective colors especially there fish.

It really depends on how blue you like your tank. Personally If you like a deep blue look than a few Royal Blue and True Blue LED will give you even more floresense that any T-5 bulb out there.

 

[DiscusHeckel]

Anyone ever used 5 Blue plus and 1 Coral plus?

I use 3 blue plus and 3 coral plus. Next time round I will try 4 blue plus and 2 coral plus. I do not think I will ever try to use less than 2 coral plus due to potential loss of reflective colours. I have quite a few corals with reflective colours.

 

[Snake74]

Hi Grim,
i'm italian and now i have a 363 lt marine tank (more ore less 95,89 gal) and now i've buyed an Blau aquaristic Lumina 8x39W T5HO with this 8 neon (all ATI):
2 Blu plus
1 Purple Plus
3 Acquablu special
1 Actinic
1 Coral plus

Is this the right combination? and which is the sequence?

If not could you tell me the right one? and the right sequence?


Note that the Blau Lumina has four power buttons that light up neon staggered (1-8, 2-7, 3-6 and 4-5)

Ultimately also wonder what is the sequence of on / off to recreate the right photoperiod

Thanks for the answers (i'm neophyte) and sorry for my bad english.

 

[TRUKINGNY]

thinking about getting rid of my radion pros and getting a ati sunpower my tank is 36 x 18 x 20" i wanna keep mainly SPS is the ATI 36 Inch 6x39W Dimmable SunPower T5 High-Output Fixture w/ Controller be good enough for this. i am open to other t5 fixtures also

 

[Orion120]

thinking about getting rid of my radion pros and getting a ati sunpower my tank is 36 x 18 x 20" i wanna keep mainly SPS is the ATI 36 Inch 6x39W Dimmable SunPower T5 High-Output Fixture w/ Controller be good enough for this. i am open to other t5 fixtures also

I have the same dimension tank as you do, and just switched to an ATI non-dimmable Sunpower 36" 6 x 39w from a Maxspect Razor. I really like the look over LEDs.

My bulb combo is -

Front to back for 6 bulbs:
Blue+
Blue+
Coral+
Purple+
Blue+
Blue+

This fixture will put out more than enough light for SPS especially with 4 Blue+

 

[TropTrea]

thinking about getting rid of my radion pros and getting a ati sunpower my tank is 36 x 18 x 20" i wanna keep mainly SPS is the ATI 36 Inch 6x39W Dimmable SunPower T5 High-Output Fixture w/ Controller be good enough for this. i am open to other t5 fixtures also

I personally would not spend the extra money on the Controllable fixture. Nut yes 96% of the 6 bulb fixtures will work on a tank your size. The big thing is make sure they have individual reflectors for each bulb.

But for the price range your looking at a combination of LED's and T-5's in a fixture will give you the best of both worlds. And a quality LED fixture would also top the the T-5's fixtures. Look at Pacific Suns web site they have some quality LED and LED T-5 combination fixtures. In your price range.