The Ultimate DIY Rocks!

[Azazael13]

I hope it works for ya IR, I will never be able to try it since the only thing separating my kitchen from my house is a half wall.

Going to make some more this week (still waiting on the first batch to be ready, sitting around week 6 in water). Going to go with the 7 day out, 2 in hot water, than 4 weeks (hopefully) in normal water.

On my first batch I haven't used aged salt water or RODI water yet, Since I don't have a home RODI. Hopefully it is only another week or two in water

On the aged salt water, would salt water I take out on a water change work for the final 3 day soak?

 

[Insane Reefer]

Thanks Az - I can tell you this - this stuff went from punky to hard as a, well, rock, in 4 hours. Before I put it in, I could score it with my fingernail, and now I can't.

With a half wall, you still could - just do it while you are out of the house for the day. It really wasn't that bad - but the water bath I added picked up the pH, and made it sort of acrid - I was in and out of the kitchen most of those 4 hours, with no harm I can tell.

I added the rocks hot (allowed to cool for half an hour) to the salt release bath, and it was weird. A "plume" of white whooshed out - my water looked like I had been soaking for 2 weeks with no water change. Then the very hot water started to simmer, lol.
It would be cool if that sort of pushed the leachants out.

Anyway - salt should be out tomorrow, and I will do a 24 hour soak and get an initial pH reading on it and report my results. If the pH is 10 or less, than that means it is where rock that is about 28 days is usually at - in water or out of it.

If this works, I might pick up a used oven at a garage sale and have my dad rig me a 220v line outside, and be able to bake at will. I'm starting to really cook with local rock sales, and need a way to speed this whole process up. I really hope baking works, because that is really the only option that is viable for me.

Yes, Az, by all means, use old salt water from changes. All you are trying to do is get a more accurate reading for pH.

 

[Azazael13]

the only concern I would have with the half wall would be the chemicals released. The two dogs in the house may not like me so much

 

[Insane Reefer]

Well, the Carbon Monoxide detector didn't go off, I never felt light-headed or odd - really the only thing I could physically feel wrong was the slight sting in my eyes and throat. The cats were in and out as much as I was, and they seem fine too. Stick a fan in the kitchen window to vent and block off the doorway (boxes, chairs or whatever) to keep the dogs out, and I would say go for it. But that's me, and I am Insane

 

[sunkool]

why are you guys in such a hurry to cure the rocks?
patience is a virtue!
everything in this world is turning into a rush.
lay back and enjoy the view!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[goldmaniac]

Terrific research on the ceramics, everyone..

hey, maybe this has been covered, but does anyone have a Nationwide source for WHITE portland cement? my stuff, still hardening, Curing, is pretty dark, I and I wouldn't mind starting over with a much whiter mix. I'm realizing that all my rock is much brighter than what my MMLR is going to be.

Ace Hardware, Lowes, HD, Sears Hardware, 84 Lumber, anywhere like that where I could find a store?

I bought my Portland Cement at Lowe's. Quickcrete brand, type I/II, is what I used this past month.



thanks,

G.

 

[GuySmilie]

gm, how light do you think it will be with a few months of coralline growth covering it?

 

[Insane Reefer]

None of the big box hardware stores carry white cement - at best you will find white mortar or grout - or at least this is the case for the Mid-West. I had to go to an actual masonry supply for my white portland, and pay a whooping $20 a bag. IMO it was worth it, and it's what I use for my commercial rock as well; there is some leftover grey rock at the LFS that I made a while back, but the white disappears within days of being made available, so others must like it better too.
It typically takes a year or two to properly stock a reef tank, and even with abundant coralline growth, you may be looking at pretty bare rock for longer than a few months. I personally don't want to look at charcoal grey rock for that long - it seems to "dim" the overall appearance of the tank.

I've been tempering the blinding white with a few spoons of grey, and color-wise it really is hard to tell between real and not.

I use Lehigh white cement. You can find a picture of the bag in my gallery, I believe.
HTH, Goldman.

 

[goldmaniac]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9850224#post9850224 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by GuySmilie
gm, how light do you think it will be with a few months of coralline growth covering it?

Guy,
My tank strickly adheres to Murphy's Law.

I have learned with this hobby that the universe and all non-living things that exists within it drives towards order and chaos, as my tank has shown me repeatedly. I do not, nor never have, counted on coralline algae covering this live rock. I am not a pessimist, but this view has allowed me to observe any positive progress within my tank to be a plesant surprise. :rollface:

I think this is a great project; it's just that all of the made rock i have made is sitting in a trashcan and looks a bit grey and dark. I'd be happy to consider this my practice run. Only took a month. In the grand scheme, not long at all to learn such a valuable tool as making my own MMLR!

G.

 

[goldmaniac]

correction:

everything in the Universe drives towards DISorder and chaos. Sorry.

 

[goldmaniac]

I think that's a viable definition of Life, by the way:

anything that fights, in some kind of organized state, the Universe's tendancy to break down into disorder and chaos

 

[goldmaniac]

First!!

woo hoo

 

[GuySmilie]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9851625#post9851625 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by goldmaniac
I think that's a viable definition of Life, by the way:
anything that fights, in some kind of organized state, the Universe's tendancy to break down into disorder and chaos

:thumbsup:

 

[Chasmodes]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9851619#post9851619 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by goldmaniac
correction:

everything in the Universe drives towards DISorder and chaos. Sorry.

Yer beginning to sound like Ian Malcolm!!!!!!

 

[Tahlequah]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9842157#post9842157 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Insane Reefer
The idea GrannyBJ, is the "Q10 temperature coefficient", which states that a rise in tempurature increases boilogical and chemical process by orders of magnatude. Simply put, more heat makes things happen faster. The cement brick industry uses this to fire bricks - the use low temps, but high pressure, and force the curing of the bricks in hours instead of weeks. Normally, it takes 28 days for cement to reach its full strength, which also coincides with about 90% hydration. The idea is that heat and moisture speed the hydration process, which will hopefully mean rock with a short kure cycle.

The kitchen has gotten warm and streamy, and sort of stingy on the eyes and throat. I'm doing a 4 hour bake at slightly higher than the industry uses, but can't pressurize it.

Will release salt in a boiling bath, and post the pH at that time.

Hello Insane Reefer,

I have been watching this post for about 3 months now and never really felt the need to chime in, until now. . The sting you probably felt was from chlorine gas being released from the salt in the mix. I think you are heading in the correct direction but i would caution baking dry salt for so long.

During the mid to late 80s people in Colorado were using salt to clean the duct work from their fire places. unfortunatly the salt that was being burnt was turning into clorine gas, which is heavier that air, and was settling in the neighbors back yards killing their pets.

I'm not really sure if 500 degrees is hot enough to cause the chemical break down but from the description it may be. I may be able to look up the other side effects in my Industrial Safety books that I still have from when I was completing my undergraduate degree.

 

[Travis L. Stevens]

Hiya from Stillwater, Tahlequah!

 

[Tahlequah]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9854800#post9854800 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Travis L. Stevens
Hiya from Stillwater, Tahlequah!

Hello Hello! Hopefully I can get free some Saturday to join OMAS.

 

[goldmaniac]

InsaneReefer:

thanks -- I found the pic of the bag of white portland cement in your gallery. I now know that it is indeed made, I'm going to hit a couple of tile places around here, as well as some local builder/contractor supply houses.

Kudos!!

 

[Insane Reefer]

Goldman - dude. You doubted me? I'm hurt, man, I really am...


Tahlequah. Welcome to the thread, and thanks for posting Granted, this info might have been slightly more useful before I fired my rocks, lol. JK!
Seriously though - I took your info and used my BFFE, google. GrannyBJ might want to read THIS , as it is in Potterese - but from what I gather, at the heats I am working at, 400°-500°F, nothing bad is going to happen in the way of gases - and two of the principle ingredients of cement, Silica and alumina, are noted to being fairly resistant to firing.

So on to salt itself, and I found this bit I will quote here, but will post the threads link after for those who want to read the whole thing. Now this is a response to a pottery thread, but since the thing they are talking about is related, I think some common ground can be found between the two.

Without going into details of his exhastive effort his conclusions were that less than 1% of the salt used in a typical firing was actually consumed in sodium combining with silica for glazing effects and the rest was exhausted through the flue and into the atmosphere AS SALT AND WATER VAPOR. The stuff our mothers use on us when we have a sore throat. As for clorine gas, NONE was measured in the stack and HCL production was so small as to be difficult to measure.

THIS LINK

I will stand by my first thought that the caustic fumes are somewhat like a humid/rainy day in the desert. The alkalinity and pH of the rock is picked up by the water I feed the oven with (warmth and moisture) as it wafts through the rock, becoming steam that is released into the air, and thus causing a mild sting to the eyes and throat.

If someone knows where info to the contrary can be found, please post it! Tahlequah, if you find those books, please do look and post wat you find. But even if the pH isn't any lower, the rock is certainly stronger than it otherwise would be - I've made enough rock to gauge this. I'd say in strength, it is easily as strong as two week old rock.

I am waiting to do my initial pH test until all of this last batch is fired and released - might as well kure it all at once - test results won't be different for having more or less. Tonight will see the last of this batch fired - so by the weekend I should have something solid for you.

 

[goldmaniac]

IR: ??

never doubted you, I didn't think I had indicated that. sorry-
not sure why you think I ever did. I've been taking your ideas and running with them this whole time.

G.