The Ultimate DIY Rocks!
- Thread starter JohnL
- Start date
impur
New member
OCEAN SIZE - Thanks! They came out nice. Epoxy won't work unfortunately, that piece is just too brittle. I can break it apart with my hands. I tossed it into the buckets anyway to see what happens.
IR - Thanks again. I did not notice a difference in strength. My last batch i removed from the mold after a couple days and then just let them sit out dry for a few weeks, then into the water. This time i left them in the damp sand mold for just over 3 weeks. I do need larger curing tubs i know. I change the water twice a day as it is now.
I think i am really close to the perfect ratio. A little more cement would help strengthen my mix up and then it should be good to go. Water just rushes right thru these pieces which i love. Now that i have the casting method down, all i need to perfect is the mixture
IR - Thanks again. I did not notice a difference in strength. My last batch i removed from the mold after a couple days and then just let them sit out dry for a few weeks, then into the water. This time i left them in the damp sand mold for just over 3 weeks. I do need larger curing tubs i know. I change the water twice a day as it is now.
I think i am really close to the perfect ratio. A little more cement would help strengthen my mix up and then it should be good to go. Water just rushes right thru these pieces which i love. Now that i have the casting method down, all i need to perfect is the mixture
Insane Reefer
New member
You're right, CMPenny 
Thanks for the info, Impur
Keep us posted.
Thanks for the info, Impur
Keep us posted.
Thanks IR. I believed GARF recipe was mostly cement and aragonite (that's where "Aragocrete"comes from)... but sure doesn't matter as long as it's OK ! I have tried mixing some coral gravel with the OS, but like it better with only the shells... not even considering the cost, almost free when using crushed OS !
Will try to post some pics later.
Will try to post some pics later.
One thing that bothers me about our hobby is stripping the ocean!
I am so happy to see so many people doing the man made rocks.
There really is no reason to get from the ocean any longer. You can make designer rock for a lot less dough and they weigh a lot less.
I set up a new tank in March completely using only rocks I made.
I am 100% happy with the results.
I am so happy to see so many people doing the man made rocks.
There really is no reason to get from the ocean any longer. You can make designer rock for a lot less dough and they weigh a lot less.
I set up a new tank in March completely using only rocks I made.
I am 100% happy with the results.
Rhodophyta
New member
Florida live rock is "land rock" that has been seeded into the ocean, so it is not really taking from the ocean. It is outside the normal rock areas and is colonized by organisms that otherwise would have perished. As far as I know, this approach has not yet been tried in the Pacific.
Aragocrete was originally Dolocrete. Dolomite chips and then crushed oyster shell were the first, not the new ideas. Over time, oyste shell dissolves, leaving voids where it has not been sealed off from water contact.
Insane Reefer
New member
Taken directly from GARF's site: "During the last four years we have made Aragocrete out of many different mixtures. "
The "latest" article on the site, dated 2000, was by Tracy Gray, and she uses Oyster Shell.
And while you didn't address this to me, Flynn, I wanted to ease your mind.
Anything that is made of Calcium is going to slowly erode/dissolve over time (esp. in saltwater). This includes real live rock (which is made of old shell/skeletons/coralline too), sand, etc. But we are talking a long time here. Talk to most of the "old-timer" reefers, like "Paul B", and they will tell you that over decades, they have to replace some sand and some rock.
The cement itself is at greater risk of this than the crushed coral, or crushed oyster shell.
In reality, if our rock is well made, it should last as long as the real thing...
Well, here is what the people at GARF answered me when I asked them if they used Oyster shells in the past and if so, why don't they use it anymore...
"We stay away from oster shells for they are very full of silicates and also phosphates."
Not that I want to doubt about your advises IR... just want to see what you people here think... Silicates and phosphates are really going to be "washed out" rapidly ?
Anybody, really did it (with just OS and cement)?
Just don't want to do it and being stuck in the middle of a nasty mess later on .... as this is my first SW experience...
"We stay away from oster shells for they are very full of silicates and also phosphates."
Not that I want to doubt about your advises IR... just want to see what you people here think... Silicates and phosphates are really going to be "washed out" rapidly ?
Anybody, really did it (with just OS and cement)?
Just don't want to do it and being stuck in the middle of a nasty mess later on .... as this is my first SW experience...
Insane Reefer
New member
It's all good, Flynn - free thinking is allowed 
But, it isn't just my advice - this comes from 30 years of rock making "history" (some of which can be found on the net), as well as my own personal experience. I've made rock just about every way known, and few unknown as well, and pretty much have found that aggregates are aggregates, as far as MLR goes, and it all pretty much works, with few, if any, real issues.
As far as GARF's reply, well I don't really know what to say. I can show you a graph I found that shows what cement is made of:
I'm reading cement as being made up of around 75% silicates of one form or another. And I'm not sure what the 1.5% "other" is, but since phosphate mining often happens in the same locations as the mining for the base materials used to manufacture cement, I'm betting that some of that "other" are phosphates.
But if it worries you, and this is your first SW experience, you might really consider doing it the tried and true, non-DIY way and use real live rock. That way you have one less thing to worry about, and if you do have problems (name a noob who doesn't), you won't be second guessing the rock...
But, it isn't just my advice - this comes from 30 years of rock making "history" (some of which can be found on the net), as well as my own personal experience. I've made rock just about every way known, and few unknown as well, and pretty much have found that aggregates are aggregates, as far as MLR goes, and it all pretty much works, with few, if any, real issues.
As far as GARF's reply, well I don't really know what to say. I can show you a graph I found that shows what cement is made of:
I'm reading cement as being made up of around 75% silicates of one form or another. And I'm not sure what the 1.5% "other" is, but since phosphate mining often happens in the same locations as the mining for the base materials used to manufacture cement, I'm betting that some of that "other" are phosphates.
But if it worries you, and this is your first SW experience, you might really consider doing it the tried and true, non-DIY way and use real live rock. That way you have one less thing to worry about, and if you do have problems (name a noob who doesn't), you won't be second guessing the rock...
Rhodophyta
New member
Pretty unlikely, since even assuming the worst case scenario where all of the exposed oyster shell dissolves, the shell sealed inside the cement would not be exposed. I have some rock from a 5000 gallon Carribean themed tank that was replaced in the 70's. It has been either in my tanks or "stored" in the rock garden for the past thirty years, and was in the Carribean exhibit tank for twenty years before that. The dolocrete and OScrete were used to decorate and unify tufa, a coral-looking natural limestone found in artesian spring areas near other limestone deposits, took many years to weather, and I was looking at it last week before stating that the surface OS can dissolve leaving holes that weren't there before.
What held up the best was fake "rock" made from 2-part epoxy paint and diatomaceous earth (sold to filter aquarium water). There were reds, blues, yellows, orange. Most colors have fades to white or gray, but the orange that was painted on straws to create fake worm tubes, has been out in the sun for decades, and except for a few missing chips, is still very orange. You keep mixing more powder in until the epoxy has the consistency of cake icing, then you form it into shapes attached to earlier shapes and rocks.
quagmire
Active member
PH question
PH question
Ok, so i have been kuring my MMLR for a couple weeks doing daily water changes with unfilterd tap water. I decided to check the PH of the water in the kuring container today, and as expected its way up there. Then i checked the PH of the water coming out of my tap using two different kits getting the same reading with both kits, 8.2. Now i don't know if this is a high reading for tap water or not. But i'm thinking that using water with such a high PH starting point may a problem. Should i bring down the PH of the tap water before adding it to the kuring tub? Any suggestions. Thanks, Quag.
PH question
Ok, so i have been kuring my MMLR for a couple weeks doing daily water changes with unfilterd tap water. I decided to check the PH of the water in the kuring container today, and as expected its way up there. Then i checked the PH of the water coming out of my tap using two different kits getting the same reading with both kits, 8.2. Now i don't know if this is a high reading for tap water or not. But i'm thinking that using water with such a high PH starting point may a problem. Should i bring down the PH of the tap water before adding it to the kuring tub? Any suggestions. Thanks, Quag.
salty joe
Active member
It was just a general response. I had not been here in a while & it occurred to me that every time the toilet got flushed, the MMLR would get a water change. Of course the rock would have to be small enough to not interfere with the float & lever mechanism. Maybe someone already suggested this.
Insane Reefer
New member
Hey Quagmire
8.2 is really high for tap water - you might call your water supply and ask them what the pH is supposed to be. Tap water should be in the 7 range.
But if that is really what your tap is, then you could add just enough vinegar to bring the pH down to 7 (remember, acid is bad for cement and should be used sparingly, if at all), but honestly, 8.2 is fine for kuring since that is the target range anyway.
Salty Joe - the toilet is awesome for kuring small rocks, rubble and mount plugs, and has been used by me and others for years. As we speak, I have a bunch of rubble in my toilet
A couple of tips though. 1. Every so often you want to add some CLR or Lime-Away to the holding tank - if you don't, you could end up with problems with the flush mechanism over time, due to hard water deposits. 2. Put rubble and plugs into nylon mesh bags to keep it from shedding so much and to keep pieces from blocking the flush flap.
If the toilet is a busy one, you can get small rocks to kure in a couple of weeks, a month tops.
8.2 is really high for tap water - you might call your water supply and ask them what the pH is supposed to be. Tap water should be in the 7 range.
But if that is really what your tap is, then you could add just enough vinegar to bring the pH down to 7 (remember, acid is bad for cement and should be used sparingly, if at all), but honestly, 8.2 is fine for kuring since that is the target range anyway.
Salty Joe - the toilet is awesome for kuring small rocks, rubble and mount plugs, and has been used by me and others for years. As we speak, I have a bunch of rubble in my toilet
A couple of tips though. 1. Every so often you want to add some CLR or Lime-Away to the holding tank - if you don't, you could end up with problems with the flush mechanism over time, due to hard water deposits. 2. Put rubble and plugs into nylon mesh bags to keep it from shedding so much and to keep pieces from blocking the flush flap.
If the toilet is a busy one, you can get small rocks to kure in a couple of weeks, a month tops.
