The Ultimate DIY Rocks!

[cmpenney]

Amen Brother!

 

[speckled trout]

wow! Some people have really complicated this whole thing...

I made my rocks about 5 years ago with nothing more than oystershells and portland cement. I simply put them in a crate, lowered them into a river and forgot about them for 3 months. When the 3 months was up I took them out, power washed them to get the debris off and stuck them in my tank.

Today, I can't keep my frogspawn and some of my other coral from propagating and I haven't lost a fish or coral in years. It also contains birdnest, candy cane, trumpet, mushrooms, acropora, galaxia, star polyps, zoos, brain coral, and a few others. And, all of this in a tank full of man-made rock that was created with oystershells and cement.

Correctly made home-made rock works, to say anything else is ............well, you know................:hmm3:

 

[mr.wilson]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=15551493#post15551493 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by speckled trout
wow! Some people have really complicated this whole thing...

In my opinion, soaking the rock in water isn't necessary, so it's even less complicated.

 

[is_that_a_fish]

man i know. i have made diy rocks ever since i was in this hobby, about 3-4 yeas now. just cement, sand, and rock salt has done it for me. i cured some in a creek, but since we movied, i just cured it in a rubbermaid outside. when i was selling my tank, i was removing the rocks, and i couldnt even tell which ones were diy with all the coraline. the tank was 50/50 real/diy.

 

[is_that_a_fish]

heres a full tank shot of my new tank. 100% diy live rock, and the tan is foam covered with sand. as you can see, the rock look very realistic, and is probably my best batch ive made. tank is cycling by the way. its also a 5.5 gallon all in one...

 

[cmpenney]

Here are a couple I just recently made for a club MMLR workshop:

Try to find rocks like that at a store and those things are more porous than any rock you'll find in a LFS.

 

[2_zoa]

Those are nice looking pieces pmpenny.

I chose to go with mrwilson's method. I used eggcrate for the structre and a mix of crushed coral and cement. I used Hydrolic water stop. It is in its second week of curing and I could add water in the next two weeks but, I wont be done with everything.

Thank you again mrwilson.

 

[mr.wilson]

Great job. It makes the tank look much bigger.

 

[Everyones Hero]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=15551493#post15551493 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by speckled trout
wow! Some people have really complicated this whole thing...

I made my rocks about 5 years ago with nothing more than oystershells and portland cement. I simply put them in a crate, lowered them into a river and forgot about them for 3 months. When the 3 months was up I took them out, power washed them to get the debris off and stuck them in my tank.

Today, I can't keep my frogspawn and some of my other coral from propagating and I haven't lost a fish or coral in years. It also contains birdnest, candy cane, trumpet, mushrooms, acropora, galaxia, star polyps, zoos, brain coral, and a few others. And, all of this in a tank full of man-made rock that was created with oystershells and cement.

Correctly made home-made rock works, to say anything else is ............well, you know................:hmm3:

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=15551548#post15551548 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by mr.wilson
In my opinion, soaking the rock in water isn't necessary, so it's even less complicated.

So... what you're saying is mix the cement with aggregate, make a pile of mud, & let it dry? Or if I want to get fancy make a pile of mud & make pretty shapes with it?

Sounds like that's about as complicated as making rocks should be.

 

[cmpenney]

Yeah I did the rock panels as well:

When the picture above was taken The panels on the left had been in th tank about a month and the panels on the right had been added 2 days earlier.

Becuase of the size of the panels and the fact that the tank was running I made the panels in several interlocking sections.

 

[DeathWish302]

Here are some 1" - 3" diameter cores that I drilled out of Haiti (first two from left) and Fiji (right) live rock. The inside is quite dense, like concrete with only a few worm or urchin holes. I often find large black burrowing worms in the rock, about the size of a slug. This die off is just as bad as sponges when you add new live rock to your tank. This is one benefit to using artificial rock as there is no massive shock of die off. The addition of ammonium chloride daily will help speed up the establishment of a nitrogen cycle.

Man made rock is comprised mostly of marine calcareous aggregate with only 25% cement content. I don't see any significant difference in the surface area or void spaces in artificial or natural rock. Nitrifying bacteria live on detritus trapped in the substrate and in rock surfaces. There really is no shortage of nitrification even in bare bottom tanks with only a few rocks, manmade or natural. A lot of time was spent discussing how to increase porosity on man made rock in this thread, but very little time was focused on why we should do so.

While it's true that you can't improve on nature, I don't think it's fair to say nature has evolved to use nitrification as its sole design for rock formations, nor is it fair to say that bacteria have evolved to only accept the exact pore matrix of coral rock. In the end, man made rock is encrusted with worms, coraline algae, sponges, and coral polyps, so the surface porosity is identical to that of naturally formed live rock. We are comparing sea apples to sea apples here.

One person has argued that man made rock is more harmful to the environment than live rock due to the trucking across great distances. I can assure you that the journey from Fiji to the end user in North America uses far more fuel. I don't know anything about mining portland cement, but I doubt it is removed from as delicate an environment as live rock is.

People make their own rock for a variety of reasons, and cost is (or at least should be) in the minority. I make it because it looks better, fits better, hides plumbing, and has limitless possibilities. The tank matures quicker (nitrogen cycle, coraline algae & misc. invertebrates) if you mix some live rock with your artificial rock, but there is no reason why the "live" rock added has to be from the ocean. I still use natural live rock, but I wouldn't be disappointed if live rock harvesting was banned tomorrow. Once the rock is in your tank for six months, it's almost impossible to tell which ones are real and which are artificial.

+1,000,000

ANY of my MMLR looks as good as 'most' or the real LR. I do hold Marshal Island rock as the best looking rock I've ever saw, but with a few 'show' pieces the MMLR will look just as good. Agreed completely that if we don't start policing our reefing actions, there will be bans and eventually major declines. Walt Smith may say ....'The ocean is vast and are harvesting has less than 1% effect on the reef, but look at all the endangered/extinct species due to man.

cmpenney - What recipe are you using? 4:1 (oysterortland)? Any rock salt? Yours are some of the better MMLR i've seen. I'm perfecting what I'm doing and have made about 50lbs of 'samples' over the past year. I'm undecided on the best method for longevity of strength, so I'm always interested in others' experiences and recipes.

 

[cmpenney]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=15550791#post15550791 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by mr.wilson

I'd really like to see a nice core like that from a piece of MMLR that was made by an expierenced rock maker to compare. I'm sure much of the stuff I have is way more porous than the samples above.

 

[mr.wilson]

I borrowed the core drill bits so I can't do any of MMLR right now. I'll try to use an old glass drill bit and drill from both sides when I get a chance. I'll try to post a fair comparison here. The main thing that surprised me is that the rugged outer texture of live rock quickly changes just under the "skin". Each new layer of life that develops manages to occupy the void spaces left by its predecessors. Where is see more surface area (void space) within the rock is when I encounter a piece that was once a brain coral, but most of the rock we see is largely composed of tiny calcareous invertebrates.

 

[cmpenney]

Keep us posted. I think a good core will go a long way to validating that MMLR can be just as good if not better than stuff ripped off of reefs.

 

[DeathWish302]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=15563081#post15563081 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by cmpenney
Keep us posted. I think a good core will go a long way to validating that MMLR can be just as good if not better than stuff ripped off of reefs.

If you've ever seen the old Carib Sea reef rock packaged in 40-50lb boxes, the stuff resembled that 'holey' rock from the southern states as Texas. It may be crystalized ancient coral, but that does not change the porosity characteristics to a complete solid chuck with minor voids in the center. Those core sample images would also explain why a canteloupe sized rock from Figi weighs 4-8lbs and my MMLR weighs maybe 3-5lbs. This just further proves that limestone stones that have been 'carved' and soaked in muratic acid would be just as good as base Haiti and Figi LR.

 

[2_zoa]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=15561313#post15561313 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by cmpenney
Yeah I did the rock panels as well:

When the picture above was taken The panels on the left had been in th tank about a month and the panels on the right had been added 2 days earlier.

Becuase of the size of the panels and the fact that the tank was running I made the panels in several interlocking sections.

Nice work.

 

[speckled trout]

In my opinion, soaking the rock in water isn't necessary, so it's even less complicated.

Do you just let it air dry, completely?

The river is in my back yard, so placing them in there requires very little effort and then I just forgot about them for awhile. Anyways, making rock will work. Those who say it doesn't are doing something wrong.

As you can see, those who say MMLR will kill the inhabitants of the tank, is bad for them, won't work or whatever aren't exactly correct. Here's a pic of my tank after the coral took over.

Making different shaped rocks is neat, but in the end you won't be able to see them, anyways.

 

[mr.wilson]

I use quick setting cement and don't get a PH shift when using rock cured for 30 days. When I use standard portland, the PH goes up to 8.8 for a couple weeks then goes back down to 8.4. In my opinion, the slight raise in PH is acceptable in a new tank with little or no livestock. It's certainly better than introducing phosphates and other contaminants. Soaking the rock in freshwater dissolves carbonates & calcium in the rock. Saltwater will not do this to the same extent.

If anyone has had the PH go above 9 for over a month in salt water let me know. As I said I use quick setting cement so the curing process and composition is different. If I were to soak the rock in water before using it, I would use saltwater so it doesn't encourage dissolution and I would add ammonium chloride to start the nitrogen cycle. Adding sodium nitrite will speed along the development of denitrifying bacteria.

 

[speckled trout]

The river behind my house is only a couple miles from the bay. It's usually salty although sometimes it's brackish.

I've always heard that you weren't supposed to soak it in SW, but it worked for me, as well.

 

[rguyler]

If I recall correctly Insane Reefer's testing showed that air curing the rock for ~30 definitely reduced the water "kuring" time, which supports what you are saying Mr. Wilson. She really had moved towards steaming the rock at some point as the ultimate method but that's not really practical for most of us I think. I haven't read a comparison between kuring with salt water versus fresh but would be interesting. Most use fresh though for economic reasons so it doesn't appear to have a negative effect but still may negate something positive in the end.

Speckled Trout, I've seen pictures of your rock prior to adding to the tank and you are a master! You should give lessons or something on how you made your rock. It was possibly the most realistic (and cool) DIY rock out there.