For you folks saying the tanks never looked better, what specifically looks better, and how?
Tropic Marine BIO-ACTIF Salt?
- Thread starter wld1783
- Start date
wld1783
Premium Member
Coral colour is more vibrant and more hints of floresence. My brownish/red birdsnest is now pink. Blue tip acros have more blue on the tips. I would not consider my results 100% due to the Bio-Actif due to the following changes made over the last 6 months.
-Changed MH Lights to LED T5 Combo.
-Stopped using my Ca Reactor and started using TM Bio-Calcium.
-Switched From TM Reg to TM Bio-Actif salt.
-Added a pair of DYI Waveboxes for improved flow.
Any one of these or all could explain the improvement in my corals.
Bill
OK, thanks. 
Pagoda's , Nepthia's , Acans and Frogspawns that were already stretching out good went even further.
Seemed to brighten the water and the corals a bit .
No other changes have been made at all to this system.
DHaut
New member
Is there any way to be objective about results? I might switch from DD H2O and try to get some before and after pics to see. I don't plan to change any other tank variables. But i'm running 25g total volume, so I don't know if the results will be more/less dramatic due to the small size.
romanr
New member
Mixing 30g worth right now for the first water change with the new salt. I'll take some pictures of the tank tomorrow prior to the water change and then I'll do an "after" photo later that day. I like the bucket design better than IO. The salt is in a bag with a resealable plastic tie. The salt is very dense compared to IO. Don't know about yield yet. I'm starting with a cup per 2 gallons.
romanr
New member
Alright, sorry about the delay with the pics. I'll be posting those this evening. I was able to get natural seawater salinity using 1/2 cup per gallon. That is actually what IO recommended but it always yielded around 1.022. The TM gives me 1.026. Now I'll say that thus far I can't see a big difference in my livestock but it's early in the process so I'm looking to see the results after going through a bucket. I will then decide if I will get another bucket of the TM.
wld1783
Premium Member
Just try it for 3 water changes. Most of the people who like this salt saw improvement after 2-3 water changes.
Bill
The best salt i'ver ever used is DDh20 ocean, i really wouldn't use anything else if i could
but 99% of the time i'm using Reef Crystals with no issue's at all, it's cheap and has good numbers that's all that matters to me
DD h20 ocean made my tank look the best and mag is kept very high using it, it is a great salt but pricey compared to Reef Crystals
but 99% of the time i'm using Reef Crystals with no issue's at all, it's cheap and has good numbers that's all that matters to me
DD h20 ocean made my tank look the best and mag is kept very high using it, it is a great salt but pricey compared to Reef Crystals
rtparty
Raise The Reef!
The sediment won't harm anything. DD has been very open about what that sediment is and that it doesn't cause any issues. They add a ferric oxide to their mix and that binds to the phosphates and keeps them out of the tank.
Also DD has been very upfront to mix the water for at least 24 hours but to try and go 48 hours. I do this with all salt that I use. It isn't hard to drop in a heater and pump and just let it mix for a few days.
wld,
Have you been getting 200 gallons out of each bucket of the TM salt? The price is high but if you actually get 200 gallons then it isn't bad at all.
They add a ferric oxide to their mix and that binds to the phosphates and keeps them out of the tank.
What phosphate? They assume you are using contaminated fresh water, or their salt ingredients are contaminated?
What phosphate? They assume you are using contaminated fresh water, or their salt ingredients are contaminated?
romanr
New member
Randy, I notice today after my 2nd water change with the TM Bio-Actif that the ORP is dropping much more than usual after the water change (35%). From 380 to 260. Could it be the organic compounds being added by the Bio-Actif salt? If so am I fighting what the salt is trying to do by running ozone to get the ORP back up to 380? It actually takes about 6 hours to get it back up to that and that's with the ozone generator running full blast the whole time.
rtparty
Raise The Reef!
Most salts contain phosphates from what I have read. I will dig up the link where they talk about and they even link in what DD had to say about it.
I use Reef Crystals right now and it is terrible for phosphates. Since switching over to RC I have fought cyano and hair algae the whole time. I use Oceanic for a year and DD for 6 months. I never had an issue with either salt.
Yes, it is the salt mix. It is not flow related and it is not my RO water. I get my RO from my LFS and I always check the TDS. It reads 0 every time. I mixed up a fresh batch of RC and when I tested it I found phosphates in the mix. It was reading in at .05ppm. Not bad but it is still there and I attribute the hair algae to it. Long story and I have rambled on enough already.
http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=161449
That is the link where you can find a lot of info for DD.
Here are some of the other links:
http://www.theaquariumsolution.com/node/487
http://www.theaquariumsolution.com/node/481
wld1783
Premium Member
rtparty,
I get 160 gallons which is my monthly water change and some left over.
Considering the overall cost of this hobby I put quality salt on one of the last things to cut. There are other good salts out there this one I like more and the extra 20 bucks a month is worth it for me. Someone with a regular setup would only be paying an extra 5 bucks a month.
Bill
I get 160 gallons which is my monthly water change and some left over.
Considering the overall cost of this hobby I put quality salt on one of the last things to cut. There are other good salts out there this one I like more and the extra 20 bucks a month is worth it for me. Someone with a regular setup would only be paying an extra 5 bucks a month.
Bill
Could it be the organic compounds being added by the Bio-Actif salt?
Yes, like vitamin C drops ORP a lot, or it may just be the relative mix of things like ferrous vs. ferric ion they use. More ferrous leads to lower ORP on mixing. It is common to have ORP drop in a new mix, and I would not worry about it. I do not consider the ORP in a salt mix to be important, and higher is not necessarily better.
Yes, like vitamin C drops ORP a lot, or it may just be the relative mix of things like ferrous vs. ferric ion they use. More ferrous leads to lower ORP on mixing. It is common to have ORP drop in a new mix, and I would not worry about it. I do not consider the ORP in a salt mix to be important, and higher is not necessarily better.
I use Reef Crystals right now and it is terrible for phosphates. Since switching over to RC I have fought cyano and hair algae the whole time. I use Oceanic for a year and DD for 6 months. I never had an issue with either salt.
While I do not doubt that you experienced that problem, I'm pretty sure it wouldn't be related to the tiny amount of phosphate in a salt mix, relative to the large amounts in all fish foods.
The comparative tests I’ve seen show typically about 0.03 ppm for phosphate in RC, maybe a bit more. Some have even more.
But those numbers are really not important, IMO, and I’d much rather have that tiny bit of phosphate than a mix adding GFO into the salt.
So let’s explore what that 0.03 ppm means. Suppose that you do a 10% water change with 0.03 ppm phosphate water, and the tank is at 0.00 ppm. The phosphate will then rise to 0.003 ppm. Still less than you can detect, but even so, let’s compare it to fish foods:
If we add 3 grams (1 cube) of the following frozen foods to 100 gallons (378 L) so aquarium water, we’d get the following rise in phosphate:
Formula 1……..0.03 ppm
Formula 2……..0.03 ppm
Prime Reef……0.02 ppm
Lancefish……..0.11 ppm
The phosphate data in foods came from here:
Necessary Nutrition, Foods and Supplements, A Preliminary Investigation
http://web.archive.org/web/20010720071031/http://www.animalnetwork.com/fish/data/foods.asp
So that single small feeding with a high quality frozen fish food adds 10 times as much phosphate as that 10% water change with Reef Crystals.
Consequently, I submit that the phosphate is insignificant, and I do not want a salt mix maker adding things like GFO to try to lower it.
IMO,they simply chose a low grade of calcium chloride, since that is where they claim it came from, and make it sound like a benefit. :lol:
While I do not doubt that you experienced that problem, I'm pretty sure it wouldn't be related to the tiny amount of phosphate in a salt mix, relative to the large amounts in all fish foods.
The comparative tests I’ve seen show typically about 0.03 ppm for phosphate in RC, maybe a bit more. Some have even more.
But those numbers are really not important, IMO, and I’d much rather have that tiny bit of phosphate than a mix adding GFO into the salt.
So let’s explore what that 0.03 ppm means. Suppose that you do a 10% water change with 0.03 ppm phosphate water, and the tank is at 0.00 ppm. The phosphate will then rise to 0.003 ppm. Still less than you can detect, but even so, let’s compare it to fish foods:
If we add 3 grams (1 cube) of the following frozen foods to 100 gallons (378 L) so aquarium water, we’d get the following rise in phosphate:
Formula 1……..0.03 ppm
Formula 2……..0.03 ppm
Prime Reef……0.02 ppm
Lancefish……..0.11 ppm
The phosphate data in foods came from here:
Necessary Nutrition, Foods and Supplements, A Preliminary Investigation
http://web.archive.org/web/20010720071031/http://www.animalnetwork.com/fish/data/foods.asp
So that single small feeding with a high quality frozen fish food adds 10 times as much phosphate as that 10% water change with Reef Crystals.
Consequently, I submit that the phosphate is insignificant, and I do not want a salt mix maker adding things like GFO to try to lower it.
IMO,they simply chose a low grade of calcium chloride, since that is where they claim it came from, and make it sound like a benefit. :lol:
Last edited:
rtparty
Raise The Reef!
I use Reef Crystals right now and it is terrible for phosphates. Since switching over to RC I have fought cyano and hair algae the whole time. I use Oceanic for a year and DD for 6 months. I never had an issue with either salt.
While I do not doubt that you experienced that problem, I'm pretty sure it wouldn't be related to the tiny amount of phosphate in a salt mix, relative to the large amounts in all fish foods.
The comparative tests I've seen show typically about 0.03 ppm for phosphate in RC, maybe a bit more. Some have even more.
But those numbers are really not important, IMO, and I'd much rather have that tiny bit of phosphate than a mix adding GFO into the salt.
So let's explore what that 0.03 ppm means. Suppose that you do a 10% water change with 0.03 ppm phosphate water, and the tank is at 0.00 ppm. The phosphate will then rise to 0.003 ppm. Still less than you can detect, but even so, let's compare it to fish foods:
If we add 3 grams (1 cube) of the following frozen foods to 100 gallons (378 L) so aquarium water, we'd get the following rise in phosphate:
Formula 1"¦"¦..0.03 ppm
Formula 2"¦"¦..0.03 ppm
Prime Reef"¦"¦0.02 ppm
Lancefish"¦"¦..0.11 ppm
The phosphate data in foods came from here:
Necessary Nutrition, Foods and Supplements, A Preliminary Investigation
http://web.archive.org/web/20010720071031/http://www.animalnetwork.com/fish/data/foods.asp
So that single small feeding with a high quality frozen fish food adds 10 times as much phosphate as that 10% water change with Reef Crystals.
Consequently, I submit that the phosphate is insignificant, and I do not want a salt mix maker adding things like GFO to try to lower it.
IMO,they simply chose a low grade of calcium chloride, since that is where they claim it came from, and make it sound like a benefit. :lol:
While I agree food has much more phosphate, I have not changed my feeding habits or anything else. Only the salt.
I also read that Red Sea Coral Pro salt has the same things in it. It has to do with the solar evaporative process. They could be blowing smoke but I know that my tank never looked better than when I was using DD H2Ocean.
I thought about trying the Bio Actif salt out but already have DD H2Ocean on order.
Thanks for the input Randy. I really appreciate your input.
FWIW, my point was not that you are feeding too much, but that the difference is unlikely to be phosphate.
That said, there are many other things that could cause such issues. Spores of algae or cyanobacteria in the salt. Some salts (like reef Crystals) have vitamins too. Iron can be limiting to growth of algae, and possibly other trace elements.
More or less of those may impact what grows and how well.
That said, there are many other things that could cause such issues. Spores of algae or cyanobacteria in the salt. Some salts (like reef Crystals) have vitamins too. Iron can be limiting to growth of algae, and possibly other trace elements.
More or less of those may impact what grows and how well.
sneeyatch
Active member
No offense to anyone, but I just don't understand how anyone can make a call after just 3 weeks or so of switching salts. I'm a firm believer that even after you buy a frag or whatever, that it takes at least 2 weeks for it to adjust itself to your water's parameters and routines. At that point, I think polyp extension, color and overall adaptation of the piece is pretty good and ready for it to be placed in a permanent location.
I switched salts from RC to TM Pro last October and I can say that TM's products appear to be good quality (I'm also trying out their Bio-Cal which is nice), but I have a hard time maintaining my alk at an acceptable (to me) level. Everything else is spot on IMO, but I'll be switching again soon. That's 4 months worth of water changes, observations and tests - not a 3 week shot from the hip.
My only point is give it a little more time. Let things adjust through the water changes, test and make more of an edjucated decision then. Again - JMO.
I switched salts from RC to TM Pro last October and I can say that TM's products appear to be good quality (I'm also trying out their Bio-Cal which is nice), but I have a hard time maintaining my alk at an acceptable (to me) level. Everything else is spot on IMO, but I'll be switching again soon. That's 4 months worth of water changes, observations and tests - not a 3 week shot from the hip.
My only point is give it a little more time. Let things adjust through the water changes, test and make more of an edjucated decision then. Again - JMO.
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