Tunze 6055 - APEX Var Speed %

[joshrhykerd]

I have 2 Tunze 6055's that I'm trying to get setup and running in my BioCube 32 via my APEX controller. I'm having some issues with dialing in a program to run the way I would like it to. The pumps seem to be way overkill for this size of tank, but I still feel like I should be able to get them working. At the very lowest setting everything is ok, but as I attempt to increase the flow at all things very quickly get crazy and sand is going everywhere. From what I understand the powerheads require a minimum of 30% power to run properly(33% for mine). Because of the strength of the pumps in the small tank going from just 33% to 40% for example is almost to much. So how exactly does the % set in the APEX relate to the % set on the Tunze controller. Is the Tunze controller to be set at the low 20% or the high 100% or somewhere in between. Ultimately I'm looking for anything I can do to dial back the powerheads so I can more tightly control them via the APEX. So for example if I do turn the Tunze controller down to 20% the % range I can use within the APEX broadens making programming of a more dynamic flow pattern easier. This seems to be a possible solution, but what I don't like is that I don't know exactly how those two setting correlate. So outside of visually seeing what's happening, I'm not sure exactly how much turnover and flow I'm actually getting. I don't want to just know at what number sand starts to fly, but what happens each time I increase the % in the APEX. I know how to write the APEX programs just need some help figuring out the relationship between the two intensity settings.

Thanks in advance for any help!

 

[rvitko]

I have no first hand experience with Apex, they use a generic 0-10V control and the pumps are 0-6.5V control so the speeds are likely not accurate. The pump can run at 20%, this is true of all pumps we have made since 2015. Placement can be as important as speed, so you could place them lower with a stronger upward angle and likely run the pumps at a higher speed. I would defer to Apex on settings though as I simply do not know. In general if the pump spins consistently without stuttering or stalling that would be the 20% minimum and I would expect based on a 0-10V system anything over 65% is actually 100% but this is tricky as it is not perfectly linear.

 

[joshrhykerd]

Thank you for response. Do you happen to know the correlation between the main power setting(%) on the Tunze controller and the power setting(%) set in the APEX. If you set the APEX power to 50% does that mean it's 50% of the setting set directly on the Tunze controller. For example lets say the Tunze controller is set to 50% on the main power knob and the APEX is set to 50% does that result in a 25% output from the powerhead?

 

[rvitko]

Once set to external mode, the controller settings should do nothing and should not be used, the controller connected is in full control of the pump and the knobs are bypassed.

 

[joshrhykerd]

That's what I assumed would be the case, but it doesn't seem to be true. I currently am sending a 35% signal to the Tunze powerheads as I workout my programming and I can clearly see a change in the speed of the powerhead as I turn the main power knob on the Tunze controller. If it's all the way down my sand does not move at all, but turning it to 100% the sand starts to move. This is what made me think that there was a correlation between the two...

 

[rvitko]

It is possible, Apex only uses 2 of the pin outs so it could work differently. If the 7090 is in external mode though, the Apex should be in control and we do generally recommend to avoid any risk of overlap that the 7090 is at 100% and pulse is off and all settings are done on the controller that is connected.

 

[joshrhykerd]

Thanks for your response. Here is a link to a quick video of what happens...

http://bit.ly/2DF1OJt

I was just hoping there was some kind of defined correlation between the two so I could figure out some things via math instead of just strictly trial and error.

Thanks again for your help!

 

[rvitko]

Is the Apex able to control it? Unfortunately, I have plenty of experience with our pumps but none with an Apex so I just don't know. I would essentially find the lowest speed on the Apex where the pump does not stall or stutter and call that the equivalent of 20% on the Tunze and leave the 7090 at 100%.

 

[joshrhykerd]

Yes the APEX is able to control it as well. As I turn of the values on the APEX the control knob on the Tunze controller grown exponentially.

 

[rvitko]

So, I would just try to find the lowest apex speed the pump stalls at and go a bit above that and that will be the equivalent of 20%, but keep the 7090 at 100%. The speeds will be off on the Apex, but the capability is the same.

 

[joshrhykerd]

This is what I tried originally and am trying again based on your suggestion. It does in fact work and I think gets me the most out of the pumps except I have pretty much zero control other than on / off from the APEX. The ultimate goal of course is to develope a program with variable flow throughout the day. With the 7090 at 100% the apex stalls at 33%. The problem tho is that as I increment the apex I can only get to around 37-38% before it will be to much flow for the tank which gives me no room really. I guess I probably just got pumps to large for my tank it seems.

Thanks

 

[rvitko]

In general I recommend these pumps for a 75, it is a lot of pump. Options would be to replace the front housings with the 6095.130 which give a more diffuse flow or try working with placement, a sharp upward angle with pumps mounted low can help quite a bit.

 

[joshrhykerd]

So I was doing a little more research and discovered that the 7090 main power control can be used to specify the maximum performance of the powerhead.



So it seems my observation was correct, but what I don't know yet is if adjusting the main power control scales the APEX power setting proportionately.

For example if the 7090 is set to 50% max and the APEX to 100% does that mean the pump will run at 50%? Using the same example what if the APEX is set to 50% does the pump then run at 25%?

I also know from what you've said rvitko that the control voltages between the two do not match up 1 to 1 making things even more complicated. I would like to know exactly what the relationship is here, but at this point knowing that the main power on the 7090 is in-fact setting the maximum does help out. I can assume at some level that when I increment the power via the APEX that it is incrementally increasing the speed of the pump as I would expect. By decreasing the max power of the 7090 it increases the range of values I have to use to adjust the flow via the APEX(i think lol).

 

[joshrhykerd]

Is there any way to measure the power actually being sent to the powerheads after both of the controllers?

 

[joshrhykerd]

Unfortunately from what I can tell there is no proportionality between the 7090 main power control and the signal sent via the Apex. All that adjusting the main power control does is simply limit the max performance. So the voltage sent from the Apex always does the same thing regardless of the main power unless of course it exceeds the main power.

 

[joshrhykerd]

I don't want to beat a dead horse here, but my final observation around this topic is that the minimum required signal from the Apex, which in my case is 33%, is stronger than the lowest setting when using the 7090 controller directly. It seems the lower end of what the pump is able to actually do is not achievable via the Apex from some reason. Exactly how different they are I do not know, but using each setting I can definitely notice different amounts of flow as I watch my corals.

 

[Mikegray]

I bet apex forum can bang this out for you I'm following as I'm building a tank and looking to add two tunze powerheads and will indeed have full apex