Turning OFF my skimmer

[Fishy 1]

Yeah trying to figure out when to set it will be the tricky part.
Yup I'll see you there

 

[vette.tech]

I realise that what ever i dose gets skimmed OFF by my skimmer.

What are you dosing that you believe is being skimmed out?

+1 and I don't believe that your observation of the skimmate and smell is the most accurate way of determining what was skimmed out, it's possible your over thinking this for no reason

 

[spamreefnew]

I have been reading and reading and reading about natural filtration,skimmers,and coral feeding. I also ran skimmerless for the last four years. (ATS only) I just can't seem to keep sps or grow lps corals without some skimming for some reason. So from now on I will skim but I will skim very dry and have my skimmer on a timer.

 

[Mudbeaver]

To each is own

To each is own

I have a few Tube vids with good example but i prefer myself to have a skimmer.

However it seem possible for some to be able to do it without a skimmer. I guess its all about the set up, and the bioload.

<iframe width="854" height="510" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/_Uf5IyXvajg" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="854" height="510" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/-eCQSVdqBQA" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="854" height="510" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/_PKjd-TA1kM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="854" height="510" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/qMIlWxX4q1c" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

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I'm not saying its the way to go , of course no its just to illustrate that turning my skimmer off wont have dire consequences like some could predict. I prefer myself to have the technology at my disosal and respect everyone choices in the matter.

But marvel at the same time at those who are able to acheive such tank without it; pretty amazin no? In any case finding the right balance is all i can hope for , for my system and i hope you can too. Mine is to have my refugium replace my GFO reactor and the skimmer not pulling out my supplements i put in for my corals and animals in my tank.

​

 

[Fibinotchi]

What a beautiful set up. It's a shame it's stuck in a small little room. Need a comfortable chair in there to spend the day looking at it.

 

[Mudbeaver]

What a beautiful set up. It's a shame it's stuck in a small little room. Need a comfortable chair in there to spend the day looking at it.

Actually i've got the best seat in the house;

I'am right in from of it, eye level view with a coffee in the morning, beer in the evening, a nice porto and cheese later night with the moonlights ....

Very comfortable futon, for two surrounded by beauty :lolspin:

 

[Fibinotchi]

Can't beat that.

 

[Subsea]

What a beautiful display of reefkeeping!

While I have been skimmerless for more than 30 years, I have never achieved displays to that level of beauty. It is a testimony to the keeper of the reef. The title of Reef Aquarium Volume 3 says it in a differrent way, "Science, Art and Technology". When one looks at so many beautiful systems with seemingly conflicting methods to maintain them, the one component that stands out is the keeper of the reef. Even with methods that are poor, if the reefkeeper works hard enough, some bad methods can be compensated for by good husbandry. To your point about the skimmer removing beneficial things which you dose, as has been pointed out, it is a Question of Balance. That is where the Art comes into the equation. While it may be difficult to quantify with scientific equations, the beauty of your tanks is the testimony that "you got it right".

In your analogy of not wanting to remove beneficial things from the water, I discontinued the practice of RO/DI as a required protocol more than 20 years ago. My use of aquifer groud water straight into the tank was first motivated by economics, but I could not buy into the science that abounded in the hobby. My present well is 900' deep in Edwards Plateau limestone formed from an ancient ocean that covered the Texas Hill Country. I do little chemical testing in my aquariums. As I am Cajun, French twice removed, I am a "laissez faire" reefkeeper. I have had both the Lower Colorada River Authority and Ward Lab analyse my water: TDS at 26,040 ppm. Na at 9227 ppm, K at 428 ppm, Ca at 393 ppm, Mg at 1266 ppm, Sulfate at 1067 ppm. Why would I want to remove these constituents from the water? Everything that grows, needs them. The fertilizers which are a nuisance but still required to fuel growth in our reef aquariums measured at undetectable levels: Nitrate <0.01 ppm, Ortho Phosphorus < 0.01, Total Phosphorus < 0.01 ppm, Total Iron .02 ppm, Manganese < 0.01 ppm.
Obviously, some of the aquarium hobby science is not etched in stone. You need no further proof of the science in your tank then the beautiful display that you maintain.

I really like your using a gravity feed from your refugium to display tank. Instead of a return pump damaging the micro fauna and fana produced in the refugium, zooplankton is introduced without damage.
Viva la difference,
Patrick

 

[wildman926]

Why change something that is working?

I will repeat the question. Why change something that is working?

Due to the many different practices of reefkeeping, the success stories are testament to the adaptability of our reef inhabitants, as no two tanks are the same, and that the reefkeeper is providing a stable, constant environment, as is the ocean.

So, keep up the routine of what your are doing, is what makes the most sense to me.

 

[Fredfish]

...
Viva la difference,

Indeed.

 

[Mudbeaver]

What a beautiful display of reefkeeping!

While I have been skimmerless for more than 30 years, I have never achieved displays to that level of beauty. It is a testimony to the keeper of the reef. The title of Reef Aquarium Volume 3 says it in a differrent way, "Science, Art and Technology". When one looks at so many beautiful systems with seemingly conflicting methods to maintain them, the one component that stands out is the keeper of the reef. Even with methods that are poor, if the reefkeeper works hard enough, some bad methods can be compensated for by good husbandry. To your point about the skimmer removing beneficial things which you dose, as has been pointed out, it is a Question of Balance. That is where the Art comes into the equation. While it may be difficult to quantify with scientific equations, the beauty of your tanks is the testimony that "you got it right".

In your analogy of not wanting to remove beneficial things from the water, I discontinued the practice of RO/DI as a required protocol more than 20 years ago. My use of aquifer groud water straight into the tank was first motivated by economics, but I could not buy into the science that abounded in the hobby. My present well is 900' deep in Edwards Plateau limestone formed from an ancient ocean that covered the Texas Hill Country. I do little chemical testing in my aquariums. As I am Cajun, French twice removed, I am a "laissez faire" reefkeeper. I have had both the Lower Colorada River Authority and Ward Lab analyse my water: TDS at 26,040 ppm. Na at 9227 ppm, K at 428 ppm, Ca at 393 ppm, Mg at 1266 ppm, Sulfate at 1067 ppm. Why would I want to remove these constituents from the water? Everything that grows, needs them. The fertilizers which are a nuisance but still required to fuel growth in our reef aquariums measured at undetectable levels: Nitrate <0.01 ppm, Ortho Phosphorus < 0.01, Total Phosphorus < 0.01 ppm, Total Iron .02 ppm, Manganese < 0.01 ppm.
Obviously, some of the aquarium hobby science is not etched in stone. You need no further proof of the science in your tank then the beautiful display that you maintain.

I really like your using a gravity feed from your refugium to display tank. Instead of a return pump damaging the micro fauna and fana produced in the refugium, zooplankton is introduced without damage.
Viva la difference,
Patrick

Thanks i read a lot and try to combine what seems to be common sense to. It like people cleaning their glass every day and asking afterwards why do my snails die.

So i leave my glass go for a few days a week and see my snails eating and grazing on it. I don't need to add food , its growing for free. so why clean and then feed them .

Basic common sense makes reef keeping easier too. Leaving my light a bit longer produces more microalgaes for the tank grazers, another way too help your cuc survive.

Choosing good tank mates and not one for , or simply because its attractive or fun to watch is also a big part of a tank success in my view.

I also like to give my tank a break; stop all dosing , cleaning and simply see the affect for a whole week. You'd be surprise sometimes of the results. It can be the dosing, the feeding, or anything in between, but the tank will react and show you how it works.

Learned alot like that. Some dosing was too excessive some feeding too, not enough of this too much of that. Leaving your fish without food for a week, is a big statement, they all find something to munch on if you have a balanced system. And you find out pretty soon how and why.

Thanks for your time and input.​

 

[Aquarist007]

Beautiful tanks
I've been participating on a few threads regarding not skimming. One point people seem to be forgetting is that the rate of skimming is affected both by the skimmer pump and the flow through the sump. In many cases that is not a lot so that a lot of water is not being processed by the skimmer and simply returned to the display tank
Even then the skimmer is only between 35 and 50 % effective. That effectiveness in turn depends on TOC... TOC contains good organics and problematic organics.
So skimming is going to at least take out some unwanted organics and probably not much good organics

 

[Mudbeaver]

Beautiful tanks
I've been participating on a few threads regarding not skimming. One point people seem to be forgetting is that the rate of skimming is affected both by the skimmer pump and the flow through the sump. In many cases that is not a lot so that a lot of water is not being processed by the skimmer and simply returned to the display tank
Even then the skimmer is only between 35 and 50 % effective. That effectiveness in turn depends on TOC... TOC contains good organics and problematic organics.
So skimming is going to at least take out some unwanted organics and probably not much good organics

Interesting point, but your return pump will circulate your water several times the tank's water volume per hour if you have a good pump. And if your flow pumps are good and you have enough of them the organic material should remain in the water column long enough to be pick up.

This is one reason i took a skimmer that was rated higher then my actuall system volume. Also as indicated in my OP the root of my problem as well lol. Typical dam if you do dam if you don't lol.

Its all about how the system has been conceved from the begining. The Master plan if you will. When i did mine; coast to coast was a must for better skimming, a higher rate skimmer, etc and other thing when into the design.

If you have the basic little square box i agree some skimming is missed.

I write big for my iphone friends

 

[Aquarist007]

C' est magnificant
Would appreciate your advise on my system. It's crystal clear but basically sterile.

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showpost.php?p=23075872&postcount=393

I've been making changes recently to increase micro organisms ect but would appreciate any suggestions

Tks
Scotty

Original set up
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showpost.php?p=23033508&postcount=364

 

[Mudbeaver]

Its been 3 months now

Its been 3 months now


Ok well i've been switching my skimmer OFF for periods of time between 4 to 12 hours , for the last 3 months now. I'm at 12 hours regularly now and my observations are as follows;

-My sponges seem to have regain better colors and a smoother surface.
-The damaged sponges have repared themselves.
-increase in filter sock changing, by 3
-Increase in Skimming in morning and day time. 04;00 to 16;00
-Increase in growth in all corals except zooz.
-Increase of hair algaes
-Nitrates 5ppm phosphate 0.5ppm (normal and desirable with and for my system)
-Skim cup emptied every day now not every 2 days.
-Water very clean and clear, no smell
-No particules or film on the surface
-Temp 74-75oF
-Gravity 1.026
-Cal 450ppm
-Mg 1500
-Alk 8.0
-Feeding twice a day
-Supplements Mix; 0009 ( Ultramin F;Ultra Clam,UltraOrganic,Ultra seafan, Ultra Reef Vitality, Reef-Roids, Ultramin S,Spirulina Powder, Iodine, Iron) in a 500ml bottle ; Dosed 3ml every hour 24/7

My new video almost a year in

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[marcusbacus]

For some reason in the past month or so I have noticed that when I turn my skimmer off for more than an hour or 90 minutes the fish start gasping and get lethargic quite fast (It's a RSM 250), and I don't think I have a large fauna so that the oxygen intake is too high. It has never happened before (3 years with the tank already), but now if I let the skimmer off for more than an hour, there's always some bad signs, no matter what time of the day it is. Fortunately I take no more than 20 minutes to clean it. I never ever turn it of unless for cleaning or... accidentally, when I meant to turn of the lights or something then turn it off instead. I am planning to add a new wavemaker (a wp25, I use a WP10 to replace the slower pump that is now used by the chiller), so the circulation gets a little stronger and if the skimmer gets turned off having another circulation pump might avoid problems, I'll let one doing the waves and the other doing a regular flow, slightly pointing upwards. My biggest scare is everything shutting down at night due to a blackout or something.

 

[beeker]

typically i just turn mine off for a few hours a day, if i feed i leave it off at least 2 hours and then run it until 10 pm when my lights start to die down and shut it off for the night until i wake up the next day seems to work well for me, although i'd never recommend someone not to run their skimmer at least 4 hours a day, but it all depends on bio-load, fish stock and feeding.