I second this. Also it is cheap so I can do lots of water changes.
what is the best salt
- Thread starter rocking
- Start date
I second this. Also it is cheap so I can do lots of water changes.
Yogre
Cheesehead Reefer
A little OT question for Randy:
Do you still supplement Ca and Mg in your Instant Ocean before you do your water change?
I seem to remember you doing this with the old IO formula,and I've been doing this to my IO mix since I got numbers for Mg on fresh-mixed IO that were nowhere near what Billybeau1 got in his testing.
Do you still supplement Ca and Mg in your Instant Ocean before you do your water change?
I seem to remember you doing this with the old IO formula,and I've been doing this to my IO mix since I got numbers for Mg on fresh-mixed IO that were nowhere near what Billybeau1 got in his testing.
Well I've been keeping saltwater tanks since 95' and reefs since 05' and have yet to see/note ANY subjective improvements/decline in livestock with different salts. Some have high calcium, some low, same with alk, same with mg ect ect. I understand high/low calcium/alk may be beneficial in certain circumstances (initial fill, new reef, softy tank or any reef with low ca/alk uptake that relies on water changes to maintain ca/alk. not mine @ 2yr+ reef with 5 gallon water changes, 30g/10g sump, every two weeks. the difference between 500ppm and 350ppm calcium salt ect is of no consequence or importance. not a high enough percentage of water being changed to matter and I believe for 90% of people with established reefs the same thing applies which is why for the life of me I cant understand why people go ape sh*t over new salts or changing salts. I have switched from seachem reef (ca 580ppm/alk 6dKH) back and forth with IO (ca 400ppm/alk 12dKH) 3 or 4 times and for typical size water changes the tank and overall parameters could care less.
and I'm too care free to worry about vitamins fueling bacteria, effects of excessive borates and whatever else may be less than good in a particular mix. at this point I'm comfortable assuming they are all "safe enough" having not exceeded a reasonable shelf life (in which case I wouldn't want to use ANY brand). I'm keeping a reef tank not raising my first born in it. If a clown fish lives 18yrs instead of 20 due to salt choice hope the good lord forgives us.
I have not switched salt mix in the 8 + yrs my tanks have been running. I do keep calcium, mag and alk constant and consider that important,particularly alkalinity .Since I do frequent water changes keeping the salt constant makes it easier to manage supplemental dosing. Occasionally testing newly mixed saltwater helps too.
I consider it an obligation to provide the best care of which I am capable to the animals I keep. However, I doubt a fish would loose 10% of it's life or a reef tank will be more or less vibrant due to a choice of salt mix.
I consider it an obligation to provide the best care of which I am capable to the animals I keep. However, I doubt a fish would loose 10% of it's life or a reef tank will be more or less vibrant due to a choice of salt mix.
Do you still supplement Ca and Mg in your Instant Ocean before you do your water change?
Yes, although it is less or perhaps not needed like it was before. I still do not measure anything in it and add the same amounts, roughly, so it is probably just higher in Ca and Mg than before. I do not think levels of either are critical as long as they are not too low.
Yes, although it is less or perhaps not needed like it was before. I still do not measure anything in it and add the same amounts, roughly, so it is probably just higher in Ca and Mg than before. I do not think levels of either are critical as long as they are not too low.
Yogre
Cheesehead Reefer
Do you still supplement Ca and Mg in your Instant Ocean before you do your water change?
Yes, although it is less or perhaps not needed like it was before. I still do not measure anything in it and add the same amounts, roughly, so it is probably just higher in Ca and Mg than before. I do not think levels of either are critical as long as they are not too low.
Thanks, Randy.
I've been doing the same for a while now. The couple of batches of IO that I did test recently came out with Mg at about 1200ppm, lower than I target in my reef, so a little supplementation makes sense to me. Even with a little supplementation, IO is pretty reasonably priced.
For me, reasonable price=better able to keep up a regular water change routine.
progman2000
New member
Reef Crystals here
Ralph ATL
Formerly mysterybox
Do you still supplement Ca and Mg in your Instant Ocean before you do your water change?
Yes, although it is less or perhaps not needed like it was before. I still do not measure anything in it and add the same amounts, roughly, so it is probably just higher in Ca and Mg than before. I do not think levels of either are critical as long as they are not too low.
I've done most of them, the longest being Tropic Marine Pro & Seachem Reef.
Randy, I am switching to IO, but I have a high usage on Calcium & Alk due to SPS, etc.
can you give me a starting point on how to dose calcium & mag to saltwater?
I use 2 part Bulk Reefsupply Soda Ash, Mag Chloride & Sulfide mix, and Calcium Chloride. This is dosed 6 times daily.
So I usually mix 40 gallons of saltwater at 35. Now, if I add Calcium Chloride, me thinks that my salinity will go above 35? So do I make the saltwater mix at 34? Then add some to 35? How much Calcium Chloride & Mag (in liquid form of course) would I need to add to make 40 gallons to raise Calcium & Mag to resonable numbers for Stony Corals? Am I complicating this too much?
Thanks so much!
Ralph
I have used IO and Tropic Marin without any issue. Tropic Marin also comes in a 100lb sack that can save some money.
Differences I have seen between IO and Tropic Marin are TM has lack of dirty film in mix tank. I cleaned this carbonate dirt film out yearly or more when using IO. I usually let salt water tank mix for several days and always keep filled for emergency use. I get a slight green film with TM indicating little nutrients from make up tank getting natural sun. That could be RO too but it is well maintained.
Lately some batch complaints of TM were indicated but I am a bit suspicious of claims. Salt was harder but then granular again.
Differences I have seen between IO and Tropic Marin are TM has lack of dirty film in mix tank. I cleaned this carbonate dirt film out yearly or more when using IO. I usually let salt water tank mix for several days and always keep filled for emergency use. I get a slight green film with TM indicating little nutrients from make up tank getting natural sun. That could be RO too but it is well maintained.
Lately some batch complaints of TM were indicated but I am a bit suspicious of claims. Salt was harder but then granular again.
ChucksReefs
New member
I've been using Instant Ocean for ever 15 yrs. There may be better, but it has always treated tank inhabitants well. Call me a old coot.... I like staying with something that works for me
Am I complicating this too much?
Maybe.
I mix mine to 35 ppt after the additives are in, but whether it is a bit above or a bit below in not a big deal, IMO. Calcium and alkalinity additions to new salt water won't noticeably impact salinity. A big magnesium boost would, but not enough to agonize over.
I discuss a lot more on dosing and such here:
An Improved Do-it-Yourself Two-Part Calcium and Alkalinity Supplement System
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-02/rhf/index.php
from it:
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-02/rhf/index.php#15
Dosing Instructions
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The dosing instructions are basically the same for each recipe, although any given aquarium will end up using about twice as much of recipe #2 as recipe #1 to add the same amount of calcium and alkalinity.
To initiate dosing, first adjust calcium and alkalinity to roughly their correct ranges. This may require a substantial dose of just the calcium part if calcium is low (e.g., below 380 ppm). I would suggest targeting calcium between 380 and 450 ppm, and alkalinity between 2.5 and 4 meq/L (7-11 dKH; 125-200 ppm calcium carbonate equivalents).
This calculator shows how much of what parts to add in order to boost one or both of the parameters by a certain amount:
Reef chemicals calculator
http://reef.diesyst.com/chemcalc/chem_calc3.html
Then, once things seem roughly correct, select a starting daily dose for routine dosing. Here are some suggested starting doses, but the exact values do not matter much. The suggested doses apply to both recipes.
After a few days of dosing, note whether alkalinity is low, high or on target. Only bother to test alkalinity, not calcium, during this period, because it is much more sensitive than calcium to over- or underdosing. Adjust the dose up or down as necessary to increase or decrease the alkalinity.
Once you have determined the proper dose, continue it until there is a substantial reason to adjust it (such as falling alkalinity as the corals increase in size). When adjusting the dose, raise or lower both of the recipe's parts together.
Resist the temptation to keep jiggering calcium and alkalinity independently. They will need occasional corrections, but that should not be the normal course of dosing unless there are substantial outside influences, such as water changes with a salt mix that does not match the tank's parameters or an error in making the mixes.
Check alkalinity fairly frequently to make sure the dosing continues at a suitable rate. Check it maybe once a week to once a month (or less as you get more experienced with the system and the tank). Check calcium once a month to once every few months to make sure it continues on track.
Remember to add an appropriate amount of Part 3 each time you finish adding a gallon of Parts 1 and 2.
Maybe.
I mix mine to 35 ppt after the additives are in, but whether it is a bit above or a bit below in not a big deal, IMO. Calcium and alkalinity additions to new salt water won't noticeably impact salinity. A big magnesium boost would, but not enough to agonize over.
I discuss a lot more on dosing and such here:
An Improved Do-it-Yourself Two-Part Calcium and Alkalinity Supplement System
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-02/rhf/index.php
from it:
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-02/rhf/index.php#15
Dosing Instructions
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The dosing instructions are basically the same for each recipe, although any given aquarium will end up using about twice as much of recipe #2 as recipe #1 to add the same amount of calcium and alkalinity.
To initiate dosing, first adjust calcium and alkalinity to roughly their correct ranges. This may require a substantial dose of just the calcium part if calcium is low (e.g., below 380 ppm). I would suggest targeting calcium between 380 and 450 ppm, and alkalinity between 2.5 and 4 meq/L (7-11 dKH; 125-200 ppm calcium carbonate equivalents).
This calculator shows how much of what parts to add in order to boost one or both of the parameters by a certain amount:
Reef chemicals calculator
http://reef.diesyst.com/chemcalc/chem_calc3.html
Then, once things seem roughly correct, select a starting daily dose for routine dosing. Here are some suggested starting doses, but the exact values do not matter much. The suggested doses apply to both recipes.
After a few days of dosing, note whether alkalinity is low, high or on target. Only bother to test alkalinity, not calcium, during this period, because it is much more sensitive than calcium to over- or underdosing. Adjust the dose up or down as necessary to increase or decrease the alkalinity.
Once you have determined the proper dose, continue it until there is a substantial reason to adjust it (such as falling alkalinity as the corals increase in size). When adjusting the dose, raise or lower both of the recipe's parts together.
Resist the temptation to keep jiggering calcium and alkalinity independently. They will need occasional corrections, but that should not be the normal course of dosing unless there are substantial outside influences, such as water changes with a salt mix that does not match the tank's parameters or an error in making the mixes.
Check alkalinity fairly frequently to make sure the dosing continues at a suitable rate. Check it maybe once a week to once a month (or less as you get more experienced with the system and the tank). Check calcium once a month to once every few months to make sure it continues on track.
Remember to add an appropriate amount of Part 3 each time you finish adding a gallon of Parts 1 and 2.
:thumbsup:
Good luck.
Good luck.
:thumbsup:
Happy Reefing.
Happy Reefing.
allsps40
New member
I have to change my 2 cents. I am on the fence on this one. I am using H2Ocean now and found the mag was at 1000ppm. Not so good. I have had issues with IO and RC. HW Marine Mix and Reefer and TMPR have been great, no issues. Thinking about trying out Coral Pro but i may go back to HW Reefer.
phillyfishguy
New member
Do you guys get it shipped in or pick it up local?
I buy IO online.
