I have tried twice now to get chaeto to grow. Nitrates are a little high about in the 20's. I put iron in this time and it still dies. Temp is around 79. Ph is 8.2 avg. not too much variance in either. Its a 90 gal tank with a 110 sump that has about 6" of sand (about the same in main tank). Nautalius skimmer. About 90 lbs of rock. The light for the chaeto is the one that is recommended on Melevsreef, 2 of them.
What kills Chaeto???
- Thread starter OneFast3
- Start date
Chad Vossen
New member
does the fuge area have plenty of flow? that might help it.
Plankt0s
Premium Member
If your cheato is in your sump...is there a light on it. In my experience cheato doesnt need alot of flow, I have it in a small fuge with hardly any flow but it does get ALOT of light. I also purposly overfeed my tank to make sure that it has enough nitrates and phosphates to live.
I have a similar problem, but my cheato does not die, it just never really grows. I started out with a big ball of it as well. It slowly disintegrated to a smaller ball, then stabilized to a small size over the course of a few months.
In the same 55 gallon refugium, I have the dreaded "grape caulerpa" or whatever that bad stuff is, and it is growing like mad. In a month, the whole aquarium will probably be full of it and I will start regular harvesting. I would rather have cheato or some other better alga, but I really want to get some greenery growing down there and this is the only stuff I have been able to grow so far.
Details - 1 year old system, 55 gallon basement refugium, three 35 watt PC-spotlights (melev-suggested-types) on 24/7, low flow. I have tried high flow as well and it didnt seem to help. My nitrates are high (50 ppm approximately) but the tank seems stable (fish and corals healthy for the past 3 months, no deaths). I feed a frozen mix of stuff daily, and dose calcium, alk and magnesium to keep stable levels.
In the same 55 gallon refugium, I have the dreaded "grape caulerpa" or whatever that bad stuff is, and it is growing like mad. In a month, the whole aquarium will probably be full of it and I will start regular harvesting. I would rather have cheato or some other better alga, but I really want to get some greenery growing down there and this is the only stuff I have been able to grow so far.
Details - 1 year old system, 55 gallon basement refugium, three 35 watt PC-spotlights (melev-suggested-types) on 24/7, low flow. I have tried high flow as well and it didnt seem to help. My nitrates are high (50 ppm approximately) but the tank seems stable (fish and corals healthy for the past 3 months, no deaths). I feed a frozen mix of stuff daily, and dose calcium, alk and magnesium to keep stable levels.
graveyardworm
Premium Member
Cheato in my experience grows better with higher amounts of light. So if you have nitrates, are changing water regularly or dosing iron, and feeding fish then the problem is your light.
Are you using the indoor spiral compact or the outdoor spotlight PC?
Are you running the light 24/7? If so I would suggest alowing for a dark period, plants have adapted over millions of years to grow with a dark period, and there are some functions ( respiration ) which happen almost entirely during the dark period, and are necessary for good plant health.
Are you using the indoor spiral compact or the outdoor spotlight PC?
Are you running the light 24/7? If so I would suggest alowing for a dark period, plants have adapted over millions of years to grow with a dark period, and there are some functions ( respiration ) which happen almost entirely during the dark period, and are necessary for good plant health.
I have two of the specific PC spotlight bulbs that Melev recommended. 5100K I think. I recently added another bulb that is a lot yellower. I dont know if these are indoor or outdoor bulbs. By their ruggedized look, I would guess outdoor. I have about 100 watts of PC light focused on roughly 2/3 of my 55 gallon fuge, and visually the light is as bright as my main display. Incidentally, my acros are growing fine so evidently no lack of light there either.
I have been running the lights 24/7. I'll start allowing a dark period, watch the caulerpa, and see what happens. I personally havent had any bad experiences with my caulerpa, but from what I read I would prefer to reduce my use of it for the obvious reasons.
I have been running the lights 24/7. I'll start allowing a dark period, watch the caulerpa, and see what happens. I personally havent had any bad experiences with my caulerpa, but from what I read I would prefer to reduce my use of it for the obvious reasons.
luvstns726
New member
I've worked with Chaeto for years, and it can be mysterious at times.
Here's a suggestion I have found useful. Turn down the flow to low, and after a few hours look at the baseline pearling rate (oxygen bubbles produced). Then try some things, watching the pearling rate.
If nitrates are high, and I presume you have plenty of phosphate, you could have a pH/Co2 issue. I won't say "carbon shortage" because some scientists get upset since these plants presumably take up carbonates, but I have seen occasions when covering the top of the tank tightly will promptly increase the pearling rate. This is likely if your pH is 8.6 or so, in the presence of non-limiting nitrate, phosphate, and iron. If not co2, it's probably the light; if not light, it's probably allelopathy but you can prove that by counting pearling.
In any event, using the "counting bubble" technique will enable you to determining a light or nutrient limiting factor very quickly- within a few hours.
I have seen organic carbon stop chaeto growth, presumably due to nutrient limitation by bacterial competition, but possibly allelopathy (bacterial competitive toxins). I think this does occur at times with excessive phosphate or organic carbon inputs. What's your pH and feeding schedule?
Here's a suggestion I have found useful. Turn down the flow to low, and after a few hours look at the baseline pearling rate (oxygen bubbles produced). Then try some things, watching the pearling rate.
If nitrates are high, and I presume you have plenty of phosphate, you could have a pH/Co2 issue. I won't say "carbon shortage" because some scientists get upset since these plants presumably take up carbonates, but I have seen occasions when covering the top of the tank tightly will promptly increase the pearling rate. This is likely if your pH is 8.6 or so, in the presence of non-limiting nitrate, phosphate, and iron. If not co2, it's probably the light; if not light, it's probably allelopathy but you can prove that by counting pearling.
In any event, using the "counting bubble" technique will enable you to determining a light or nutrient limiting factor very quickly- within a few hours.
I have seen organic carbon stop chaeto growth, presumably due to nutrient limitation by bacterial competition, but possibly allelopathy (bacterial competitive toxins). I think this does occur at times with excessive phosphate or organic carbon inputs. What's your pH and feeding schedule?
I have a junky pH test kit which reads approximately 8.2, and I have not tracked my pH over the course of the day. Nitrated read high, but my phosphates read less then 0.25 ppm by test kit.
I feed every day or every other day, a small cube of a mishmash of stuff that roughly resembles the "Borneman recipe".
I feed every day or every other day, a small cube of a mishmash of stuff that roughly resembles the "Borneman recipe".
luvstns726
New member
If you try closing up the tank top, let us know if it works.
garymcgrath
New member
luvstns726,
Could you describe what you mean by "pearling rate"? How do you determine it?
Could you describe what you mean by "pearling rate"? How do you determine it?
graveyardworm
Premium Member
Wondering the same thing. What the heck you talkin bout.
flemingljr
New member
does a high pearling rate mean there's excess carbon? what's good, high or low pearling rate?
bigB
Frag Farmer
i think he means the small oxygen bubbles that start to form in the cheato as it starts to grow when the lights are on. kinda like when you have a algae problem in your tank and as the light is on longer during the day you start to see tons of bubbles in the algae. plants let off oxygen.
You know, I had a difficult time with chaeto in a first couple of months - it became dark and disintegrated into a small pieces, floating in the tank - really annoying. Then the top portion started to grow.
No relation to light (tried sunlight, 6,500K, 4100K, now have one portion under Melev's flood light, but soft white, ~2,300K, will see), may be 4,100K 13W was not so good as 27W 6,500K
.
No relation to pH, alkalinity (I have more than one nano-tank), when nitrates above 20 ppm, phosphates 0.5 ppm - grows faster, than with nitrates 80 ppm and phosphates 1 ppm (had this for some time, could be other unaccounted factors too).
Give it a time, or light, or phosphates...
One more thing - the ball of chaeto grows better for me, when it's loosely packed. In deep tank or bucket the bottom portions started disintegrate again. Reduced light? But I tried adding side light too. Who knows.
No relation to light (tried sunlight, 6,500K, 4100K, now have one portion under Melev's flood light, but soft white, ~2,300K, will see), may be 4,100K 13W was not so good as 27W 6,500K
. No relation to pH, alkalinity (I have more than one nano-tank), when nitrates above 20 ppm, phosphates 0.5 ppm - grows faster, than with nitrates 80 ppm and phosphates 1 ppm (had this for some time, could be other unaccounted factors too).
Give it a time, or light, or phosphates...
One more thing - the ball of chaeto grows better for me, when it's loosely packed. In deep tank or bucket the bottom portions started disintegrate again. Reduced light? But I tried adding side light too. Who knows.
Rod Cobble
New member
I was actually thinking of adding a spot of green to my main aquarium. Was thinking of Chaeto. Would you guys recommend this? or should it only be grown in sump? also need to know do Tangs eat it? If not chaeto, what?
Thanks,
Rod
Thanks,
Rod
Rod: Chaeto is unsightly in the tank, and should be contained by something, like mesh or soap holder with suction cap, or it may float and interfere with powerheads and corals.
Green spot in the tank:
the easy way, IMHO, could be using neon-green candycane - trouble-free and bright, or green star polyps - they are looking like grass, onlt they should be prevented from encroaching the LR around, using principle of campfire: coral is placed onto LR rubble, it starts to grow onto it, replace the last with the new LR rubble or the shell/rock from a dollar store. And you will have a frags for trade or giving away.
The macroalgae way - I had seen very beautiful tanks' photos with feathery caulerpa, but: it it starts to grow on the porous rock, it will be very difficult, if not impossible, to eradicate. Tried myself - it doesn't grow in my tanks at all.
Green spot in the tank:
the easy way, IMHO, could be using neon-green candycane - trouble-free and bright, or green star polyps - they are looking like grass, onlt they should be prevented from encroaching the LR around, using principle of campfire: coral is placed onto LR rubble, it starts to grow onto it, replace the last with the new LR rubble or the shell/rock from a dollar store. And you will have a frags for trade or giving away.
The macroalgae way - I had seen very beautiful tanks' photos with feathery caulerpa, but: it it starts to grow on the porous rock, it will be very difficult, if not impossible, to eradicate. Tried myself - it doesn't grow in my tanks at all.
