Which Copper
- Thread starter Seagars
- Start date
jd371
New member
TTM is the best way because your not using any chemicals, but if you can't do it with that method use chelated copper like found in Coppersafe, it's much easier on the fish. Be sure to use only an API test kit if using chelated copper. Raise the copper in the QT to therapeutic levels over a couple of days.
If using copper, remember that the therapeutic dose must be maintained through daily testing for a minimum of 30 days. I do not recommend copper.
scooter31707
New member
tank transfer method
scooter31707
New member
What he said.
ThRoewer
New member
+1
Whenever I used copper in the past I lost the fish.
I had actually more success "curing" ich with doing nothing (and being very selective with the fish I bought in the first place) than with copper. And back in those days there were not many alternatives mentioned in hobbyist books. Copper was the go-to cure for all and everything, and of course all the other commercial products that never worked...
These days my treatment of choice for actual outbreaks is usually hyposalinity, but with tiny fish and as prophylaxis for new fish I use TTM as well.
The only cases where I could see copper as the only choice would be velvet infections of fish sensitive to Chloroquine.
CoralsAddiction
Active member
I've had great results with copper. I've stuck with one medication (Coppersafe) and have learned the ideal levels to effectively treat my livestock. Its use should not be discouraged. It saved many of my fishes. It gave them a second chance at life. That's the most important thing. Some of the things said about copper are not always true.
For example, if I am not mistaken it was Joyce Wilkerson in her book "Clownfishes" who wrote that copper caused infertility in clowns. I've treated my breeding of pair of true percula Clownfishes with copper and they are still laying eggs.
For example, if I am not mistaken it was Joyce Wilkerson in her book "Clownfishes" who wrote that copper caused infertility in clowns. I've treated my breeding of pair of true percula Clownfishes with copper and they are still laying eggs.
CoralsAddiction
Active member
Most experienced hobbyists know what Quality Marine is. They use copper in their system. Granted they probably use lower levels of copper due to additional UV protection in their systems, they nonetheless deem it safe enough with their business on the line. It just goes to show copper should be used carefully.
http://www.qualitymarine.com/FAQ#Do-you-use-copper-in-your-system?---
Due to the inevitable stress from the transportation process, certain species are more likely to be susceptible to different diseases. To combat this we use a very high level of Ultraviolet Sterilization as well as a trace level of copper on our system. This combination is very efficient in effectively reducing the amount of bacteria and protozoan infections. We also take special care to isolate species sensitive to copper medication by housing them in separate untreated systems.
http://www.qualitymarine.com/FAQ#Do-you-use-copper-in-your-system?---
Due to the inevitable stress from the transportation process, certain species are more likely to be susceptible to different diseases. To combat this we use a very high level of Ultraviolet Sterilization as well as a trace level of copper on our system. This combination is very efficient in effectively reducing the amount of bacteria and protozoan infections. We also take special care to isolate species sensitive to copper medication by housing them in separate untreated systems.
CoralsAddiction
Active member
Strongly disagree with this. Copper kills ich and velvet. If one isn't sure which one it is then copper is a good way to go.
CoralsAddiction
Active member
The important thing to realize is that cost and convenience play significant roles in ones decision in selecting a treatment. In many cases, copper fits the bill. Other methods can be cost and space prohibiting in which case many hobbyists can just sadly flush their fishes down the toilet rather than going through the trouble of finding CP or TTM. If copper is that easily available and effective against crypto and velvet then what's the point of discouraging it's use? Not everyone is perfect and a fish hero as much as we would like. Doing something instead of nothing is better. So please for the good of the hobby let's not do it.
ThRoewer
New member
I have actually found that sometimes doing nothing can be better for the fish than breaking out the meds at the slights sign of ich - I witnessed many fish beating ich without any further interaction from my end than feeding them well.
The real risk is misdiagnosing something more sinister for ich - which is unfortunately quite common and even happened to me.
I personally stay clear of copper sulfate because in the past I've only made bad experiences with it. I've never tried chelated copper though.
I would just be too lazy to measure copper levels twice a day when on the other hand checking the salinity of a hyposalinity tank with a refractometer is just a second affair.
Cryptocaryon is in my experience usually more of a nuisance than a serious thread, and if it gets out oh hand and I have to treat it, I prefer hyposalinity or TTM.
Copper has most certainly it's value in treating Amyloodinium infections on fish intolerant to CP, but there have been Amyloodinium strains found to be immune to copper at levels that would do the most copper tolerant fish in.
In the past copper was the go-to catch all cure and if you are not sure what you have to treat it may actually be still an option. I just don't think it is the best option in most cases.
As for Joyce Wilkerson, I have her clownfish book and there are many things in it that I do not agree with. One of them is that you need rotifers for raising clownfish larva. I've raised thousands of percula, ocellaris and clarkii that were raised entirely with brine shrimp and frozen Cyclops.
The statement that copper causes sterility may very well be another unfounded myth that lacks any scientific basis.
The real risk is misdiagnosing something more sinister for ich - which is unfortunately quite common and even happened to me.
I personally stay clear of copper sulfate because in the past I've only made bad experiences with it. I've never tried chelated copper though.
I would just be too lazy to measure copper levels twice a day when on the other hand checking the salinity of a hyposalinity tank with a refractometer is just a second affair.
Cryptocaryon is in my experience usually more of a nuisance than a serious thread, and if it gets out oh hand and I have to treat it, I prefer hyposalinity or TTM.
Copper has most certainly it's value in treating Amyloodinium infections on fish intolerant to CP, but there have been Amyloodinium strains found to be immune to copper at levels that would do the most copper tolerant fish in.
In the past copper was the go-to catch all cure and if you are not sure what you have to treat it may actually be still an option. I just don't think it is the best option in most cases.
As for Joyce Wilkerson, I have her clownfish book and there are many things in it that I do not agree with. One of them is that you need rotifers for raising clownfish larva. I've raised thousands of percula, ocellaris and clarkii that were raised entirely with brine shrimp and frozen Cyclops.
The statement that copper causes sterility may very well be another unfounded myth that lacks any scientific basis.
I disagree that copper is ever a good way to go. So we will have to just agree to disagree.
CoralsAddiction
Active member
That's fine. One of my reasons for use of copper is that it's better than doing nothing. So definitely agree to disagree respectfully
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