Why scare newcomers into using dry rock?

[roosterchef]

I cast my vote for at least some live rock. Last time I did a build, the daily hours-long observation of all the little critters, most good, some bad, was immensely entertaining for me as well as my family. In fact, after some of that diversity died off (always does) and I was putting the target specimens into the tank, I could take pride in keeping my target corals etc alive, but the tank attracted a lot less of that "sitting and staring, nose to the glass" from my family, and eventually from me as well.

But I think personality plays into this decision a lot. Me, I don't get much satisfaction from the whole "look how much my acro has grown with my lights and skimming etc etc" kind of thing. I LOVE the biology side of it. Any thread starting with "help me ID this . . ." is an instant read for me. That's my personality.

That said, I did have to battle a big-time aiptasia outbreak about 1 year into the tank. That wasn't fun, and though I won some battles, I never totally won that war. But would I trade off not having the former for being safe from the latter? Tough call.

But one I have to make soon, when I start my re-entry. Love this discussion, thanks to all of you for sharing your perspective. Much to think about.

-Jim

 

[CuzzA]

Why scare newcomers into using dry rock?

I cast my vote for at least some live rock. Last time I did a build, the daily hours-long observation of all the little critters, most good, some bad, was immensely entertaining for me as well as my family. In fact, after some of that diversity died off (always does) and I was putting the target specimens into the tank, I could take pride in keeping my target corals etc alive, but the tank attracted a lot less of that "sitting and staring, nose to the glass" from my family, and eventually from me as well.

But I think personality plays into this decision a lot. Me, I don't get much satisfaction from the whole "look how much my acro has grown with my lights and skimming etc etc" kind of thing. I LOVE the biology side of it. Any thread starting with "help me ID this . . ." is an instant read for me. That's my personality.

That said, I did have to battle a big-time aiptasia outbreak about 1 year into the tank. That wasn't fun, and though I won some battles, I never totally won that war. But would I trade off not having the former for being safe from the latter? Tough call.

But one I have to make soon, when I start my re-entry. Love this discussion, thanks to all of you for sharing your perspective. Much to think about.

-Jim

Unless you're the guy posting, "ID This" and the answers are, "monti or zoa eating nudibranch or Acro eating flatworms or dude I hate to break it to you, but those are red bugs." HAHAHAHA

All kidding aside.

That's what is great about this hobby. So many different ways to do things. The creative ingenuity is never lacking. We tackle every topic from plumbing, chemistry, electricity, weights and measures, light output right down to par ratings, biology, carpentry, etc, etc. the list goes on. And we're rewarded in many different ways, from being excited about finding new life in a tank to taking a chance on ugly brown acros and they turn into some of the most beautiful things in the world.

Good luck on getting back in. I wish I never put it off for so long.

This has turned out to be a great thread.... Respectful and informative on both sides of the debate. ;-)

 

[Nanook]

I have seen success with both types of rock, but prefer live rock as I like the little hitchhikers that come in on it. The cost factor is not an issue as LiveAquaria sells their premium, select Fiji rock on sale frequently at a nice sale price...right now it is on sale for $74.99 for 45 pounds.

http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/prod_display.cfm?c=393+397&pcatid=397

 

[Zeal0t]

In all honesty, I like dry rock because I enjoy watching it mature and color up. Just a part of the whole experience.

 

[mandarin_goby]

I have seen success with both types of rock, but prefer live rock as I like the little hitchhikers that come in on it. The cost factor is not an issue as LiveAquaria sells their premium, select Fiji rock on sale frequently at a nice sale price...right now it is on sale for $74.99 for 45 pounds.

http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/prod_display.cfm?c=393+397&pcatid=397

$68 to ship...ouch! Still better at less than $4 a lb when my local LFS sells live rock for $7 a lb.

Then you have dry rock, 50 lbs for $95 and free ship:

http://www.reefcleaners.org/aquarium-store/florida-reef-rock-50lbs-free-shipping

 

[ktownhero]

$68 to ship...ouch! Still better at less than $4 a lb when my local LFS sells live rock for $7 a lb.

Then you have dry rock, 50 lbs for $95 and free ship:

http://www.reefcleaners.org/aquarium-store/florida-reef-rock-50lbs-free-shipping

That's for base rock, though some of the tanks pictured there do look great.

 

[mandarin_goby]

Yes, base rock/dry rock. Isn't it the same? Honest question. I've bought some and now you can't tell which of my rock was dry and which was live.

 

[jeperry3]

My earlier post came off a little more crotchety than I intended.

As others have stated it comes down to personality and personal choice.

Both can yield beautiful and enjoyable results. Me, I like a few weeds in my garden. Gives me something to do.

 

[Pigpen17]

My earlier post came off a little more crotchety than I intended.

As others have stated it comes down to personality and personal choice.

Both can yield beautiful and enjoyable results. Me, I like a few weeds in my garden. Gives me something to do.

That's perfectly stated right there.

 

[ca1ore]

Haven't really bothered to read through all the posts here, but I've always tended to view this as primarily a cost consideration. Not sure that X months down the road dry versus live really makes much difference - either in terms of biological diversity or prevention of pests. Regardless, I tend to use a combination of both. For rock that will be buried in the sand, or make up the bottom layer of the aquascape, it seems rather pointless to spend a premium on live, so I go with dry. For rock that will be displayed, I go with live because I'm not patient, want to give algae like coraline a leg up on GHA, and want the bio-diversity immediately.

 

[flipstyle72]

because of the reasons you pointed out, is exactly why i went with 100% live rock. There was no waiting to see marine wildlife. My tank has barely thing in it still and it's awesome to just sit and watch everything. Not to mention I had a spike and drop in ammonia in 1 week and had no problems. Tampa Bay Saltwater even sent me quite a few items the 2nd week in and everything is flourishing... sponges, rock flower anemones, gorgonians, a starfish and a couple corals.

live rock is more expensive sure, but i'd go as far as telling a newbie to just wait and save up than settle for something cheaper. Unless they absolutely wanted to start rock from scratch.

 

[Fade2White12]

The definitive word here is "newcomers."

My recommendation has much less to do with costs and much more to do with pests. This is easily one of the most challenging aspects of the hobby for newbies and can quickly lead to new reefers giving up prematurely. For someone starting a tank for the first time, I suggest dry in most instances.

For those of us with significant experience, I really do love live rock for the diversity of life it can inject into our systems. For me, it is one of the most interesting and rewarding parts of the hobby - just as much as the fish and coral that we keep. But at the same time, I view my reef as a work of art and extension of my style and personality. There are aquascaping options with dry rock that simply are not possibly with most available live rock. So for my new rimless setup, I'm going with almost all dry rock and adding the pieces I currently have in my nano.

 

[roosterchef]

Good luck on getting back in. I wish I never put it off for so long.

Thanks. Still working on the wife. 14 years, she still remembers how much I spent last time around.

Now if anyone can tell me how to convince a non-reefer that it's WORTH $900 to buy a new controller and those old lights in the garage aren't "the right ones" anymore, and . . .

-Jim

 

[shesacharmer]

I hope the hobby has not become too sterile.

Forgive the rantings of a soon to be old fart.

Funny you mention this. I was just reading a long post by Paul B, who if you don't know is one of the Geezers in this hobby. He contends that most people's tanks ARE too sterile and there is great benefit to the experience (human and fish) by adding natural salt water, live rock, and sea mud to the system for the diversity in micro-organisms. He also advocates feeding live food to your fish. I feel like our tanks have gotten too far from natural to be healthy for long lived fish (10+ years). It's sort of like watching kids walk to school...oh sorry...they don't do that anymore either. :thumbsup:

 

[CuzzA]

Funny you mention this. I was just reading a long post by Paul B, who if you don't know is one of the Geezers in this hobby. He contends that most people's tanks ARE too sterile and there is great benefit to the experience (human and fish) by adding natural salt water, live rock, and sea mud to the system for the diversity in micro-organisms. He also advocates feeding live food to your fish. I feel like our tanks have gotten too far from natural to be healthy for long lived fish (10+ years). It's sort of like watching kids walk to school...oh sorry...they don't do that anymore either. :thumbsup:

The Paul B. Geezer thread is a great read... But given the pictures, TOTM's and success rate of keeping many marine organisms that were once impossible, not only alive but to thrive, I think speaks volumes to the fact that better technology, better equipment, better husbandry, better pest prevention and removal, etc. is better for our inhabitants. From my readings of tanks back in the day, many of the inhabitants people owned were just rentals.

 

[Billybatz9]

CuzzA, please give me a list of all the corals and fish/starfish that you have in you tank. Your tank is probably the most colorful tank I have seen on here so far. I would love to replicate my tank like yours. Also, why do you wish you went bigger? What size tank is yours now? Oh, and what did you use to glue your dry rock together?

I am just starting out.

 

[CuzzA]

CuzzA, please give me a list of all the corals and fish/starfish that you have in you tank. Your tank is probably the most colorful tank I have seen on here so far. I would love to replicate my tank like yours. Also, why do you wish you went bigger? What size tank is yours now? Oh, and what did you use to glue your dry rock together?

I am just starting out.

Wow, thank you. Funny, you should say that as I keep telling myself I need more COLOR!!! Hahaha. I don't have a list of my inhabitants, but it's something I've been meaning to do. I'll try to put something together and post it here. I think one of the important things to keep in mind when determining coral placement is contrasting colors. Also, if it doesn't fluoresce I don't buy it. Often times there are corals of the same species but with a different color morph. Just my personal preference.

As far as tank size it's a 90 gallon. Once I put the rocks in I quickly realized there wasn't much depth and so I wished I went 120 (48x24). Then as the addiction grew I knew I would be getting a bigger tank and so I added my 3 tangs. They have plenty of room right now, but that won't last and I would really love a Blonde Naso with streamers and an Achilles, also I want a rather large school of Anthias. So, while I'm not 100% yet, I'm leaning toward a 96x24x24 240 gallon. I have the room, so why not, right?

I glued the rocks together with Portland cement. It looked odd for a couple months, but now you can hardly tell.

Thanks again for the compliment.

 

[Billybatz9]

Wow, thank you. Funny, you should say that as I keep telling myself I need more COLOR!!! Hahaha. I don't have a list of my inhabitants, but it's something I've been meaning to do. I'll try to put something together and post it here. I think one of the important things to keep in mind when determining coral placement is contrasting colors. Also, if it doesn't fluoresce I don't buy it. Often times there are corals of the same species but with a different color morph. Just my personal preference.

As far as tank size it's a 90 gallon. Once I put the rocks in I quickly realized there wasn't much depth and so I wished I went 120 (48x24). Then as the addiction grew I knew I would be getting a bigger tank and so I added my 3 tangs. They have plenty of room right now, but that won't last and I would really love a Blonde Naso with streamers and an Achilles, also I want a rather large school of Anthias. So, while I'm not 100% yet, I'm leaning toward a 96x24x24 240 gallon. I have the room, so why not, right?

I glued the rocks together with Portland cement. It looked odd for a couple months, but now you can hardly tell.

Thanks again for the compliment.

Thanks for the reply. Great work you have been doing. Definitely something you don't see evryday. I love your stand too I saw it on another thread you made.

 

[inetmug]

No fears, just simple math, or devotion to the preservation of reefs.

My other guess, is with the explosion of tanks, GOOD quality live rock became hard to come by, and like in any hobby that has an explosion, there are those that choose to thrive on it, selling substandard product to the unsuspecting.


cuzza, simply amazing tank. It's all in the know, not in the wallet.

 

[Kungpaoshizzi]

Between red flatworms and bristle worms I'll take the lower cost and clean slate any day.

Everything creature wise can be bought now anyways. I feel a lot more secure about the health of my tank if there's no doubts on possible-pests.