200g in-wall project officially started

[Benny Z]

i acquired ken's old 200g recently (again, thanks!) and am going to be putting it in-wall in my basement with a fish room behind the tank.

this thread will be the record of the project, but more importantly, a place for me to ask for your help along the way. this is my first big reef aquarium, so i'd like to gleen from your experiences as much as possible.

i plan to put a bar in front of the aquarium on the display side, so i wanted to build a taller bar-height stand than the stand that ken was using. standard bar height is 42".

with my dad's help (who willingly drives 45 miles one way each time to help - thanks dad!), we have used the diy large tank stand instructions linked from rc to begin building a similar stand. since this will be in-wall, there is no need for cosmetic panels and doors, so we're just building the frame. i plan to attach the drywall for the front wall directly to the stand. instead of using 6 posts as done in the article, we are using 8 for added peace of mind. the top railing will be the long 4x4s you see in the pic and we will use 2x4s for the base railing to tie the bottom together. a sheet of 3/8" ply will top the frame and will hang over 6" off the back side for a shelf behind the tank.

let me know what you think. i'll take pics of the location the tank will be in tomorrow when it's light. my digicam doesn't like fake light.

 

[sir_thunderbird]

Benny those look like the lincoln logs i used to play with when i was a kid . Those pre- cut rabbit and dado joints look awesome nice work . One question though. Your choice for the deck? 3/8 plywood? Are you going to seal/paint that to keep the back 6" shelf from delaminating? I work in the construction industry and have seen alot of plywood(the smaller thickness the worse problems) become warpeled and delaminated from just the slightest hint of moisture!As for your digicam pics. Ask Santa for a new one this X-mas or maybe even Mrs. Sanata. And oh i have an email into a plastics comp. about some LuciteL here in Peoria. Will keep you updated ! Keep up the good work !!!

 

[Benny Z]

i actually have not yet purchased the plywood. that's what the diy article had said to use, so that's just what i planned to use. what would be a better choice?

also, what would you recommend as a sealer to paint the entire thing with when done?

thanks for the input!

 

[brad23]

Cool those look like some really nice cuts.

 

[Horace]

Its going to be crazy man . You have a hell of a project ahead of you. It should be pretty awesome when its done though. How many hours have you allocated to buffing the tank scratches? LOL

 

[rick rottet]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6242714#post6242714 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Benny Z
i actually have not yet purchased the plywood. that's what the diy article had said to use, so that's just what i planned to use. what would be a better choice?

also, what would you recommend as a sealer to paint the entire thing with when done?

thanks for the input!

just tossing out ideas for your consideration...
epoxy paint???
marine grade varnish???

 

[sir_thunderbird]

Well Benny from what i can see thats treated lumber correct? Firstly lets hope its stays straight when its drying out . I'd get it assebled as soon as possible . Would get some weight onto it in its erected position. (ie, cinder blocks, weights anythings heavy) i'd let it det for a weet before trying to paint it with anything . Thus giving the chemicals time to evaporate properly. This should ensure you have a good bonding surface that dry and will let your primer , paint or stain soak into the pores of the wood. As for the deck ! The 3/8 plywood is fine but i would reccommend maybe secureing a 1x6 treated board to the underside of the back overhang. Screwing it periodically and sealing the edges of the plywood thouroughly. This will also give it a little more stregth as well . I am assumming the plywood is treated right? Lowes and Menards sells paints and stains for treated material . Not familiar with the prices though. Since we are talking about stands (thanks for getting my wheels turning) Im drawing up some plans for a stand that has no center brace and a very special suprise for the access to the sumps . Get this ... the price ... 0 dollars... solid oak ...know thats priceless ....will be doing a thread like yours soon enough .... Keep the updates coming ....

 

[Benny Z]

i don't plan to assemble the stand until tuesday at the earliest. i still need to buy one more 4x4 (yes, pressure treated pine) to make the top side rails. when i bought the 4x4s initially i did not plan to add the second brace in the middle of the stand, so i am one short. that, and tuesday is the next day my dad will be able to come to bloomington.

once it's together i'll put the empty stand on top of it. do you think that will be enough weight to keep it straight? this thing is going to be so solid that i have a hard time imagining it would warp once it's together... but then i don't ever really work with wood.

 

[sir_thunderbird]

I think the problem with treated wood is it isnt kiln dried as good as standard lumber. The problems i have had and they are numerous is that the wood dries out to fast . I have seen treated material twist , turn and curl in a day or two time. I guess it has to do alot with the quality of lumber as well . and if you 200 g is a couple hundred pounds im sure that will be plenty . It will be evenly distributed as well . -LOL- Man my last post had alot of typo's huh , need spell check here .....OY!!

 

[BradL.]

I agree with the others.4x4s will twist. Your drywall will likely crack at best.

 

[Benny Z]

so i shouldn't attach the drywall directly to the stand?

 

[sir_thunderbird]

Benny its should be fine as long as you let it dry out thouroughly before attaching any drywall to it

 

[Benny Z]

someone suggested i use durock (cement backerboard) instead of drywall to cover any moisture concerns. think that's a wise idea?

 

[sir_thunderbird]

Thats an awesome idea....just make sure you prime both sides and edges concrete products like to dry moisture from the air . Wise choice not neccessarily though in my opinion . Do you have all your LR for this procect yet ??

 

[sir_thunderbird]

project ....(groan)

 

[Benny Z]

ok, next question...

time to plan out the overflow design for the tank. currently there are three drain holes at the top of the tank with up-turned filter nozzles attached.

i'm considering making an overflow box the full length of the tank with the plumbing behind the tank like what is shown in this thread - http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=473152&perpage=25&pagenumber=1

am i going to see large benefits with a skimmer box as opposed to three up-turned tubes across the back? ...or is it not worth the effort? i'm getting mixed opinions on this and would like your input.

if i would benefit from a full-length box overflow, where can i find an 80" long sheet of black or smoked acrylic?

 

[rick rottet]

I am running upturned pipes in my LR vat and horizontal overflows in my prop tanks. I think there is a benefit from a full length (horizontal) overflow.

The reasoning is that the organics that we want our skimmers to pull out are attracted to anywhere there is an interface between air and water. All the bubbles in a skimmer...and the water surface of our tanks/ sumps. The thinner the layer that can be captured to feed into the skimmer, the more concentrated those organics will be. The skimmer will pull out more gunk with this water than it could with a thicker (more diluted) layer. I wouldn't worry about the teeth on the top edge, just a straight edge will give the thinnest layer possible.

Three upturned pipes may be able to flow the same amount of water per hour, but will have to draw a thicker layer to do it (the water level may have to be 1/4" above the rim of the pipes to get adequate flow, where the horizontal wall may only need 1/16" layer or less). The upturned pipes will do a better job than open bulkheads drilled into the back of the tank, but the horizontal overflow wall will do better than both of those options.


US Plastics has acrylic sheet in different colors and tints, as well as other types of plastic, BUT... UPS wont carry anything over five feet long. If you want a continuous piece, it will have to be freighted (expensive). US Plastics will cut it to be able to send UPS, it will just have to be welded back together.

http://www.usplastic.com/catalog/category.asp?catalog_name=USPlastic&Category_Name=62&Page=1

Just follow the links for acrylic, also comes in different thicknesses.

As an alternative, Illini Plastics Supply might be able to help. They are in Champaign.

 

[Benny Z]

Excellent infoââ"šÂ¬Ã‚¦thank you! That pretty much confirms what the plan will beââ"šÂ¬Ã‚¦a solid panel rear wall overflow. About how many GPH flow will I need to create a thin layer of overflow over the 80ââ"šÂ¬Ã‚ long wall?

Now for another issueââ"šÂ¬Ã‚¦the hole openings in the top of the tank. Currently there are three small (and I mean SMALL) openings in the top of the tank. There is no way that I will possibly be able to get a large piece of acrylic into the current openingsââ"šÂ¬Ã‚¦or any large rocks, for that matter. I would like to enlarge the openings, but donââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢t know how big I can safely go. There are also several small holes cut near the perimeter all around the tank. How close to the edge can I safely cut? ââ"šÂ¬Ã‚¦and can I use a standard jigsaw to do this? Iââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢ve never worked with acrylic before.

You can see the current openings inside the blue taped boxes on the front side of the tank (itââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢s sitting on its front). The tape is simply holding up pieces of painters plastic so the darn cats donââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢t go insde.

Also, there is a bulkhead in the center bottom of the tank that really worries me. No idea why itââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢s there. Itââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢s currently got silicone filling the hole, but I donââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢t trust it long term. Can I simply build a small acrylic ââ"šÂ¬Ã…"œboxââ"šÂ¬Ã‚ over the top of this on the inside of the tank? I would build it small enough that the sand and liverock would cover it.

Thanks for the input!

 

[Benny Z]

rick, i found a 48x24 sheet of black acrylic on the site you posted for about $65 shipped. i think i'll go with that. thanks for the link!

 

[rick rottet]

You're welcome.

As for the gph needed to create the overflow, it won't matter. As long as the bulkheads that are installed in the tank (and enclosed by the overflow wall) can handle the flow rate. The wall will only overflow what the pump(s) feed into the tank, which will overflow the wall, gets pumped back, ....

Yeah, it was a little tough getting corals and rock out of that tank due to the size of the openings in the top. Somebody like melev (builds acrylic sumps all the time) or tschopp (diy 500 gallon tank) or david (diy 900 gallon tank) might have a better educated answer for you on how much you can open up the top.

I can't forsee any problem building a little box over that bottom bulkhead... or removing it (if possible) and putting a flat piece over the hole.

Sounds like you've got some good plans. Can't wait to see it full.