Acceptable Levels of Aggression

[fender4string]

So as the title suggests (other than the fact that it would make a sweet name for a metal song) I was wondering what your opinions are on what's considered "acceptable" aggression in a tank.

My tank is an 85 gallon that has a foxface, a blue dot toby, a flame angel, and a convict tang (the inspiration for this thread ). The convict tang is the most boisterous fish I've yet owned in my fairly short time in the hobby . Multiple times daily he and my foxface get into non-physical scuffles that consist of circling one another, minor chase behavior, and nipping lunges without actual contact. The convict is the aggressor. The foxface has always been extremely peaceful (I had a singapore angel that was 1/3 his size who initially picked on him and who he never became even slightly aggressive with) except for with this fish. He also, on occasion will try to intimidate my puffer who just kind of ignores the behavior which is baffling to the tang.

Anyway, I've been considering yanking the tang because I kind of worry about the aggression. The foxface and tang get along probably 75%-85% of the time but I've just never had fish bicker so much. The foxface's health seems to be perfectly fine. The convict has been with him for about 6-8 months and the foxface acts/appears no differently health wise.

Am I just mothering the fish too much :love1: ? Is non-physical, daily aggression ok?

What do you guys think?

 

[velvetelvis]

I think there's a chance that it might eventually wear the weaker fish down. Keep in mind that most animals, including fish, won't begin to show the signs of stress for a long time--it's a survival strategy to try and avoid being picked off by predators that recognize the signs of weakness. By the time the symptoms appear, they've already taken a toll. It may be more stressful than is immediately apparent for the fish to deal with daily confrontations coupled with no means of escape.

 

[chasekwe]

Strange, convicts are a true schooling fish in the wild. They're typically considered one of the more peaceful tangs in the hobby.

Just more evidence that every fish is different.

 

[fender4string]

Yeah I had heard that they were peaceful as well. This one's a little bit more bossy.

 

[fender4string]

No other thoughts huh? I figured that I'd get more reponses to this!

As secondary question I've been playing with the idea of adding one last fish but I'm not sure if it's doable due to possible space issues. Anyway my 2 choices were either a singapore angel or a potter's angel but the concern here is that the flame might be a little aggressive. What do you think?

And just for the sake of asking, I saw a sargassum trigger in a 4 foot tank and was wondering what you guys thought about that? I love the fish but think that it's just a pipe dream for my wee little tank.

Any opinions are welcome!

 

[LukFox]

Honestly I'd probably see how things go. Foxfaces are tough fish and perhaps its venomous spines give it a sense of security. Foxfaces especially can be VERY shy and easily frightened even when it isn't warranted, and if your foxface is acting normally I wouldn't be too worried at this time. Maybe you could try feeding more, though? They're both herbivores in a small-ish tank and perhaps the tang feels its food source is threatened.

I'd probably also go with a Singapore angel over the potter's. The potter might not handle the tang so well, and then there's the flame angel... Could get messy. A Singapore may not be much better though, I'm unsure. Whichever you choose, social acclimation with a little isolation container is a good idea. Ever since I've started using one, I've had 0 aggression upon releasing new fish into the tank. It's wonderful.

And I wouldn't keep a sargassum trigger in a 4 foot tank long term. Minimum 6 foot imo, as they do like to swim~.

 

[fender4string]

Thanks for the tip LukFox. I had a singapore in the past that I loved. She died due to my ignorance of disease and lack of speedy treatment. She was a pretty bossy little thing though.

Yeah the sargassum I was very sketchy on. It's a fish I want to have at some point and figured it was worth asking an opinion on.

The isolation chamber I'm guessing is just a clear plastic box with vents right? Where could I buy/make one?

Also, I feed quite a bit. 2 times per day as a minimum. Usually 3. I had wondered if the tang felt a little cramped and was taking it's frustration out on the foxface. That being said though the tang doesn't pace the glass or act stressed.

 

[LukFox]

I remember Bella. We all make mistakes, and if you do get another I hope it lives for a long time.

For an isolation chamber I just use a kritter keeper that's weighed down with a piece of live rock. It gives the fish something to graze on while they're in there, and the KKs come in different sizes as needed. They're cheap and you can find them pretty much anywhere.

How often do you feed nori?

 

[fender4string]

Good memory

I'll see if the LFS has one of those laying around as that sounds pretty useful.

When I first got the tang I fed nori quite a bit as it wouldn't take anything else. For the past few months though I actually haven't given them any. I feed NLS as their primary food and they look/act fantastic (other than their occasional slap fights ). No HLLE, loss of color, etc. He's actually pretty fat and has that nice yellow top.

Do you think that offering some might lessen the squabbles?

 

[LukFox]

I think if you left some on a clip for grazing throughout the day, it could help.

 

[fender4string]

Ok I'll start giving that a shot. I'll update if I notice any progess on it. Thanks for the tips! Also, what kind of eel is that in your avatar because that thing is incredible.

 

[LukFox]

I hope it works out!

The eel is a small fimbriated moray (Gymnothorax fimbriatus).