Algae Scrubber Basics

[BluScrnOdeth]

Travis32,

I would love to see you're pics, but you need to insert them with an image tag. Here's how to get them to be seen.

[img ]http:thelinkgoesheredotcom[ /img]

Just remove the spaces within the brackets.

Hope this helps.
Aaron

I tried to put one in an img bracket for him, but all i got was this, even when i tried to view it by clicking on the link.

This the 1inch barbed flex hose connector for the overflow or return pump:
<img src="http://i569.photobucket.com/albums/s...9717815452.jpg">

 

[dogstar74]

I think the problem is that the RC collective hive brain knows what the full link is, but when we click it, all we the RC Borg get are the ... in the middle to shorten the link. I think it will have to be done on the Posters end to fix this problem.

Resistance is futile...
We will assimilate your tank into our own...

 

[travis32]

working pics of my ATS.

working pics of my ATS.

Oh. oops. sorry. I'll embed the links. Photobucket is kinda dumb at times (or the user of it.. heh... )

PVC where the canvas is mounted (it's 1" PVC)
<a href="http://s569.photobucket.com/albums/ss134/SchnauzerWauzer/Saltwater%20Aquarium/Sump/?action=view&current=1299785514426.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i569.photobucket.com/albums/ss134/SchnauzerWauzer/Saltwater%20Aquarium/Sump/1299785514426.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

Marineland insump pump (bottom left), I have the valve set to about half flow for this pump. The full flow, seems to cause too much water spray from the PVC slit I cut, even with the enclosure the water will splash the full 11-12" out of the enclosure if I have it on full blast:
<a href="http://s569.photobucket.com/albums/ss134/SchnauzerWauzer/Saltwater%20Aquarium/Sump/?action=view&current=1299785489778.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i569.photobucket.com/albums/ss134/SchnauzerWauzer/Saltwater%20Aquarium/Sump/1299785489778.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

Hose from the pump to the PVC Flex connector (1") I got 9 feet of hose, plus the ball valve, making it about 9.5 feet long. It could be about 3-4 Ft shorter, but this gives me extra to rearrange things over time.
<a href="http://s569.photobucket.com/albums/ss134/SchnauzerWauzer/Saltwater%20Aquarium/Sump/?action=view&current=1299785482155.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i569.photobucket.com/albums/ss134/SchnauzerWauzer/Saltwater%20Aquarium/Sump/1299785482155.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

Encloser and pvc pic:
<a href="http://s569.photobucket.com/albums/ss134/SchnauzerWauzer/Saltwater%20Aquarium/Sump/?action=view&current=1299785442849.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i569.photobucket.com/albums/ss134/SchnauzerWauzer/Saltwater%20Aquarium/Sump/1299785442849.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

wider view of my sump area with the ATS on top of the Eurbrace sump:
<a href="http://s569.photobucket.com/albums/ss134/SchnauzerWauzer/Saltwater%20Aquarium/Sump/?action=view&current=1299785428575.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i569.photobucket.com/albums/ss134/SchnauzerWauzer/Saltwater%20Aquarium/Sump/1299785428575.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

My custom made acryllic box:
<a href="http://s569.photobucket.com/albums/ss134/SchnauzerWauzer/Saltwater%20Aquarium/Sump/?action=view&current=1299732639519.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i569.photobucket.com/albums/ss134/SchnauzerWauzer/Saltwater%20Aquarium/Sump/1299732639519.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

Top down view of box. I drilled a 1 1/4" hole in the bottom for a 1" PVC fitting. I ended up taking this fitting out and replacing it with a straight up down fitting. I ran connected a PVC flex hose connector and ran 8" of 1" hose into the sump so that it would be under water when it drains. This seem to help the noise levels:

<a href="http://s569.photobucket.com/albums/ss134/SchnauzerWauzer/Saltwater%20Aquarium/Sump/?action=view&current=1299732627301.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i569.photobucket.com/albums/ss134/SchnauzerWauzer/Saltwater%20Aquarium/Sump/1299732627301.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

Another view of the acryllic box:

<a href="http://s569.photobucket.com/albums/ss134/SchnauzerWauzer/Saltwater%20Aquarium/Sump/?action=view&current=1299732591211.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i569.photobucket.com/albums/ss134/SchnauzerWauzer/Saltwater%20Aquarium/Sump/1299732591211.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

Test fitting the acryllic box with the protective paper still on it:

<a href="http://s569.photobucket.com/albums/ss134/SchnauzerWauzer/Saltwater%20Aquarium/Sump/?action=view&current=1299717939320.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i569.photobucket.com/albums/ss134/SchnauzerWauzer/Saltwater%20Aquarium/Sump/1299717939320.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

I'll get additional pics of the "green" canvas today. It's getting greener by the day.. This is about the 4th day of it being in operation!!

Enjoy!

 

[BluScrnOdeth]

assimilation complete.

 

[travis32]

My screen after 3 days:
<a href="http://s569.photobucket.com/albums/ss134/SchnauzerWauzer/Saltwater%20Aquarium/Sump/?action=view&current=1300124469463.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i569.photobucket.com/albums/ss134/SchnauzerWauzer/Saltwater%20Aquarium/Sump/1300124469463.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

 

[flare1185]

Would you worry if your acrylic box also form algae?

 

[Coral C's]

How far does the mesh need to be up in the PVC tube? Also do you cap off the other end and the only outlet is the 1/8" slit?

 

[phillyfishguy]

concrete

concrete

I am still in the process but going to design something out of concrete. It will be a waterfall gravity feed from my overflow into either my sump or another tank then sump. Any suggestions? I will also use only one light since I can't use light on both sides since it is concrete.

 

[travis32]

Philly, I think it's key to light both sides, UNLESS. You're doing a long design.

There's some links I watched on this thread of Inland Aquatics turf scrubber setup. They use a horizontal system, with a dump mechanism. When enough water is in the scrubber it changes the balance of the scrubber and flips it. The water drains into their drain system, then, the weight of the new water coming it, lifts the bucket back up. Every 5-10 seconds it dumps and it's only lit from the top.

But, my limited understanding is that horizontal setups need to be long.. as in up to 48" or more.


I believe it's 1 square inch per gallon of water one is wanting to treat. For me, I have 125G tank, 30 gallon sump, minus the fact the sump isnt' completely full, only about half full, and minus sand and rock. I did around a 14" X 9.5" piece of canvas.

Yes, there I took 1" pvc, I got a male threaded fitting. Threaded on one end and the other end the PVC slides (glues into).

I then got a 1" female cap that screws on the end. The water comes out the slit in the middle, quite effectively too. I've noticed a big difference in algae growth on the screen from this morning to this afternoon. I can't believe how fast it's coming in!!! It'll out perform my GFO in a matter of a week!!

The crappy thing is I scrape the glass and within 2-3 hours I have to clean the glass again.

So, this scrubber can't start taking off soon enough!

 

[rysher]

I am still in the process but going to design something out of concrete. It will be a waterfall gravity feed from my overflow into either my sump or another tank then sump. Any suggestions? I will also use only one light since I can't use light on both sides since it is concrete.

how are you going to clean the algae off the concrete so no algae goes back into the water?
algae going back into the water causes yellowing and was the main reason of collapsed/crashed tanks.

 

[Swanwillow]

...there's so much wrong with that.

ATS's always ALWAYS have algae on them. Not all of it is taken off when you scrape it. there's none going back into the water as it grows on the substrate that you designate for it, hence the yellow lights on long timers, specifically cast for nuisance algae. Not free-floating, nothing to 'crash the tank' when you're done.

And collapsed/crashed tanks have nothing to do with algae, and everything to do with the tank simply coming to an end due to multiple factors. It could range from a slow buildup of poor tank husbandry over time (going from water changes 1/week to 1/3 months or so) a sandbed releasing build up nutrients, a skimmer going haywire, stray electricity, so on and so forth.

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

There actually could be some connection between cleaning an ATS in-tank and tank crashes, but it is likely due to other contributing factors. The obvious reason why you do not want to clean in-tank is the re-release of nutrients into the water. The aesthetic reason is yellow water.

I think if you're going to do a waterfall/trough build, don't use concrete. Just buy a large sheet of the plastic canvas (I have one that is 13.5 x 21.5) and cut it in sections and line the trough with it. You will find it much easier to maintain and your results will be the same, if not better.

Also remember that lighting only one side, you must double the square inches. Going anything other than free-hanging vertical, you must also double it. So you need 4 square inches of screen per gallon of system water for a sloped trough.

 

[phillyfishguy]

I was going to be able to take this scrubber off line to clean since I have all the room I need in my basement. I just figured concrete because it looks cool like a real waterfall. I don't have a problem cleaning it because I could just turn a couple ball valves and take it off line. thanks for the comments I am still in the proces of building everthing in my basement now but want to put some sort of algae system into my tank build.

 

[BluScrnOdeth]

I say go for it philly. There is nothing wrong with doing something different than what everyone else keeps telling you is the best way. If no one tried things, we would still be cavemen.

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

Philly / BSOD, I'm not saying it won't work, and that you shouldn't do it. By all means, create and innovate!

My point was that if you are going for function, the tried and true methods do work. If you are going for aesthetics, like a cool looking waterfall in your basement, that's would be a cool idea too. Just remember that the waterfall will need to be covered with a light fixture at close range for most of the time. I suppose you could remove the light fixture when it's off, and enjoy a relaxing waterfall, but you would have to remember to put it back in place during the photoperiod.

Also, as far as the physics of the thing, the concrete would have to have enough rough sand particles in it to give the algae a place to grab on, which I'm sure you though of. Even laying down a thin layer of cement and sprinkling sand on top as it cures would probably do it. Still, you have to remember about weight, fragility, etc. And I'm still curious about how you will 'disconnect' it to clean it. It's the engineer in me, I'm always looking for what could go wrong, so that it won't go wrong. Don't take it personally - just tyring to help!

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

How far does the mesh need to be up in the PVC tube? Also do you cap off the other end and the only outlet is the 1/8" slit?

The mesh only needs to go into the tube far enough to distribute the flow evenly. 1/2" inch is a good rule of thumb. Personally I like fppf's idea of cutting the horizontal pieces out for the top section of tubing to reduce growth close to the slot and even out the flow.

Would you worry if your acrylic box also form algae?

If you are asking if it is of concern that algae will also grow on the acrylic sheild, the answer is no. Since you have to clean the screen each week, whatever algae will grow on the shield can also be easily cleaned off.

This is also one of the reasons why you want to use weld-on for acrylic - you're going to be handling that thing a lot, you might as well make it strong. You want it to last you years, not months. Silicone will hold things in place, but not over the long term, especially when it will be handled quite a bit. Again - it's the engineer in my pointing out the possible issue to be averted.

 

[BluScrnOdeth]

Hey Floyd, have you checked out that link i posted a page back? It talks about the spectrums needed for algae to grow. The thing I still wonder about, is how in the world are we getting ours to grow so well on 2700k light and yet people who have tried "LEDS" have pretty much failed aside from some that used the blue and red leds. red doesnt seem to be needed, but i would think that the blue, royal blue, maybe a deep red, basically anything between 400-700nm would do well.

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

Yes, that article was very interesting. There is one guy on the algae scrubber site that has been building LED scrubbers for a few years, trying several designs, and I think he arrived at the same conclusion. As for the reason for CFLs and T5HO working, I think it has something to do with the lower intensity in the desired bandwidths. One of the reasons why LED may be struggling might be due to the intensity issue, since they are focused both in area served and bandwidth of light projected. The problem is that lumens are for humans. Hey, that rhymes! Radiant intensity is what algae cares about. LEDs may or may not provide the right mix of spectrums. Mixing many LEDs could become cost-prohibitive. Lots to think about. This is why SM says LEDs are for 'experimental purposes' only, and not to use them if you need filtration.

 

[BluScrnOdeth]

yeah, mixing the LEDs could be cost prohibiting. but from what i seen on Cutter's website, you can get them all on one PCB and it didnt cost much since it was on a single PCB. but yeah, i'd hate to order like 10 and end up with some multicolored LEDs that arent good for anything if the experiment fails. And maybe pulling them further back from the algae would help with the intensity as it would be more spread out.

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

That, or use a diffuser. Hard to say what the effect will be. I haven't looked much at the multi-color LED PCBs....just took a peek at the Cree X-lamp MC-E multi-color. it completely misses the 435nm peak and drops off too early before the 675nm peak. Looks like I gotta do it the hard way.