Algae Scrubber Basics

[ali1]

Thanks, i think im finally appreciating zero nitrates.

Chateo and other macro algae never worked for my 400g system

 

[Scrubber_steve]

Thanks, i think im finally appreciating zero nitrates.

Chateo and other macro algae never worked for my 400g system

Looking at you photos it appears that your screen is growing at least one species of ulva, which is a macro. It's exactly what you want growing.
I assume the algae appeared naturally on your screen (not seeded)?
Do you use NSW or synthetic salt when you do water changes? And, have you ever added any proper live rock (the rock that has a variety of live stuff all over it) to your tank?,,, or dry rock only?

 

[ali1]

Nothing fancy. I use IO salt with dry rock from marco.

I’ll have to look into this ulva. Good to know

 

[sensei]

I have a 2 ATS in my 600g system. a 4 and a 2 cube.
the growth in both has been more or less the same.
Yesterday cleaned both after last hasvest 14 days ago and to my surprice the 4 cube did not show any growth and the little algae attached to the screen was completelly White, what could have happened??

Thanks a lot

 

[Nstocks]

Feeding 2 cuber per day and no water changes, for a horizontal scrubber can somebody please confirm my maths:

(Floating scrubber as in a piece of 7 count mesh floating in the sump, supported by egg crate possibly)

21 sq. inch for 1 cube 24 sq. inch for 2 cubes
24 sq. inch * 4 as its horizontal
96 sq. inch * 2 for no water changes
Total is 192 sq. inch

Lights:
12W for 1 cube so 24W for 2 cubes * 1.5 fr horizontal = 36W. (all red 640nm 3W per LED)

Does this seem correct?

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

Yesterday cleaned both after last hasvest 14 days ago and to my surprice the 4 cube did not show any growth and the little algae attached to the screen was completelly White, what could have happened??

Thanks a lot

Did you have a pump failure?

 

[Pandagobyguy]

Can i use something like this Apollo Horticulture Purple Reign 6W MR16 LED https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01AAWXNLA/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_FMMtAbQJSZWMS

Or this ABI 12W Deep Red 660nm https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01H2Y5U4M/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_C9MtAb30A8M2C

7W Desk Clip Plant Grow light. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01ID6A1MO/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_V.MtAbAK2CBGB

18W LED Grow Light https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01MXK4HS0/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_AdNtAbZ405BA3

On a UAS as lighting?

If not are there any cheap leds from amazon that are functional that dont require soldering etc.?

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk

 

[SantaMonica]

the little algae attached to the screen was completelly White, what could have happened

Sounds like detachment. Common for waterfalls, in bigger screen sizes, if the lights can't burn through to the middle of the screen in order to let water in there. The bigger size has no way for water to get to the middle when it's full.

horizontal scrubber

Floating scrubber

Need first to clarify what type it is. A horizontal river is a trough, with a mesh on the bottom, and is 1-sided (the top). A floating one however is usually a bubble upflow, maybe with strings, which would be 2-sided.

 

[Nstocks]

Sounds like detachment. Common for waterfalls, in bigger screen sizes, if the lights can't burn through to the middle of the screen in order to let water in there. The bigger size has no way for water to get to the middle when it's full.



Need first to clarify what type it is. A horizontal river is a trough, with a mesh on the bottom, and is 1-sided (the top). A floating one however is usually a bubble upflow, maybe with strings, which would be 2-sided.

I would be using a horizontalfloating mesh (7 count canvas) with one side only lit from above, approx 10" away. It could possible have fine bubbles from wooden ayirstone, if helps at all.

 

[Nstocks]

Essentially this, except it will be in a black surround (to avoid light spill). Perhaps a powerhead to ensure it always has water passing over it.

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

Can i use something like this Apollo Horticulture Purple Reign 6W MR16 LED https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01AAWXNLA/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_FMMtAbQJSZWMS

Or this ABI 12W Deep Red 660nm https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01H2Y5U4M/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_C9MtAb30A8M2C

7W Desk Clip Plant Grow light. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01ID6A1MO/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_V.MtAbAK2CBGB

18W LED Grow Light https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01MXK4HS0/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_AdNtAbZ405BA3

On a UAS as lighting?

If not are there any cheap leds from amazon that are functional that dont require soldering etc.?

I think any of these would be OK, they each have their subtle differences. What you want to do is match the screen size to the lamp size as best you can. A small lamp might output the wattage/intensity you need, but might be too focused and result in a hotspot.

Sounds like detachment. Common for waterfalls, in bigger screen sizes, if the lights can't burn through to the middle of the screen in order to let water in there. The bigger size has no way for water to get to the middle when it's full.

No, it's not likely to be detachment, I think you're jumping the gun without having all the information.

This is why I asked about the pump failure.

I've had a pump fail for a day or so, sometimes when you have a power glitch a pump won't restart correctly and the impeller will get stuck in a vibration cycle, especially when the water column it is pushing up starts to fall back through the pump while the pump kicks back on. I've had this occur. Sometimes the pump will "catch" and the flow will kick back in, leaving you with a mystery about what happened. So if the flow is lost for a day or two while the lights are running, the screen cooks, and the leftover dried out residue does not allow for algae to easily attach for some reason. IME when this "baking" of the screen happens, you have to soak the screen in vinegar and scrub it down to the canvas and start over with the maturing cycle.

The other way this can happen is a bit of a mystery effect that I refer to as "whiting". This is when you don't have a pump failure, but the algae will just turn stark white very quickly, like overnight (less than 24 hours). I've seen this happen repeatedly with one particular tank and I was not able to come up with an explanation - growth would start out OK, it wasn't over-lit (intensity and duration were not extreme) but a few days in (with just "whispy" green growth, and usually after a harvest, so not thick and light-blocking) the growth would just turn white.

My only fallback was that there might be a particular nutrient level that drops and causes a full inhibition of production, such that the incoming light cannot be adsorbed and the result was a cascading failure of algae cells. Just a theory that fits the facts, but this is so infrequent of an occurrence that I haven't ever been able to nail it down.

@sensei let me know which of the 2 scenarios seems to make sense. Also did anything else happen in this time period? Storms? General power loss? Have nutrients dropped in the system significantly over time?

The last question there - if everything was hunky-dory for a long time and then this suddenly happened, that could also explain it. You may have hit a point where the intensity/duration of the scrubber lights were left alone while the "balance point" of the overall system dropped below that and you had the "whiting" cascade.

 

[sensei]

I have a 2 ATS in my 600g system. a 4 and a 2 cube.
the growth in both has been more or less the same.
Yesterday cleaned both after last hasvest 14 days ago and to my surprice the 4 cube did not show any growth and the little algae attached to the screen was completelly White, what could have happened??

Thanks a lot

No, it's not likely to be detachment, I think you're jumping the gun without having all the information.

This is why I asked about the pump failure.

I've had a pump fail for a day or so, sometimes when you have a power glitch a pump won't restart correctly and the impeller will get stuck in a vibration cycle, especially when the water column it is pushing up starts to fall back through the pump while the pump kicks back on. I've had this occur. Sometimes the pump will "catch" and the flow will kick back in, leaving you with a mystery about what happened. So if the flow is lost for a day or two while the lights are running, the screen cooks, and the leftover dried out residue does not allow for algae to easily attach for some reason. IME when this "baking" of the screen happens, you have to soak the screen in vinegar and scrub it down to the canvas and start over with the maturing cycle.

The other way this can happen is a bit of a mystery effect that I refer to as "whiting". This is when you don't have a pump failure, but the algae will just turn stark white very quickly, like overnight (less than 24 hours). I've seen this happen repeatedly with one particular tank and I was not able to come up with an explanation - growth would start out OK, it wasn't over-lit (intensity and duration were not extreme) but a few days in (with just "whispy" green growth, and usually after a harvest, so not thick and light-blocking) the growth would just turn white.

My only fallback was that there might be a particular nutrient level that drops and causes a full inhibition of production, such that the incoming light cannot be adsorbed and the result was a cascading failure of algae cells. Just a theory that fits the facts, but this is so infrequent of an occurrence that I haven't ever been able to nail it down.

@sensei let me know which of the 2 scenarios seems to make sense. Also did anything else happen in this time period? Storms? General power loss? Have nutrients dropped in the system significantly over time?

The last question there - if everything was hunky-dory for a long time and then this suddenly happened, that could also explain it. You may have hit a point where the intensity/duration of the scrubber lights were left alone while the "balance point" of the overall system dropped below that and you had the "whiting" cascade.

I did not have a pump failure.
something did happened in the chemistry of the system, since I introduced around 12 acropora frags 1 month ago and in the last 15 days I have noticed some burned tips, and it happened to be at the same time that I had this whitening effect, but I did not know until I cleaned the screen last week. I have not been able to know why the burned tips since kh has been stable and it only happened in the new acros, not on the established acroporas.
can this whitening effect of the algae release some toxins in the water?
phosphate increased from 0.02 to 0.07 but I guess is becuase the 4 cube ATS was not working.

please let me know what you think

thanks

 

[Scrubber_steve]

I have a 2 ATS in my 600g system. a 4 and a 2 cube.
the growth in both has been more or less the same.
Yesterday cleaned both after last hasvest 14 days ago and to my surprice the 4 cube did not show any growth and the little algae attached to the screen was completelly White, what could have happened??

Thanks a lot

Its significant that only the 4 cube bleached.
Prior to the cleaning you say algae growth was more of less the same on both scrubber's screens ??? What was the difference between the two? Was there more than one type of algae on either or both screens? What was the algae(s) colors?
How old is (was) the 4 cube screen,,, had it matured?
How is the growth on the 2 cube screen right now?
What differences are there between the two scrubbers in regards to flow & lighting?

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

They're on different tanks, separate systems

 

[Scrubber_steve]

They're on different tanks, separate systems

Where did sensei state that?

quote - "I have a 2 ATS in my 600g system. a 4 and a 2 cube."

?

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

I have super inside information about who he got his scrubbers from

 

[biecacka]

Ooooooh "super inside information!!" :lol:

Corey

 

[Scrubber_steve]

Ooooooh "super inside information!!" :lol:

Corey

Yeh, security clearence needed.

 

[Zoapro91]

My scrubber build with leds on 72 gal custom tank. Built the stand and everything myself. I am doing a floating reef tank I cut rock and siliconed it the the tank with ASI aquarium safe silIcone
I'm using a jabeo 15000 pump and bubble magnus skimmer. Still waiting to add coral

 

[sensei]

Its significant that only the 4 cube bleached.
Prior to the cleaning you say algae growth was more of less the same on both scrubber's screens ??? What was the difference between the two? Was there more than one type of algae on either or both screens? What was the algae(s) colors?
How old is (was) the 4 cube screen,,, had it matured?
How is the growth on the 2 cube screen right now?
What differences are there between the two scrubbers in regards to flow & lighting?

The 600g system was cycled in march 2016
in May 2016 I installed the first 2 cube ATS
in Oct 2016 I installed the other 4 cube ATS

Both are in same tank, different parts of the sump and they have a different sumergible pump. the design of both are exactly the same with the difference that one is bigger. both have same red leds, and both run the same light skedule. I tryed to match both so that one does not outcompete the other one.

they were both growing green hair algae.

here are the pictures of the harvest of both before the bleaching of the 4 cube





Thanks for your answer