Anyone run Bean Animal overflow?

[sinful]

So I ran herbie on my old setup and it was easy and dead silent. Just got my new tank and have ghost overflow and am having a bit of difficulty getting it dialed in. The full siphon and the durso are both 90 with another 90 and the emergency is a straight pipe. When I stop and restart the system the full siphon drain will not restart a siphon. Do I need to drill a hole or something in that 90 to let the air escape?

 

[sinful]

Ok for anyone that runs into this problem you need to drill a hole in the top of the 90 that's pointed down and adjust the water level a little higher. Atleast that's worked for me.

 

[asbauto]

I sometimes have to open the top of the full siphon drain to get it to full siphon again, I had threaded caps on them and could just loosen and tightened it back

 

[nitr8]

I have noticed this same issue with my tank for some time now. The full siphon is never really pulling anything out unless i re-prime it after every time the the siphon is lost. If it's not too much trouble can you show me a picture of what you did? Here is how my overlfow is plumbed.



I re did the the plumbing at the bottom before filling the tank so each drain is dedicated:

I sometimes have to open the top of the full siphon drain to get it to full siphon again, I had threaded caps on them and could just loosen and tightened it back

This is what I currently do to re-prime the siphon.

 

[CuzzA]

Common issues I've read that causes the siphon drain to not fully siphon are air leaks from threaded caps, horizontal runs or the drain pipe being to deep in the sump. My understanding is threaded caps should be avoided. In fact if you have an external box there is no need for tees and elbows as you can use a p trap. Horizontal runs allow air to get trapped. And finally the drain should terminate 1" below the surface of the water level of the sump. Anymore than that and the drain has a difficult time purging all of the air.

Drilling a hole in the top of the full siphon 90 would indicate to me that it's now a durso. But if it's working that's all that matters.

 

[CMcNeil]

I plan on running the bean animal drain on my new tank.

 

[sinful]

Thanks cuzza, good info. The hole on the top of 90 is actually an inch under water and is a full siphon. Without the hole, like you said, air would get trapped and there would be NO flow coming from that drain. The small hole allows the air to purge out once water rises high enough (to durso drain) And then it goes to full siphon

I couldn't find a 1" p trap to use, 1.5" was smallest at the big box stores. It's running smooth now and dead silent and restarts easily. I'll take a picture of it tonight.

 

[Ted_C]

Drilling a hole in the top of the full siphon 90 would indicate to me that it's now a durso. But if it's working that's all that matters.

Drilling a hole at the top of the 90 allows for a siphon break when removing the flow and allows for evacuating air when re-starting the flow.

Once the flow is established - the small hole will be completely submerged.

It's not a durso unless they are allowing air into the pipes during flow - which is not what they are doing.

The traps mentioned sound like a bad idea according to bean:

Using a trap on the SIPHON standpipe will have no effect (as it is silent to begin with) and will only serve to add more friction (and therefore, less overall maximum flow).

Using a trap on the Open Channel standpipe will cause the water to backup and the standpipe will no longer function as an open channel standpipe.

Using a trap on the emergency drain is pointless, as the emergency drain should be dry 99% of the time anyway. The trap would only serve to create a potential problem.

 

[sinful]

That's basically the same type of overflow I have. I drilled a very small hole on the top of the 90 full siphon drain. Water needs to be high enough in the overflow to cover it but once water fills up the air purges out and it goes full siphon in seconds without having to prime it every time the pumps are turned off. I turn my pumps off daily for feeding, having to prime every time isn't an option. Ha.

I have noticed this same issue with my tank for some time now. The full siphon is never really pulling anything out unless i re-prime it after every time the the siphon is lost. If it's not too much trouble can you show me a picture of what you did? Here is how my overlfow is plumbed.



I re did the the plumbing at the bottom before filling the tank so each drain is dedicated:




This is what I currently do to re-prime the siphon.

 

[CuzzA]

Drilling a hole at the top of the 90 allows for a siphon break when removing the flow and allows for evacuating air when re-starting the flow.

Once the flow is established - the small hole will be completely submerged.

It's not a durso unless they are allowing air into the pipes during flow - which is not what they are doing.

The traps mentioned sound like a bad idea according to bean:

Indeed, if the water level is above the hole it would fully siphon.

I'm not sure when bean wrote that; however, if we simply just stop and compare the construction of a trap and pipe vs. the original design of an elbow, pipe, tee and pipe, logic would tell me there would be much more friction with the latter configuration compared to a smooth trap with one connection vs. the elbow with 3 connections. Every time you put a fitting on the drain you are reducing flow by creating friction.

Here's a very recent video posted by thejuggernaut in the Silent and Failsafe Overflow thread. If you read that section of the thread you will see where thejuggernaut made some adjustments after the posting of this video.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/oya6X3aLUOo" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

[sinful]

Yea I watched that video. Any idea where to buy 1" p traps local or online best bet? It also looks like there is a hole in the top/side of the siphon drain in that video? Maybe not, but kinda looks like it, could be wrong.

For future, having the p traps would probably be ideal. Just couldn't find em. I was looking for em. It seems to be running perfect as of now with the smal hole and water level a bit higher. Tuning it perfect wasn't fun or fast, so it'll stay as is for now.

Indeed, if the water level is above the hole it would fully siphon.

I'm not sure when bean wrote that; however, if we simply just stop and compare the construction of a trap and pipe vs. the original design of an elbow, pipe, tee and pipe, logic would tell me there would be much more friction with the latter configuration compared to a smooth trap with one connection vs. the elbow with 3 connections. Every time you put a fitting on the drain you are reducing flow by creating friction.

Here's a very recent video posted by thejuggernaut in the Silent and Failsafe Overflow thread. If you read that section of the thread you will see where thejuggernaut made some adjustments after the posting of this video.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/oya6X3aLUOo" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

[CuzzA]

As long as it works. It does look like a hole, but I suspect it's just a remnant of the injection port on the mold. A hole would appear black.

 

[CrazyEyes]

One thing I noticed, on my 75g I had a bean animal, I used 45's on the full siphon and it would start the siphon in about 20-25 seconds, whereas on our little nano which used a herbie, I used 90's on the siphon and it would take almost 5 minutes for the siphon to start, might have been air getting stuck in the plumbing.One other thing, in the sump, how far below the water level is the drain for the full siphon? One thing I also noticed on mine is, when it was like 3-4 inches below the water level it would take quite some time to start the siphon, when I cut it down it was around a 1/2" below the water line and it would start real quick.

 

[sinful]

You guys are killing me. I have OCD about things being perfect and I'm going to end up taking a perfectly silent and working overflow and messing with it for hours to just go back to the way it is now.....

 

[sinful]

Didn't see your quote ted_c, sorry. So the hole on the top of the 90 is actually part of the design?

Drilling a hole at the top of the 90 allows for a siphon break when removing the flow and allows for evacuating air when re-starting the flow.

Once the flow is established - the small hole will be completely submerged.

It's not a durso unless they are allowing air into the pipes during flow - which is not what they are doing.

The traps mentioned sound like a bad idea according to bean:

 

[CuzzA]

As long as it starts up properly. And both failsafes work when either or both the FS and OC are closed I would leave it alone.

 

[janes_mw]

As long as it starts up properly. And both failsafes work when either or both the FS and OC are closed I would leave it alone.

Yup, what CuzzA said! If it works and you have the failsafes functioning, leave it be!! I run Herbies, but it usually takes about 3-5 minutes for everything to balance out after a restart, but it always returns to the silent overflows and drain system.

 

[asbauto]

Hey Matt thanks for this thread it created a lot of option for this type of overflow I think your setup is perfect and like said above if it works like it should and is quite leave it be bud

 

[sinful]

Very hard to see bit here is a picture of it.

 

[sinful]

I couldn't resist messing with it. I think my biggest problem was drain pipe being to deep. I cut it down to about an inch and put on a new 90 with no holes and it purged the air out. Takes a bit longer but I like the lesser amount of water in the overflow. If say from completely off to dead silent about 5 minutes'ish