alton
Well-known member
Man at 31 cents I don't think I would have an AC!
Anyone Thinking of Dumping LEDS and going back to Halides
- Thread starter Goldcoastreefs
- Start date
Man at 31 cents I don't think I would have an AC!
Just go through the pages of this thread and another one called "Open letter to the LED Industry". You will find lots.
power boat jim
Well-known member
Windirmere
New member
I kind of find it funny when people say their bill goes up in winter because they dont have a halide blasting heat into their tank... common a internal heater is much more efficient then a light bulb.
Aqualund
New member
No problem man! I have attached my invoice so you can see that I'm not lying lol. The only thing missing on the invoice is the $5 heatsink from heatsink USA and the $3 fan from ebay. With that, every light module comes in under $160...but that doesnt acount for the fact that every 5 up board can power 3 of the light modules...so that will bring the cost down considerably more per 24x24 area.
Even when the bulk discount is eliminated...each unit comes in under $180.
The leds are cree and luxeon..the 3535's ...I feel LEDGB was very smart to get this chip developed.
when the stuff arrives tomorrow and I get some building done I will start my build thread...most definitely.
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mussel and hate
New member
I agree it would be foolish for you to spend money on something you don't need, but a motorcycle isn't a replacement for a car and the difference between LEDs and MH isn't cool factor. Hence the analogy falls flat.
James77
Team RC
Yes, an LED setup allows you to add exactly as much heat as you need....but it does take away from the savings argument. My heater is on half the time in the fall-winter-spring seasons(roughly, going by the Apex graph when I had Apex controlling it). When the halides are on, the heater is not on and it sometimes up the temp to where it stays off for a few hours after. There is no heat(or absolute minimal) added to a tank with LEDs on it.
Sooo......say my 500 watt heater is on 4.5 hours more per day with LEDs than with halides(running halides 6 hours, plus the slight spike in temp). That would cost me about $9 more a month. My halide and (soon to be) single 54 watt T5 cost me about $17.50 a month. A good LED fixture setup( say Mitras, 380 watts total at 4.5 hours to factor in dimming for a longer lighting period) would cost me about $7 per month in electric....so I would save roughly $10 a month in electric lights only.
The LEDs would save me about $10 a month, but for over half the year, LEDs would have my heater cost me about $10 a month. It is a wash...for me. For myself, even debating saving $10, or even $40 a month is silly...and there are plenty of others like me that have moderate electric rates and live in colder climates where heat from halides is not an issue, it is actually welcome.
Sorry what I am bring up may have already been said or not as the title of the thread caught my eye as I saw it still going on. I have only read the last couple of pages so if I am repeating anything I am sorry. I am one that switched from T5 to all Leds, now back to metal halides. For me I hated the idea of diy led and from most are very expensive for larger tanks. On smaller or nanos, sure make sense for leds. My experience, I bought a cheaper fixture and had many issues such as drivers going dead and leds burning out. The fact that I needed 6 units to properly cover my tank to get full coverage that match either my t5 or MH. I eventually got fed up with problems that led brought , I gave them all to a friend who is using them as break fix for his. He constantly has led bulbs dying. So I am sorry the idea of any of these fixture last 5 years I fight this hard to swallow. Also I had to add an extra heater because the leds do not produce any heat. When you add the cost of that plus add the cost of buying decent led fixtures to match the coverage you get form a good halide reflector, going led for me is way more expensive. I mean to buy say 6 AI or Radions that would be anywhere between 1500 to over 2000. These days you get can a really good metal halide set up for a easy half that and having to buy bulbs is going to take awhile to to get up to that price. Never had a chiller. The cost savings are not there for most, the difference in hydro is a few dollar as these days the amount of led to properly light is pretty high in wattage. My friend has 550w of led I have 750 of metal halide when I am done.
You want a good analogy, leds are like buying a hybrid version of a car, the cost you pay for it, it will take you a lot of gas to make up for buying the hybrid, and lets not get started with the cost of a full electric car, its just not worth it.
You want a good analogy, leds are like buying a hybrid version of a car, the cost you pay for it, it will take you a lot of gas to make up for buying the hybrid, and lets not get started with the cost of a full electric car, its just not worth it.
Brian Crook
New member
Definitely would love to see a build thread for this! Will one of these lights really be powerful enough to cover a 24x24" area? Do you plan on selling these units after you build them? Will they be controllable? So many questions!
reefgeezer
Active member
Thanks for posting pics again Jim. I drooled all over... again. Since no one commented, I will... Wow! Really nice. Obviously a well designed and managed system. Kudos.
therra978
New member
No problem man! I have attached my invoice so you can see that I'm not lying lol. The only thing missing on the invoice is the $5 heatsink from heatsink USA and the $3 fan from ebay. With that, every light module comes in under $160...but that doesnt acount for the fact that every 5 up board can power 3 of the light modules...so that will bring the cost down considerably more per 24x24 area.
Even when the bulk discount is eliminated...each unit comes in under $180.
The leds are cree and luxeon..the 3535's ...I feel LEDGB was very smart to get this chip developed.
when the stuff arrives tomorrow and I get some building done I will start my build thread...most definitely.
wow cant wait to see your build thread.
I really want to hybrid my t5s with the lumias.
power boat jim
Well-known member
Thank you. I reposted the link since someone asked to see a tank that has run LEDs for two years and has coral growing out the top. I figured this on was close enough.
I dont know how well designed it is. It had no real plan from the beginning it was mostly trial and error for a while. It has remained pretty much unchanged for a few years now, but it seems to work.
power boat jim
Well-known member
I'm sorry I didn't reply either. Great tank Jim, it looks really good and is a great example of someone doing it right
Thanks for the kind words. The funny part in all this is this tank was run under MH for years, I made the switch a few years ago before the great debate really started. Only a couple corals were lost and they we not doing well anyway. The switch had only to do with the huge amount of heat the MH put into my back room. I had 3x 400w. Had I known it was supposed to be hard to do I probably never would have switched.
I think it worked well since I had a tank that was used to a huge amount of light in the first place. I did not run the LEDs at 100% when I got them and still dont. I think that alone got things going on the right foot. In reading this thread many of you know far more then I ever will about the science of light and light related topics. You guys are a great source of information. The only bit of advice I would give is dont get paralysis through analysis if you are thinking about changing light sources. Making an informed choice is important but a little common sense in making the change goes a long way. Thats my 2 cents on it all and glad we still have this thread to discuss it.
Your logic is where I came out on my recent re-build of our family display tank (a victim of Sandy-depressing). The idea of controlling the quality and output of LED light was appealing, (esp with night time viewing) but the actual cost savings of the LED's +Heaters relative to heat output of MH and known performance on my tank ( a deeper tank, in wall build) particularly in winter, left me thinking that the LED's were not worth the spend at this time. In the summer, when managing excess heat in this tank, I may embrace advantages of LEDs, but I don't see a huge advantage at the moment, (especially on a growing tank). Esthetically I also find many LED tanks create an 'Avatar' like appearance in the corals, which is unnatural to me. I think I will eventually swap out the T5 HO for LED's on a custom reflector build once this reef becomes better established, but keep at least one or both of the MH Radiums. As it is now, its 5 degrees outside and 4heaters are needed to keeping the tank at the minimum (remote sump in basement). I probably have to remediate sump insulation on the sump, or put a cover or something over it if I were running LED's.
All three technologies have good and bad points to them and no two tanks are the same. I've used T5, Metal Halide, and LED's. They all grow coral. I had some problems with LED's but that could have been me switching out LED's. But they are all good technologies. I think if someone is happy with T5's they should stick with it. If they like halides and don't have heat problems then there is no reason to switch. I like LED's and they grow well but I think the reason for switching in many cases is we have the itch to spend money and try something new. Our T5's and Halides were probably growing coral just as good. To prove my point look at LED fixtures. Since they have been out several people have tried multiple LED setups just to get the next best thing. With that being the case do we save money or spend money. We might save in electricity by moving to LED's but if we buy new fixtures every few years to get the next best thing are we really ahead of the game?
meshwheel
New member
Well I bought one fixture and I love it! It's the Reefbreeders Photon. I am growing corals with 100-120 watts for 4 hours a day.
I own a 2400 sq. ft. home with a built in 10,000 gallon pool. A wife, one daughter, 2 dogs and a whole mess of neighbor kids. My electric bill was 79.00 this past month!
I will not be changing lights anytime soon..............
I own a 2400 sq. ft. home with a built in 10,000 gallon pool. A wife, one daughter, 2 dogs and a whole mess of neighbor kids. My electric bill was 79.00 this past month!
I will not be changing lights anytime soon..............
fletch999
New member
I just laugh at the people that won't go to LED. I started my tank 3.5 yrs ago with LED's; I have never used anything else. I did go from just blue and white to a full spectrum LED. I have always had great growth and color. Do you die hard MH or T5 owners, own the Manufactures, have stock or anything that keeps you from switching, maybe the electric company? Do you mine coal? I too hate change, but man this just technology. Do you still own a tube TV or LED? Does your car still have a crank starter? Oh wait maybe you still horse and buggy to get to work? All I can say new technology works. Stop having such a closed mind. ooh cant wait
AcroporAddict
There is no substitute.
How about some pictures of your tank?
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