Moosetache
New member
So, I am guessing that Ron thinks the EverGrow he got is superior to the AquaIllumination Sol LED unit that I have in my possession already at this point? Any particular reasons for that?
Anyone Thinking of Dumping LEDS and going back to Halides
- Thread starter Goldcoastreefs
- Start date
Ron Reefman
Active member
Now don't go putting words in my mouth. :beer: I never said anything about the AI Sol because I have zero experience with it other than seeing it at MACNA and I was't seriously considering leds at that point.
I will say that I'd buy the EG/RB IT2080 over the Eco Tech Radion 99 times out of 100. The only reason to pay the huge premium for the Eco Tech is if you REALLY need to be able to control each color individually. And I don't have that need. Besides, I can swap out leds from the IT2080 easy enough. And the IT2080 controller makes it so easy to change my lights program compared to having to hook up the Radion to a computer to tweak it, what a PITA! I took my Radion off my frag tank and now have an EG/RB light there. I may put the Radion over my 2' x 4' refugium/DSB/frag acclimation area in the sump.
And the new leds make my tank feel almost like a new system compared to the MH/t5/led stunner system I had before. The only way I'd go back is if my corals stopped growing. And a friend of mine has used similar leds for over a year and his corals are growing at least as fast as mine were with the MH. I can't honestly make that call yet after only a month with the new lights.
bhazard451
New member
The AI Vegas would be a good test. The Sols are lacking a bit color wise.
It's much easier to justify the $500 price tag of the Vega over the $899 Radion Pro, although I still think both are a bit too high.
bhazard451
New member
When I get some time tonight or tomorrow, I'm going to post a thread with a somewhat detailed review comparing both with PAR number pics.
chadfarmer
Premium Member
I would rather buy bulbs that have to buy a new light every few years that is supposed to grow corals
bhazard451
New member
I know. It's a tough time to decide.
Until LED reef lighting is perfected, you can expect things will develop and become obsolete rapidly. You can also expect "modular" fixtures to take forever to release their upgrades. It's been months since we heard of what AI or Ecotech will be doing with them. I'm sure iphone/android app control is on the horizon in the future, and those fixtures are not built to accept a wireless signal. What happens then? Gotta buy a new fixture again. Thousands down the drain.
You have to decide if ease of use / heat / electricity / features are or aren't a factor for you. For me, I can't deal with the heat, electricity, and must have sunrise/sunset dimming, otherwise I would still own MH.
None of the lighting combos are "best". They all work and grow coral, its just what is best for you, your preferences, your price range, and your experiences that matter.
power boat jim
Well-known member
I find it interesting that people used MH fixtures or T5 fixtures for many years without a single major upgrade from the time they hit the market until today. No one bought a new unit because a fan unit was bigger or a reflector was a little better. We used them for a decade without question.
LEDs on the other hand, are being treated like phones and computers. The minute a new feature comes out everyone thinks its a necessity to ditch the one you bought 6 months ago and get the latest and greatest. We now have people who are sorry they bought Vegas because AI is coming out with another version of LEDs. Then we have the group that wont buy them cause they "just arent there" yet or are always waiting for the next version thats coming out. I dont know where "there" is for them but for me the SOL blues are good enough and will be for a long time.
I know this is from a guy who drives a 13 year old Chevy, a 43 year old Pontiac, has never owned a cell phone that will take a picture and has never sent a text message in his life. I will guarantee though those two old cars go everywhere a new one will, the old phone calls home when I need it to and my now generations old LEDs will be growing coral after 10 more generations of LEDs hit the market. I guess the moral to the story is buy what ya like and if it does the job dont worry about whats next or what the other guy has. Keeping up is expensive and has no real return, but it does make for some interesting reading.
These are just observations on my part you can agree or disgree, doesnt really matter.I just though i would throw it out there. Carry on.
LEDs on the other hand, are being treated like phones and computers. The minute a new feature comes out everyone thinks its a necessity to ditch the one you bought 6 months ago and get the latest and greatest. We now have people who are sorry they bought Vegas because AI is coming out with another version of LEDs. Then we have the group that wont buy them cause they "just arent there" yet or are always waiting for the next version thats coming out. I dont know where "there" is for them but for me the SOL blues are good enough and will be for a long time.
I know this is from a guy who drives a 13 year old Chevy, a 43 year old Pontiac, has never owned a cell phone that will take a picture and has never sent a text message in his life. I will guarantee though those two old cars go everywhere a new one will, the old phone calls home when I need it to and my now generations old LEDs will be growing coral after 10 more generations of LEDs hit the market. I guess the moral to the story is buy what ya like and if it does the job dont worry about whats next or what the other guy has. Keeping up is expensive and has no real return, but it does make for some interesting reading.
These are just observations on my part you can agree or disgree, doesnt really matter.I just though i would throw it out there. Carry on.
hillscp
Soylent Green is People!!
They grow corals.
Ron Reefman
Active member
Power Boat Jim, I kind of agee with you and kind of not. Leds do keep evolving and I think people jumpped into leds too quickly due to heat and cost of electricity. And I don't think many people have to buy the 'newest' led just because it has a new dodad. Some of the changes have been small and some have been huge. But now that they are full spectrum color, dimmable, cool and effecient, they can do things in term of color and dimming that MH and t5 owners wish they could do. Price has been the last huge issue for most potential buyers. EcoTech may think their new Radion is worth $750 or $900, but I'll bet we see serious price reductions in the not too distant future as word of these much less expensive, just as good quality, better coverage EverGrow/Reef Breeder IT series starts to get around. I spent $700 for my IT2080's and would have spent $2250-$3000 for Radions... it's a no brainer.
meshwheel
New member
People will learn that less wattage and energy produce less heat! And this is the case with LED's.
And a 10 year lifespan...........................HAHAHAHAH!!! Yea right!
Now they are showing their true colors, and manufacturers are upping the wattages. I almost bought one, but now am leaning toward a ATI 8 bulb unit. I don't care what NUMBNUTTS says over at RB!!!
I like SPS and want power!!! Ozone eroding, sweltering greenhouse gas POWER...........
Leds have not gotten a dime outa me yet......
And a 10 year lifespan...........................HAHAHAHAH!!! Yea right!
Now they are showing their true colors, and manufacturers are upping the wattages. I almost bought one, but now am leaning toward a ATI 8 bulb unit. I don't care what NUMBNUTTS says over at RB!!!
I like SPS and want power!!! Ozone eroding, sweltering greenhouse gas POWER...........
Leds have not gotten a dime outa me yet......
I have an LED unit that is about 3 years old. I can say without a doubt that in the 2 years i have owned them the light output is noticeably down. When I drove into my driveway the room used to be glowing blue....now it's simply a blue tinge.
I really don't think anyone is going to get 10 usable years out of the LEDs. They'll surely continue to produce light for that long, but it won't be adequate after a few years.
That said, I have too many heat issues to even think about MH and will still go with an inexpensive LED system that costs less than a quality T5 setup, with no bulb changes for 3 years. 3 years from now the options will be even better, and this discussion will probably be moot.
I really don't think anyone is going to get 10 usable years out of the LEDs. They'll surely continue to produce light for that long, but it won't be adequate after a few years.
That said, I have too many heat issues to even think about MH and will still go with an inexpensive LED system that costs less than a quality T5 setup, with no bulb changes for 3 years. 3 years from now the options will be even better, and this discussion will probably be moot.
Proper thermal management of the diode junction can and will yield many, many years of reliability and performance.
The problem is that, to save money, manufacturers use as few emitters as possible and drive them harder to compensate.
Keeping heat down (via adequate sinking and/or driving them with less current) will go a long way in extending fixture lifetime.
Ron Reefman
Active member
And these complaints from a guy who's avatar is a pollution puffing old VW... :spin1: Just teasing meshwheel, actually you make some very good points. But I live in SW Florida and my A/C works hard enough in the summer, so leds will be a nice improvement. Now if I can just stop my chiller from ruting out due to lack of use!
meshwheel
New member
Hi Ron,
LOL!!!! I know there are many variables in this hobby. Lighting is certianly one of them. I am in So. Ca. so we get maybe 4-6 weeks a year where a chiller actually can save everyone's fish and or corals. The heatwave rolls through then it's gone.
Then if you have halides and a full blown reef it's a different story. You need the chiller pretty much all summer long, and parts of the winter too.
I like the Kessil's and the Maxspect Razor. If I needed lights and had a reef with no SPS I would maybe try one of them.
I still think they are way overpriced and need to come down more in cost for many of the units. Only the Kessils and Maxspect Razor are slightly impressing me thus far. Light output is good and price is reasonable.
I just get a bad feeling in the pit of my stomach over any of this Eco-Friendly mumbo-jumbo.........
LOL!!!! I know there are many variables in this hobby. Lighting is certianly one of them. I am in So. Ca. so we get maybe 4-6 weeks a year where a chiller actually can save everyone's fish and or corals. The heatwave rolls through then it's gone.
Then if you have halides and a full blown reef it's a different story. You need the chiller pretty much all summer long, and parts of the winter too.
I like the Kessil's and the Maxspect Razor. If I needed lights and had a reef with no SPS I would maybe try one of them.
I still think they are way overpriced and need to come down more in cost for many of the units. Only the Kessils and Maxspect Razor are slightly impressing me thus far. Light output is good and price is reasonable.
I just get a bad feeling in the pit of my stomach over any of this Eco-Friendly mumbo-jumbo.........
You must hate living there. (unless so. ca. stands for southern canada, instead of socal)
GSMguy
New member
Me too but I needed a new light and I wanted to try them, my tank will be mostly Bubble tip anemones and a few SPS and LPS plus I always have the T5 tank incase anything goes wonky.
I am looking forward to having a light that I don't need to replace bulbs but I worry that I won't get the colors I am used to and might have to suppliment with t5.
Ron Reefman
Active member
You really need to see the EverGrow /ReefBreeder IT series in person somewhere. They have whatever leds you want, where you want them and whatever lenses you want. They cover more sq ft of tank then the expensive led lights and they cost WAY less. I paid $1100 for the AquaMedic MH I had, EcoTech Radions would have cost me $3000 (I'd need 4) and the new ones are even more??!!?? I paid $350 ea for 2 EverGrow IT2080's and got spare leds and lenses that I wanted. Oh, and that included UPS air delivery from China! The only test left is if my corals grow and I'm 99% sure they will do just fine.
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