Anyone Thinking of Dumping LEDS and going back to Halides
- Thread starter Goldcoastreefs
- Start date
Aqualund
New member
Remember this is the internet, a hobby, not personal, and only one old dudes opinion . . .
I was trying to come up with a bet that we could both verify like there will be more metal halide tanks in the future than there are now or there will be fewer LED tanks in the future as a percentage of reef aquariums but I couldn't think of something funny and good so I'll just have to state my case.
I have tried numerous LEDs at home the most recent being my hybrid disaster. I also have a Masters degree in Electrical Engineering and way back when in the days when dinosaurs walked the Earth I actually worked on designing microchips using "doping" which involved understanding the nano technology of P-N junctions. I will tell you here and now that LED light will never replace "full spectrum" light sources created by burning gases. The simple physics of how LEDs produce light prohibits there ever being a "full spectrum" LED. Add to that a host of other issues associated withLED light and you will understand why NOT ONE SINGLE MAJOR GREENHOUSE in the WHOLE WORLD except for some crazy Dutch that use LEDs to make roses more red is using LEDs. They do not grow plants or zooxanthellea "correctly". Can they make things grow? Yes. Can they do it the same as full spectrum light? No. Just look at the increasing number of experiments showing how some LED light is damaging to certain corals or certain zooxanthellea.
LEDs will NEVER replace the current full spectrum light sources. There may be other technology that will, but LEDs are NOT it. For people interested in growing plants and corals of all varieties correctly the defects of LED lighting make their use impossible.
Tell me why a 350nm or below semiconductor with the appropriate phosphor coating cannot provide the full spectrum you are looking for in order to grow corals to the standard you're looking for?
Because honestly, once that is achieved, the problems with leds are solved.
But you say its impossbru...I dont believe in impossibru.
ridetheducati
20 and Over Club
I only purchase LED optimized corals, life is grand.
Bpb
New member
I actually plan on using both. I have only ever used T5, but with my upcoming tank upgrade I'm hanging up the T5 and going with 2x250 watt radiums as well as a BuildMyLED strip. Either their super actinic, a custom spectrum, or possibly their radium clone. I hope to enjoy the pop, fluorescence, and dim look of LEDs late into the night, but also have a few hours of the growing power and color creation provided by metal halides.
Aquatron
Refugium pat.#D414,242
While the title for this thread was fitting in 2012 things are different now in 2014 so why dump when you can blend. While MHs are a staple in our hobby and aren't going anywhere LEDs are.....and we as hobbiest will have better choices with lighting for our aquariums.
James77
Team RC
The thread is just over a year and a half old, not all that much has changed.
That's why they make 31 flavors......
FastUno
New member
Okay from those who remembered my older posts here. I am running into trouble with one of my corals, the purple stylo & need some direction.
First off let me say that everything is growing so much & it is crazy. Growing too fast & many things are stinging each other due to my bad placement of corals & just non stop growth.
Second that I had the same trouble with my MH/T5's on a volleyball size pink birdsnest & to a smaller degree on this same stylo. I only used the MH portion & T5's just for sunset/sunrise. So what happens is as the coral grows the lower part of it becomes white on my old birdsnest (under T5/MH) & underneath the stylo it turns brown & lighter (some white).
The birdsnest I chopped up before the intro of the LED's & all frags are doing fine under LED's. The stylo turned more white from brown, only underneath where it is shaded. It has grown since the intro to my LED's & the more it grows, the more shading it gets & whiter it gets underneath. When I look at it from the top, all the parts that get light are fine & colorful.
So it looks like long term with just LED's that I will have trouble with larger size corals. Not because of lack of color, LED problems, but because lack of light penetration. Which visually I saw just about the same shading with MH's.
Is this normal/typical of SPS corals? What is my solution to just add 2x T5's? Opinions/suggestions?
First off let me say that everything is growing so much & it is crazy. Growing too fast & many things are stinging each other due to my bad placement of corals & just non stop growth.
Second that I had the same trouble with my MH/T5's on a volleyball size pink birdsnest & to a smaller degree on this same stylo. I only used the MH portion & T5's just for sunset/sunrise. So what happens is as the coral grows the lower part of it becomes white on my old birdsnest (under T5/MH) & underneath the stylo it turns brown & lighter (some white).
The birdsnest I chopped up before the intro of the LED's & all frags are doing fine under LED's. The stylo turned more white from brown, only underneath where it is shaded. It has grown since the intro to my LED's & the more it grows, the more shading it gets & whiter it gets underneath. When I look at it from the top, all the parts that get light are fine & colorful.
So it looks like long term with just LED's that I will have trouble with larger size corals. Not because of lack of color, LED problems, but because lack of light penetration. Which visually I saw just about the same shading with MH's.
Is this normal/typical of SPS corals? What is my solution to just add 2x T5's? Opinions/suggestions?
FastUno
New member
mixedreefjunky
New member
For the post about LED's not growing plants "correctly". I live and work here in CO in the states newest industry and I can assure you that LED's grow plants just fine.
mixedreefjunky
New member
let me know when your in Denver for MACNA!!!
Khemul
New member
It's a common problem with LEDs. MH usually minimizes this with reflectors and T5 eliminates it by blanketing the tank in light. The way LED fixtures are designed (packing the diodes together and adding optics) goes the other direction and actually compounds the problem.
I designed my LED fixture in strips, without optics for this very reason. Haven't been able to test if I was successful though, since I grow softies and they don't seem to care about shading as much as SPS. :lolspin: Adding a couple T5's would probably fix it.
Mikefromaz
New member
Nah....say it ain't so. All these months of civil discourse and nary a chest thump or arm bulge until now. So people who don't spend "big bucks are cheating" on their hobby? Sounds an awful lot like a weary afternoon at the golf course where the foursome has to listen to how wonderfully expensive a guys clubs are. Some things you just can't get away from.
d2mini
Premium Member
Yep, as you are seeing or will see eventually, your LPS will grow great and your SPS will grow funky, some will be the wrong color or lack color, and will be bald underneath/not grow underneath. Adding T5 would definitely help. As mentioned above, LED is a strong pinpoint light source without the proper reflectors to spread the light.
mixedreefjunky
New member
Only the truly crappy LED fixtures puck their LEDs together. There are many LED fixtures that saw puck style LED lighting was a silly idea and have stepped away from that style and are now making fixtures that blanket the whole tank with light. And these fixtures are doing much better than puck style LED units even with LED'S that aren't as nice as CREE.
Depends on what you are after. I would never get a spread out LED unit since I like a little shadowing and LOVE shimmer.
The exact same thing could be said for MH and T5 btw.
mixedreefjunky
New member
If you were to try a spread out LED unit or see one in person, you'd see they actually give off more shimmer then puck sourced lighting. But still give alittle shadowing as well. Like Meshwheel I wont be switching to anyhting other then LED for quite some time.
And I kinda retract my earlier statement, there are a couple puck source LED fixtures that work quite well actually but that style isn't my cup of tea.
Aqualund
New member
LOL. No, it's because clustering leds reduces disco effect. The only reason you see other fixtures doing the arrays like your reefbreeders is because it's cheap and easy to print the pcb on a piece of aluminum that also acts as the heatsink. This saves on construction costs, but doesn't necessarily provide better light.
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