Are Copperband Butterflys ich resistant?

[msmith619]

I am contemplating adding a copperband butterfly to my 120 gallon reef tank. I have tried numerous tangs in the past: blue Hippo, yellow, Powder blue and powder brown. All contract ich and die. Now, I have a tank full of fish and have added others in between the tangs and no one gets ich, only the tangs. I currenttl have a Rock beauty, 2 royal grammas, 2 pajama cardinals, a (flake food eating) yellowhead jawfish, 2 firefish and two Talbot and yellow tail damsels.
The LFS has a nice 4 inch Copperband who has been in their tank for 4 weeks and eating frozen food well.
So, my question, are CBB prone to ich? I have scoured the web sites and have not seen one picture of a CBB with ich, lots of "is this ich" post but none were actually ich.
What are your experiences?

 

[Blue Ring Sting]

I have had a Copperband a few times and it didn't really have trouble with ich. The problems that I have had were that they were not eating and they also had swim bladder problems which eventually lead to there demise. Have you seen him eating or have you been told by the LFS that they eat? Just watch him for a bit, make sure he is swimming normally and also ask the LFS to feed it while you there.

I see you will be adding him to your reef, just becareful as they are prone to nip at corals.

 

[msmith619]

He is eating well. As I mentioned above, eating frozen foods. I watched them feed and he was grabbing frozen food out of the mouths of the other fish in the tank.
I am willing to take the risk with the corals, they will take him back if he becomes a coral assasin. I just worry about ich sinceI know that it exists in the tank, dormant for now.....

 

[Blue Ring Sting]

That sounds good then go ahead and get him. Just keep him fed well and use some garlic supplements to keep his immune system boosted. If ich is in your tank he will go onto all fish if they become active. All I can say in that case is cleaner shrimp and garlic supplements. Make sure that all your fish immune systems are strong.

 

[TankStudy]

I believe the copperband butterfly is a scaled fish. If you keep it healthy and in a stress free environment, a strong mucous coat and scales will easily fend of ich and keep ich at bay. Tangs don't have the scales to double block infections. If you aren't doing good with tangs, something is causing too much stress inhibiting the production of mucous for a healthy tang.

 

[chema]

I had one that took care of all the aiptasias in my tank. It was a little picky concerning food, only mussel feather dusters and aiptasias, but survived a terrible ich atack that devastated my tank. Unfortunately it died, with the rest of living organisms of my tank, during a power shortage.

 

[MrTuskfish]

That sounds good then go ahead and get him. Just keep him fed well and use some garlic supplements to keep his immune system boosted. If ich is in your tank he will go onto all fish if they become active. All I can say in that case is cleaner shrimp and garlic supplements. Make sure that all your fish immune systems are strong.

Neither cleaner shrimp or garlic will prevent or cure ich. There is a lot of mis-information on this thread.... IMO & IME.

 

[Deinonych]

Any fish can get cryptocaryon - the parasite doesn't differentiate among species. Some fish are more susceptible (tangs) and some are less (dragonets), but they are not immune. A good quarantine practice eliminates the concern.

 

[M007]

Very handy fish to have. Mine eats PE and has been a model citizen since introduction.

 

[Savoie83]

If the tang die from ich in your tank, you have ich in you tank. If the cooperband get stress, ich will appear....

 

[namxas]

IME, CBB's from Australia fare better on prepared foods, but don't tend to look at appies much. This is the opposite for Indo-Pacific specimens.

As for crypto-prone? Not in my experience.

 

[msmith619]

If the tang die from ich in your tank, you have ich in you tank. If the cooperband get stress, ich will appear....

I have had the current reef tank up for 2 years. Lots of fat, healthy fish. Every tang comes down with ich within 3 days of introduction. Even after quarantine.

So, I bought a new 120 gallon. Added all the origional live rock and corals but left the tank fish free for 5 months all of this past summer to let the ich cycle die off. I kept the fish quarantined in a 56 gallon during this time with no signs of disease. The reef tank has Zoas, Palys, Torch corals, Frogspawn, chalices, Duncans, monte caps, acans, gorgonians, favia, moon corals and lots of young frags of sps. I have kept salt water tanks for over 30 years and this is my 1st real problem with ich that does not seem to ever go away.

In August, I slowly added the fish to the new tank, one at a time. being careful to not add any water from the old tank. 2 weeks ago I added a
2" Regal tang, I quarantined him for 4 weeks. He was covered in ich after three days. THIS time, he is eating like a horse. I soak the food for at least 30 minutes before feeding in Garlic. Feeding him frozen, flake and pellet 4-5 times a day and he is still going strong after 2 weeks in the tank and eating like a champ, still covered with ich. He shows no signs of illness other than the spots and I think this one is going to survive. The others all began with rapid breathing after a couple of days and stopped feeding until they eventually died.

No other fish in the tank (Rock beauty, yellowhead jawfish, royal gramma, 2 firefish, 2 pajama cardinal, 2 Talbot's damsel and 2 yellowtail damsel) has shown any spots or signs of ich. It is only the Regal tang. Thus, my question. After the tang is fully free of spots and several weeks have gone by, would a Copperband butterfly be at risk? I really want a yellow tang but, my experince with the regal tang has me looking at a copperband butterfly instead.

I have even considered trying this on my Reef tank:

Kordon Ich Attack for Fresh & Saltwater Aquariums

It says safe with corals and inverts and I have seen several posts of people on this site who have claimed success. The thing is, it says it takes 4-5 weeks for the treatment to clear the tank of ich. It seems to me that is about how long a fish might take to become immune to ich if it survives.

 

[CedzAquAddictio]

I may have missed it, but did you treat the fish when you moved them to the 56g tank?

Also: With the regal tang having ich in the DT, ich now resides in your DT and not only on your Regal Tang even though it is the only thing showing signs.

That being said, just about any fish you add will be at a level of risk...

I've had great success following what you did with the exception of treating my fish while they were in QT. You may have moved the parasite back into your fallow tank when you added the fish. I believe they can be carriers of it even though they don't show signs. Basically, if your tank has an outbreak, let the tank sit fallow for 8 weeks minimum, and treat all of the exposed fish in a separate tank...

Never tried Kordon Ich Attack, so I can't speak for it.

Garlic is merely an appetite stimulant. It will not cure or kill the ich.
Cleaner shrimp look cool, and may give the fish some comfort with the cleaning, but they don't cure, eat, or kill ich...

Sorry for your troubles, and best of luck!!!

Keep us posted...

 

[Savoie83]

Look like you didn't treat them.. you have to start again.

 

[Paul B]

Neither cleaner shrimp or garlic will prevent or cure ich. There is a lot of mis-information on this thread.... IMO & IME.

Mis information should be the title of this thread. But have fun.

If your tangs died from ich, so will your copperband.

 

[homegrowncichli]

I'm an expert on ich, (Based on reading 2 publications on it). Basically not only is there a lifecycle, which we all know about and try to treat with copper or leaving the tank empty, but ich also has different strains. Similar to a common cold virus. You may catch a cold/flu from someone, then after you fight it off, you're immune to that strain, but if someone else with a different strain coughs on you, you'll get sick again.
The couple of interesting fact about ich, is that even if it exists in your tank with fish, it can only survive for 9-12 months or 30 something generations (I can't remember the exact number) at which point it will die out. It has been documented.

SO based on these 3 facts, I know that your tank has a specific strain of ich, which you had from before. It may have been the original one. The fact that your quarantined the tang for 4 weeks means it should be ich free. (Assume you used cuperamine). Then after placing him in your main tank, he was exposed to your ich strain, which means your original fish are relatively immune to it and asymptomatic and somewhere in the ich generation below 30 somthing. Your new tang has never been exposed to it and is now sympotmatic.

What to do now? Since your other fish are immune to it, they will shed most of the ich that trys to burrow into their skin, but there is that tiny few that do survive their immune system or scratching behavior that will carry on the ich name. That will prevent the exponential ich explosion that usually wipes out your fish. The tang, having no immunity will be a little ich factory until he develops immunity.

The 4th interesting fact about ich is that it takes fish 2 or 3 exposures to that strain of ich before they develope immunity. (some fish better than others of course) So if you can keep your fish alive for 3 generations of ich, it will be fine and relatively asymptomatic until the ich dies out next year.

OH, here's the last ffun fact. Fish's immunity is not forever, unlike ours, which are based on antibodies which last for life, fish will forget their immunity once the ich dies out.

 

[jjk_reef00]

If your tangs died from ich, so will your copperband.

I agree, maintaining a healthy disease free BF is difficult enough. Your chances gow down considerably if you have a sick fish and don't plan on treating it.

 

[msmith619]

I'm an expert on ich, (Based on reading 2 publications on it).
The couple of interesting fact about ich, is that even if it exists in your tank with fish, it can only survive for 9-12 months or 30 something generations (I can't remember the exact number) at which point it will die out. It has been documented.
So if you can keep your fish alive for 3 generations of ich, it will be fine and relatively asymptomatic until the ich dies out next year.

That is encouraging news. Of note, no one ever scratches. It is good to know that, over time, the ich will die out!

 

[msmith619]

oops. Double post

 

[jjk_reef00]

I'm an expert on ich, (Based on reading 2 publications on it). Basically not only is there a lifecycle, which we all know about and try to treat with copper or leaving the tank empty, but ich also has different strains. Similar to a common cold virus. You may catch a cold/flu from someone, then after you fight it off, you're immune to that strain, but if someone else with a different strain coughs on you, you'll get sick again.
The couple of interesting fact about ich, is that even if it exists in your tank with fish, it can only survive for 9-12 months or 30 something generations (I can't remember the exact number) at which point it will die out. It has been documented.

SO based on these 3 facts, I know that your tank has a specific strain of ich, which you had from before. It may have been the original one. The fact that your quarantined the tang for 4 weeks means it should be ich free. (Assume you used cuperamine). Then after placing him in your main tank, he was exposed to your ich strain, which means your original fish are relatively immune to it and asymptomatic and somewhere in the ich generation below 30 somthing. Your new tang has never been exposed to it and is now sympotmatic.

What to do now? Since your other fish are immune to it, they will shed most of the ich that trys to burrow into their skin, but there is that tiny few that do survive their immune system or scratching behavior that will carry on the ich name. That will prevent the exponential ich explosion that usually wipes out your fish. The tang, having no immunity will be a little ich factory until he develops immunity.

The 4th interesting fact about ich is that it takes fish 2 or 3 exposures to that strain of ich before they develope immunity. (some fish better than others of course) So if you can keep your fish alive for 3 generations of ich, it will be fine and relatively asymptomatic until the ich dies out next year.

OH, here's the last ffun fact. Fish's immunity is not forever, unlike ours, which are based on antibodies which last for life, fish will forget their immunity once the ich dies out.

This entire post is completely false...
Ich is not a virus it is a parasite.