Attention Members !!!!

[mr pink floyd]

I see what you are trying to do here, though it is a good idea in theory, I disagree with it. The first word that comes to my head right now is censorship. It is the right of the club members to post what they think about a certain store, especially the good. I understand that store bashing isn't great, and I don't think it would be considered bashing to simply give constructive critsism, however those threads do seem to turn into bashing very easy.

As for the press must be equal, that makes no sense. Freedom of the press is the right for the press to give news to the public, if "X" store got in a great shipment of corals, why would it be wrong for "the press" to say, hey "X" has some cool rare frags. There is no harm in statign a fact like that. Each store has an equal chance to be posted about, that that is the important thing here. As long as there is no discrimination against stores, there should be no problem.

Once again, the idea is good, it just seems unethical to me to not be able to spread good helpful news.

People don't post those to hurt stores, they post to help the club, to keep the club great...

Jeff, I'm most certainly not trying to start an argument, this is mainly becasue I'm bored, and can't sleep becasue of CAPTs.

I see this as an example of "The Man" trying to bring us down :lol:

 

[tsquad]

Really what it comes down to is don't say, "This store is better than this store." Don't compare stores to each other publicly on the forum. It will always end poorly.

There's nothing wrong with saying "I got this coral at this store for this much money" but when you say "I got this coral for this much HERE, but THERE it's this much, don't go THERE" it crosses a line IMO.

 

[mr pink floyd]

Agreed Tyler, and also about he PM thing, PM is not public, its private... or is it? If you know about our Pms, that can only mean one thing.....



Big Brother is Watching





see, this is what happens when I have nothing better to do

 

[tsquad]

I'm thinking Jeff meant PMs referring to the PMs he was receiving...either way, it's time for bed. Good luck with CAPT, lucky me gets to sleep in til 830

 

[benray4fun]

Re: Attention Members !!!!

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9400490#post9400490 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by hans1976
.

If they are having a special event (Grand Opening, Anniversary Sale, etc), they can get in touch with me and I will gladly promote the event. After all, that is part of my job as Director of Public Relations.

hans, with all due respect (Todd owner of FINTASTIC) is a long standing member of this club. Not only is he a store owner, but also a hobbiest with all of us in mind (he's one of our own). "I've met Todd personally and he is a great person."

Please consider promoting this event, time is drawing near and I can't think of anyone who is more deserving of our complete support.

FINTASTIC is officially opening up its doors on saturday march 10th @ 10:am and we should be there to help celebrate their grand opening...

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[georgie1]

Ok I feel people are really blowing what Jeff said out of perspective. We all know what has been going on this site..... This site has been a great site since I joined in early 2005, but the past few months have been unreal with all the bashing, arguements and sneaky tactics. It is a shame it has come to this but some people have just gotten out of control. As for the censorship comment, i am saying this nicely but of course there is NO tone here but maybe you need to read the rules, It is not censorship but a rule. Look at capthtfd, is that fair now that they no longer want to visit the board??? Just in this post alone some people have still done exactly what Jeff has said not to do. Hello people!

 

[draco_myst]

georgie1 . . . we don't do what Jeff, or anyone else TELLS us to do. We're the club, we select our officers, we agree to our rules. If there is a specific bylaw that has been violated . . . let's state that, and be done with it. Period. If someone continues to violate a SPECIFIC bylaw after being advised politely, then delete the posts, quietly. But don't treat us like a bunch of school children by telling us we can't talk about the things that we're here to talk about, things that excite us, and things that disappoint us. That's life folks.

 

[georgie1]

Ok Draco myst seeing you want to godown this road, why do we need to post the bylaws if we have all agreed with the rules?????? I am sorry to hear that you don't listen to Jeff or anyone else. He was apointed by our officers sorry you can't take authority. He is doing his job. Maybe you like the drama??? There have been deleted posts, but why should they have to be our baby sitters....... Enough said here, YOU can pm me

 

[MimicTang]

Not everyone here is in CSTARS either.

 

[Last_Tang_o]

You know, people, I'd heard a similar conversation take place a little while back. In my son's Middle School. Kid A was chastizing kid B for liking kid C better than him. Except they did not get into a dog fight about it.
The Constitution of United States had something in it about Freedom of Speech... I don't exactly recall what it was, but by the looks of this here material, some of us need to review it as well. There is nothing in the RC "rule book" about being openly excited about a new coral in a new store. It does not make the other stores bad, unless the other store owner knows of a good reason why his practices desire improvement, but is being self-conscious about it. There is a difference between constructive criticism and bashing, and a seasoned businessman should know the difference. If the store does something poorly, it would certainly be worthwhile for the owner to heed the consumer's opinion and improve upon it? And if the store owner is doing something right, why not complement them openly on this site? Why hush it up, Jeff? It seems to be a running trend nowadays: status quo. Let's all be good boys and girls, keep everything "even-steven", and never openly compliment anyone because it may offend someone else. A good lesson for our children to learn!

 

[tsquad]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9406158#post9406158 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by draco_myst
But don't treat us like a bunch of school children by telling us we can't talk about the things that we're here to talk about, things that excite us, and things that disappoint us. That's life folks.

You aren't here to talk about which store is better than which store, and why you should go to one while putting down another. That's not a CTARS rule, that's an RC rule. I understand if you didn't know that, but you can't be an advertisement unless you pay sponsorship to RC. Not saying you are advertising any particular store, I'm not going to name names, but the advertisements are what need to stop. If you work for the store, then you can buy sponsorship and have your own forum. Notice how all the big names (reefermadness, MarineDepot, EuroReef) all have "RC Sponsor" under their names. Also note how the local store owners may have RC names, but you don't see "New XXX Specials!!! Come in!!!" threads because they either know better, or the threads get deleted.

 

[draco_myst]

1. I'm not a sponsor
2. I'm not employed by a sponsor
3. I'm not a second cousin twice removed from a sponsor
4. I'm not a paid (or unpaid) advertiser for a sponsor
5. I'm not a sponsor's spiritual guru . . . you get the picture.

I do not support biased statements like store X is better than store Y. However, I am an equal (I hope?) member of CTARS who feels that I (or anyone else) should be able to say "I had a great experience at store X", or "I had a bad experience at store Y" be that store a sponsor, non-sponsor, or an internet store in east oshkosh. I agree that those with a vested interest in a store should NOT be posting either self praising, or competition critical comments in this forum. The bottom line is, people made entirely too much of this. EVERYTIME a new store is "discovered" it receives "15 minutes of glory" in this forum, and then, naturally, it all dies down. Big deal. I LIKE hearing about new stores, and great deals. I shop at no less than 6 different LFSs, and 3 different internet stores. NONE of them are perfect, and NONE of them are terrible. If one of them has a special, then I feel entitled to share that information with my fellow club members. If one of them screws me . . . then I should be allowed to share that too. And if they don't like the negative exposure that they screwed me, then maybe they should rethink their business practices, not silence my comments to my fellow club members (provided those comments are honest, and unbiased). And if they don't like the positive comments that a competitor is getting, the same applies. "Specials" are posted here all the time . . . "internet store X will give us a volume discount on item Y, group buy?" for example. If someone breaks the sponsorship advertising rules, then by all means put a stop to it. But if a member with no vested interest makes a comment (positive OR negative) then it should be taken for what it is . . . someone's comment or opinion.

 

[ShiftNation]

I agree with most points that have been made so far . It is unfair to some stores for all the free publicity , but in the same respect the publicity has been earned through quality and good prices . People always want to shout out when they catch a nice coral or good deal . We always want to spread the word . I believe if any store has issues its because they need to step thier game up and evolve with us and the hobby . This is a very unfair world and the guy that works hardest , longest and with the most heart reaps the rewards . I agree with that the bashing is no good but I dont see an issue with unsolicited praise for a store . Unlike other stores in the area Fintastic has never solicited me to post for thier store , nor anyone else that I know . The way I see it is that we arent so much the minority anymore and these stores are finally seeing we are here to stay and if they want our business they need to run a good operation and keep us happy . I believe some stores arent ready for that . Im not singling any store out either as ill shop at anyplace as long as the price is right and the stock is healthy . Anyway I would like to second that Jeff is doing a great job for the club and hes got us finally headed in the right direction . That only proves my point that you need to progress all the time and strive for the best . Thanks Jeff .

 

[draco_myst]

Agreed . . . and if my prior comments sounded anti-Jeff, then I apologize. They were not meant to be taken that way. You are doing a great job Jeff. I just don't want to see people made to feel that they cannot speak their minds here. As many of you I'm sure remember, I previously had a negative experience at a LFS who is a sponsor, and was immediately set upon by every CTARS member who either worked at that store, or was best friends with people at that store when I posted my experience. The comments that I made were true, and honest, and well meaning, and I was slammed for it.

 

[REEF-DADDY]

You know what would be great? If we can keep this thread from being closed....

 

[Last_Tang_o]

This is just downright shameful!

This is just downright shameful!

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9406662#post9406662 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by tsquad
You aren't here to talk about which store is better than which store, and why you should go to one while putting down another. That's not a CTARS rule, that's an RC rule. I understand if you didn't know that, but you can't be an advertisement unless you pay sponsorship to RC. Not saying you are advertising any particular store, I'm not going to name names, but the advertisements are what need to stop.

I just went through the RC rule book (again), and there is NO place where it says I as a member cannot openly reflect on my own experience at a new store because it infringes upon rights of "that other" store. Neither does it imply that I think that "the other store" is bad. It may be READ that way by a third party if they CHOOSE to read between my lines. What they choose to read is THEIR business, but it was NOT what I said. My experience, whether great, so-so, or a bad one is MY opinion as a member, and "it does not represent the opinions of this here website", thank you very much. I really think that this thread took things (once again) too far... it's rather sad and shameful.
The compliment is well-deserved for a job well-done. We wish our new enterpreneur best of luck in all his beginnings, both large and small!!!:beer: And now... on with our reefing!:fish1:

 

[trstange]

One of the problems with internet forums is that you don't get the tone with which something is said/posted and so the true meaning or intent of what the poster said is lost or left up the imagination of the reader. Another is that some feel the anonymity of the internet allows them to be free of the responsibility for their words.

Some of our sponsors feel that some posts are from the club as a whole and not an individual’s opinion and so the board members hear about it from them, as if we're responsible or can do something about it. I too like to hear about specials going on in different areas of the state but praising one and in the next sentence bashing another serves no purpose.

If we all try to be fair and balanced. If something not to your liking happens, wait a day before posting and not do it in the heat of the moment.

My 2 cents

 

[ShiftNation]

I 100% agree with Tom , be very careful with the heat of the moment posts and that will cut issues down by half at least .

 

[Sierra6]

I agree that we should try to moderate any store bashing, however, if people have a problem with a store, there should be no problem posting facts.

It is also agreed that store owners shouldn't be posting their sales or shipments, BUT

talking about sales or shipments or good deals among ourselves certainly shouldn't be banned and does smack of censorship. In fact, I think it helps all the LFS in general. When Fintastic runs it's grand opening, I'll bet the people driving in from other parts of the state also stop by at the Puppy Center, since they've driven that far anyway. And, knowing you people , I bet some of you will end up buying something there as well. I think any kind of discussion of this sort only benefits the hobby, gets people excited and spending more - how can that hurt the LFS? It's kind of like having a Burger King and a Wendy's on the same corner - the chatter draws more people in. This week it might be Fintastic, next week it might be Bob's, but in the end, we are still handing more and more of our money over to one LFS or another.

Not to mention that, once we purchase discounted corals at one LFS sale, we may need to upgrade our system, and turn right back to a LFS closer to home.

Please don't ban our chatter!

:bounce1:

 

[reefkrazy]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9407563#post9407563 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Sierra6
I agree that we should try to moderate any store bashing, however, if people have a problem with a store, there should be no problem posting facts.

It is also agreed that store owners shouldn't be posting their sales or shipments, BUT

talking about sales or shipments or good deals among ourselves certainly shouldn't be banned and does smack of censorship. In fact, I think it helps all the LFS in general. When Fintastic runs it's grand opening, I'll bet the people driving in from other parts of the state also stop by at the Puppy Center, since they've driven that far anyway. And, knowing you people , I bet some of you will end up buying something there as well. I think any kind of discussion of this sort only benefits the hobby, gets people excited and spending more - how can that hurt the LFS? It's kind of like having a Burger King and a Wendy's on the same corner - the chatter draws more people in. This week it might be Fintastic, next week it might be Bob's, but in the end, we are still handing more and more of our money over to one LFS or another.

Not to mention that, once we purchase discounted corals at one LFS sale, we may need to upgrade our system, and turn right back to a LFS closer to home.

Please don't ban our chatter!

:bounce1:

Amen to that!