Austin goes Rimless - Dudester's 203g mixed reef

[Dudester]

I'll try to get some pics up later this week. I won't be going home tonight so the earliest I'll be able to get them up will be Friday. I changed out my Zeolites and I've been using more Zeobac, and I think this is helping to reduce the nutrients in the tank. I did a major pruning session yesterday and the algae came off of the rocks much easier than during previous attempts, and some of it is dying off spontaneously, so I'm pretty sure I'm heading in the right direction. It still looks like crap, though.

As for the yellow tang, it really got beat up on. Many of the fins were torn and shredded, it has had several gashes along its body, and it lost a lot of weight. Now it is eating quite well and I've already seen the abdomen expand from 'pinched' to flat, so it's definitely regaining some weight. The achilles still attacks it but not AS frequently, and the yellow has learned to use its tail to fend off the would-be assassin. It's been 9 days now and I thought that by this time the achilles would back off more. The yellow remains confined to a corner of the tank and it gets punished every time it tries to swim out, which can't be too healthy for the fish, but so far it hasn't gotten any infections and it heals the wounds inflicted upon it fairly quickly.

 

[jnarowe]

sounds lik eit is working out. I have seen this played out more than once, and yellows are tough buggers.

 

[Bax]

Dude

Sorry to hear you are suffering from the HA blight.

I know your pain!

I know you are aware of the troubles I had (two years ago now), I eventually got a Sea Hare and that, visually turned the corner for me and the hare really buffed up the tank. They poo like a 100 Turbos!

But if you think you've got your system back in line otherwise, they are GREAT! cleaners.

As soon as your HA is gone, so are they, and talk about a nasty rotting courpse, yieks! So keep an eye to remove it and hopefully pass it on to someone else.

 

[Dudester]

the ugly truth

the ugly truth

Bax - Yeah, I remember your substantial but brief battle with GHA, and the sea hare really cleaned things up for you. Can you remind me of what species that was, and where did you acquire it? As the pics to follow will attest, I think I'm ready for one!!

It was dying back, but it's already making a comeback. The 2 episodes of 'no lights for 3 days' resulted in some significant coral discoloration and overall displeasure, so I'm not anxious to repeat that any time soon. I'm keeping up with the filter sock changes and the zeovit alterations that were recommended, but I'm still losing the battle.

Jonathan - I believe you about the yellow tangs being tough. As you can see, mine is getting a daily whooping from the achilles tang. For every wound it heals, another couple are added. I'm beginning to feel like I'm cruel and torturing this poor fish by keeping them together, but I keep hoping that they will get along better, and hopefully soon. Despite its obvious thin appearance, it swims with purpose and eats well when it can get to some food. Every time food is placed into the aquarium the achilles attacks it.

And that's the double edged sword, I have to feed a lot and often to ensure the yellow gets his share, but I know that this also fuels the GHA. For now I'd rather ensure the yellow gets enough chow so I'm not going to back down just yet.

Lastly, while I had the camera out, I got a couple (poor) photos of the female Hawaiian flame wrasse. In the first one you can see the male peeking out from his, and her, favorite hang out.

 

[jnarowe]

teh yellow is under stress but doesn't look half as bad as it could. I havea good feeling that he will survive.

As for the HA...that's some thick stuff there. I can't help but think that it is not just fueled by recent over-feeding. Time for a thorough examination of all water quality systems and husbandry, starting at where the water comes from the wall.

Water filtration, salt, plumbing, sand, rocks, light, mechanical filtration, detritus, etc. are all possible areas for excess nutrients.

 

[Dudester]

Agreed, Jonathan. I didn't mean to imply that the GHA was caused by overfeeding, but plentiful feeding isn't helping to get rid of it.

As for the other things you mentioned:
RO/DI: 5-stage AquaFX Mako unit, filters changed regularly and TDS is 0.
Salt: Reefer's Best Salt - The GHA actually arose when I changed from TMPro to this salt. I'm suspicious!
Sand: I was considering siphoning it out gradually since I'll be taking this tank down within the next 6 months.
Light: T5's should last a year without too much decrease in PAR, and it has been 10 months now. I'd like to avoid replacing the lamps if possible since the tank will be taken down soon.
Mechanical filtration: changing filter socks every 1-2 days.

 

[jnarowe]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12979800#post12979800 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Dudester Agreed, Jonathan. I didn't mean to imply that the GHA was caused by overfeeding, but plentiful feeding isn't helping to get rid of it.

As for the other things you mentioned:
RO/DI: 5-stage AquaFX Mako unit, filters changed regularly and TDS is 0.

Just because TDS=0 does not mean that something is not getting into your system through the RO/DI process. Unfortunately there's not much more you can do about it, but I would check your source water for ammonia, and then test the RO/DI water, and your salt water mix. Testing all of these for all parameters may reveal something that you might otherwise miss.

Salt: Reefer's Best Salt - The GHA actually arose when I changed from TMPro to this salt. I'm suspicious!

You would not be the first person to have this happen, and I have seen a LOT written about this. Just based on the posts I have seen, I would probably not even try RBS. because the change in your system is so dramatic, I really would lean toward this as being the causitive factor.

Sand: I was considering siphoning it out gradually since I'll be taking this tank down within the next 6 months.

removing and replacing sand will give your system some extra "buffer zone for nutrients which will become more important during the move. I think this is a good idea, but perhaps you should replace some using a removable vessel so that when you do the move, you will have some "live" but unsaturated sand to easily move to the next tank.

Light: T5's should last a year without too much decrease in PAR, and it has been 10 months now. I'd like to avoid replacing the lamps if possible since the tank will be taken down soon.

I don't know enough about T-5 lighting to really comment other than I doubt that they all have such long "lifespans". What I mean by that is that the color shift over time may aid GHA.

Mechanical filtration: changing filter socks every 1-2 days.

This seems appropriate. Is all of your water going through the socks? And you did not mention detritus. Any acumulated in the sump, overflows, or display?

 

[GSMguy]

there seems to be phosphate in the RB salt this is not the first time i have seen this either.


Jonathan the powermodule cools the ballasts and bulbs in all the right places and the right way, bulbs are just not the problem here.

 

[Bax]

Here's a pic of the Sea Hare. Got him at an LFS, not at all aure of the name.

 

[Jflip2002]

Hey Dudester, you know what DEMOLISHED my HA for me was a large hermit crab. They say theyre NOT reef safe. Im not quite sure why, besides the fact that theyre large and clumsy. I put one in my old tank, where I had hair and that grassy type algae. He devoured it all in a couple weeks. You see him literally ripping it off the rocks and jamming it in his mouth. I took him out as soon as he was done though. Id give that a shot if this fails.

 

[mcrist]

I had the same problem about a year ago and I read a thread about killing bryopsis by raising the magnesium. I knew I just had hair algae but I figured I might as well try it since nothing else was working. Well it worked for me and it hasnââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢t come back.

 

[fishypets]

OH MY

 

[jnarowe]

^^^^

 

[GSMguy]

use Magnesium and wet skimming to get rid of it Mike.

best MG to use is kent tech M it is the most effective.

 

[melev]

Mike, since you are using Zeo, you maintain lower alk. And you don't have a refugium on this system either.

Lights out for three days was originally for Cyano bacteria, although people have tried to use it for GHA, Bryopsis, Ich - you name it. :lol: It would weaken it I'm sure, but you'd have to pluck it out on Day 3 before the lights resumed.

Have you checked your RO water and your mixed saltwater for Phosphate? That could be a source.

If you are feeding the tangs Nori, perhaps two clips would work to keep the fighting down and limit the nutrients in the water. Less food floating around, and still the opportunity for the Yellow Tang to get a meal.

Huge Mexican Turbo snails and a Sea Hare will help, but you definitely need to do some manual removal.

How's the skimmer doing? Are you cleaning the cup and riser daily?

 

[Dudester]

First I'll respond to everyone's questions/comments then tell you what I've been doing.

Jonathan - There's no ammonia in the source water or mixed salt water. The overflow has 2 drains, both of which empty through their own filter sock. This has been very effective at catching any hair algae that is broken loose from the 'rug.' I'll address your comment about the sump detritus in a minute.

GSMguy and melev - Yes, the RBS had a phosphate of 0.008, so while it's not 0, it's not too bad IMO. The ZEOvit should be able to deal with that small amount, and in fact I like the tank's phosphate level to be minutely greater than 0, as I think it's beneficial to corals (akin to a mildly elevated nitrate level).

Bax - Thanks for the photo, I'm on the hunt for 1 or 2 of them.

Jflip2002 - Thanks for the advice, I'll try anything at this point.

mcrist and GSMguy - Since this tank will be taken down relatively soon, I don't think I want to start experimenting with magnesium. If I don't get it under control by other means, I'll just cook the rock, but thanks for the advice, it's appreciated!

fishypets - And to think, one day this will be yours .

melev - See above. Good advice about the nori, although I only feed it 2-3x/week. The skimmer is working fine and I clean the collection cup and riser every other day.


So here's what I did yesterday. Per Jonathan's suggestion I siphoned the very thin layer of detritus out of the sump. I didn't get it all but I got most of it. Next, I resumed the pruning of the GHA. After doing this for nearly 2 hours and making very little headway, I got out a turkey baster to blast off the rocks. When I did this I saw a lot of GHA flying off the rocks, and I was unable to capture it for manual removal. I looked at the filter socks and noticed that they were collecting essentially everything that went into the overflow. So I changed my technique from manual pruning, which takes incredibly long and is very tedious, to Dudester's Turkey Baster Pruning Method. Allow me to explain.

I turned all of the pumps back on and literally scraped the algae off of the rocks with the tip of the turkey baster, all while applying gradual suction on the turker baster. This resulted in a baster containing GHA, which I just emptied out directly into the overflow. The pieces of algae that were dislodged but not captured by the baster eventually made their way into the overflow as well. I continued this procedure for nearly an hour and WOW, what a huge reduction in the algae! The filter bags were changed immediately and they contained a tremendous amount of GHA. I agitated the water in the overflow to ensure no GHA had settled to the bottom, and I even looked inside to confirm that. All of the hair algae had drained down into the filter socks. So this took 1/2 as long as manual pruning, and was at least 4x as effective.

I would not recommend this method to people who have only small, isolated patches of GHA, as this would clearly result in potentially spreading the algae around to different areas of the tank, but when the algae is disseminated throughout the tank already this is a very effective method. I think next time I'll get a toothbrush and scrub the rocks right in the tank, again letting the overflow capture the loose pieces.

 

[jnarowe]

nice work! :thumbsup:

I have never heard of a salt mix that does not contain ammonia.

 

[melev]

Your situation is perfect for that solution Mike. Do me a favor and reply to my PM when you get a second.

 

[Bax]

Dude

One Sea Hare is probably enough, once established, one will eat a ton of HA.

 

[Dudester]

Over the past 2 days I've done a lot more manual labor involving scraping the GHA off of the rocks and siphoning the loose clumps off the sandbed. Here's what it looks like now.

That's a lot of progress from where I was a week ago, but the battle's not yet over. I'm hoping that with the changes I've made in the Zeovit system, plus the manual removal that's been done, that maybe the rest will die off. It may be a moot point, as I might have to take this tank down much sooner than I anticipated. Like, within the next couple of weeks.