Blue Maxima Clam?

[Reef Junkie]

Reef,
You have a few LPS, which also need high alk and calcium, along with some of your softies.

Ray,
DSB are supposed to last anywhere from 5 to 7 years before they crap out without supplimentation.

 

[raycityboy1]

My clams do fine under 3 110W VHOs. They can be put up on rocks but they should do fine on the floor. As long as the lips are out and recieving lights its fine. It sometimes takes 2-3 weeks for them to get good and settled to where they start doing really well.

 

[Reefist]

Well I checked my makeup water and Mg was was only 1160 . So right there is a bad start. About a year ago I switched to Oceanic salt. I used to use IO.And last night my MG was 1080 so I added Tech-M. Each ounce raises Mg level 39ppm( so they say) well I added 3 ounces in various part of my set up and monitored pH . No raise over.1. So I check this morning and it read 990 so something is precipitating Mg. But My tank has reacted positive to the additions but it could be the recent water change kicking in. I'm going to do another one tomorrow.
Also I set my clam straight up towards the light but somehow it always ends up on it's side. Should I just leave it? I don't like to keep touching it.

 

[Reefist]

Oh and BTW my sand is 11 YO. I didn't know it had an expiration date. There is quite an amount of life so what happens after it expires?

 

[raycityboy1]

for them to fall on their side is normal, you just have to keep proping them up. Try to wallow out a little sand bed and nestle him in there, sometimes they will stay put.

 

[onegreenray]

the sand bed will crash and throw off all the parameters and pretty much kill everything. may want to start siphioning it out.

bill correct me if i am wrong.

 

[Reefist]

Theres like 200lbs in there,alot of it is ESV oolitic. Where is the data to substantiate this so I can read it. I don't disagree but there has to be a scientific reason. I'll be switching from a 120 to a 210 someday soon I hope ,so then should I throw away this sand and get new?

 

[Paul B]

Tridnaca clams grow like weeds in the South Pacific. I saw loads of them there in a few inches of water right near the beach where people were stepping all over them. They grow on the sand but they are attached to rocks just below the sand otherwise they would end up on the beach in one of the ever present storms. I diden't see any of them high up on the rocks or in deep water.
Paul

 

[onegreenray]

just do a search on deep sand beds, you will have more then enough to read.

 

[Reef Junkie]

Ray, I am not Dr. Shimek, he's the one you'd want to talk to about a sand bed, but he isn't here anymore. On this board that is.

Sand beds are supposed to have a limited life span and usually when they begin to go bad, it's slow and not very noticeable. I believe you can recharge the bed by adding more sand, but again, ask Dr. Shimek if you can get a hold of him.


but...

Your tank is beautiful, I wouldn't change a thing.

 

[Reefist]

I did that and I didn't find anything that implied removing and replacing .
I read this for now but I'm still looking.

http://www.ronshimek.com/Deep Sand Beds.htm

I also went on Marine Depots Forum under Ron Shimek and asked about the life of SB's . No replies yet. There is however a reccomandation to re-up on detrivore kits regularly in the prvious article. I will keep looking. I did read that the addition of kalkwasser does not add Mg and a depletion can be seen after a year. So I'm looking into that. But I'll keep you posted on Shimeks reply . If I get one

 

[Reefist]

Well I ask him the question:
>I am having difficulty maintaining my Mg and somone told me if I >had a DSB for over 7 years that there are all kinds of problem >keeping Ca Alk and Mg levels up and that I should start >siphoning out my sand and replace it. I asked for data to >substantiate but I havent got a response yet. Is this true My >dsb is 11 YO. Even thought I've kept a reeftank for 11 years I >stilll have no chemistry knowledge other then novice reef >requirements.

>Thanks

>Tom

His Reply:
>Hi,

>You asked, " .... Is this true? /b]

>No.

>Now, the question is why do you believe such a statement?

>Although a sand bed can contribute to the buffering of an >aquarium, if one is using the sand bed as the major way to >buffer a tank, one will have all sorts of problems. Buffering of >alkalinity and maintenance of calcium levels (and I suppose, >magnesium, if you think that is particularly important (I don't)) >has to be done by testing additions of specific additives, and is >largely independent of the sand bed.




>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


>Cheers, Ron
I asked this question to help formulate my own opinions only.
To be honest I have had a few tank crashes.Sandbed related .Actually at the 2 and 5yr marks. But I think of them as reef tank evolution.I have had sand bed polulations explode and die off in less then a weeks time( it seemed) so I don't believe anyone knows. But it is probably more safer to have a dsb in a remote tank which it what I might do in my next set up and just put an 1" in the display tank.But I'm always reef dreaming.
Thanks for sparking my thought process

 

[Reefist]

sorry for the format errors

 

[Reef Junkie]

So Dr. Ron lives.
He got a lot of slack from reefers here when he finally admitted that a DSB might last a limited amount of time.

Honestly, I would leave the questions about a DSB to him and just work on upping your Alk/mg. Not that it's even a critical parameter in your reef tank, again it looks great! Which really is the truest test of aquarium health.

 

[Paul B]

Although I don't have a DSB and never will I can't see how they will last forever. Eventually the spaces between the grains especially at the bottom will bind together completely with dead bacteria, detritus etc. This may not cause problems in itself but the areas that bind like that will become useless at nitrate reduction or anything else. Those places could (and probably would) form hydrogen sulfide which will kill clams and everything else. It would be a gradual process to form hydrogen sulfide but I can't see it not happening in a clogged sand bed. And a DSB by design will compact and become anoxic eventually. If you can see under the tank or in the corners you may see black spots. If you do see it your sandbed is past it's lifespan and you would have to remove all the animals before you disturbed the sand bed so as not to release the sulfide and kill all of your livestock.
My very first tank (a long time ago) was a DSB which turned anoxic. Thats how I learned about hydrogen sulfide.
I know Ron's theories, I have been keeping salt tanks as long as him and as far as I know, he never had a tank long enough to determine the lifespan of a DSB.
Paul

 

[DgenR8]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8769251#post8769251 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Paul B

I know Ron's theories, I have been keeping salt tanks as long as him and as far as I know, he never had a tank long enough to determine the lifespan of a DSB.
Paul

To the best of my knowledge, you are correct. I did tons of reading about Ron's DSB theories. When I found out that he not only is currently tankless, but never kept a tank long term, I began to lose faith in the entire idea.
I still have a DSB in my 55 gallon 'fuge, buit my tank has just enough sand to cover the bottom, and just for looks.
I'm about to break my tank down completely to redo it, and I'm not sure that a DSB will be included in the new plan. I am considering a remote DSB in a bucket. It's easier to take off line if necessary, and changing the sand couldn't be easier than if it's in a bucket.

 

[onegreenray]

Sorry to bring the dsb up but just trying to give a heads up on the controversy behind it. Hate to see such a beautiful tank crash after so many years. But just a thought is all. Trying to cover your entire basis to see why your levels will not stay level up.


I have had hydrogen sulfide release in my tank and it crashed it. It was years ago but not a fun thing.

i agree larry i went sandless for the last year and a half. just recently i added 80 lbs back in the tank but not really deep just for looks this time.

 

[Reefist]

I agree. I have had this deep sand bed for 11 years as previously stated. And I am considering a remote deep sand bed as well. You have to consider the vast amout of sand areas around reefs . I don't even qualify to make that statement but I have snorkled in Mexico and from what I observed there was more sand there then reefs. So I would postulate that it is surface area then depth.With that in mind I will consider a long shallow container with laminer flow.
I didn't mean to say whos right or wrong but I always like both sides of the story. It won't affect my decision to remove sand from my tank but it will definitely sway my next set up.
Tom

 

[onegreenray]

I just didn't want to offend you is all. I agree with the surface area. Just from what I have read on dsb it just seems like a disaster waiting to happen. The remote dsb sounds like a good idea. When I get my own house I will do the same. What are you using to dose magnesium? Home depot has mag flake on hand right now. It is way cheaper then using the other additives.

 

[Reef Junkie]

And they lived happily ever after...
The end.

I recently installed a DSB in my reef, but my tank is not going long term. It will be torn down within 1-2 years. Sand bed will be thrown out. In the meantime, my tanks inhabitants will enjoy the short term benefits of a dsb.