jjk_reef00
New member
Very nice collection stuifbol!
butterflies in reefs
- Thread starter LemonLemon
- Start date
stuifbol
New member
Thnx:mixed:
went after the Adiergastos today....It seems that some new fish in the QT at my LFS are developping some white spots and the Annularis there had some worms....so he said to leave the Adiergastos there till he's healthy for sure....I love my LFS:lol2:
grtz Joeri
went after the Adiergastos today....It seems that some new fish in the QT at my LFS are developping some white spots and the Annularis there had some worms....so he said to leave the Adiergastos there till he's healthy for sure....I love my LFS:lol2:
grtz Joeri
jjk_reef00
New member
All you B/F keeper I highly recommend the tank transfer method for qt on these fish. IME they don't handle cupramine very well. A strong BF will make it through the cupramine treatment but weakened fish often don't (at least for me). I'm doing the tank transfer right now on 2 BFs that didn't react very well to my initial cupramine treatment. This is my first go at it and I really like the results so far.
stuifbol
New member
Maybe if you gradually ramp up the dose of copper there will be more survivors??
Don't know how fast you dose to maximum level???That's one of the reason's why I let my LFS do this for me:mixed:
grtz Joeri
Don't know how fast you dose to maximum level???That's one of the reason's why I let my LFS do this for me:mixed:
grtz Joeri
Yurivd
New member
That is what I have dun with a wrought iron worked perfect !
The only fish that do not take it good is sum wrasses
I have had 100% live rate before I tried it on a feminus wrasse
Since I started using cupramine at much lower than the recommended maximum dose, and ramping up even to that low concentration over several days, I have been very successful with cupramine and butterflies.
LobsterOfJustice
Recovering Detritophobe
SDguy how much lower than the dose on the bottle are you using and how slow are you ramping it up to that dose?
My only experience with copper and butterflies is with a declivis, I treated him several times he "handled" the copper just fine, just wouldnt eat when copper was in the water. I never could get him through a full 2 weeks because of that.
My only experience with copper and butterflies is with a declivis, I treated him several times he "handled" the copper just fine, just wouldnt eat when copper was in the water. I never could get him through a full 2 weeks because of that.
From the seachem website:
"If the bottle has a dropper cap, use 20 drops (1 mL) per 40 L (10.5 gallons*) the first day, wait 48 hours, then repeat. On non-dropper caps, each inner ring is 1 mL. In freshwater use half dose. Final copper concentration is 0.5 mg/L (0.25 mg/L in freshwater). Leave at this concentration for 14 days. Do not redose without testing (MultiTest: Copper™). Although most fish tolerate Cupramine™ to 0.8 mg/L, it is not advisable to exceed 0.6 mg/L copper."
I do 1 drop per gallon on the first day, another 1 drop per gallon 48 hours later, and another 1 drop per 2 gallons another 48 hours later (1 drop per gallon for hardier fish). I then just wait and see. If the fish begin to get better, I stop dosing. If I change water, I will immediately add 2 drops per gallon on new water, wait 24 hours, then add the remaining 1 drop per 1 or 2 gallons.
This has worked for me.
"If the bottle has a dropper cap, use 20 drops (1 mL) per 40 L (10.5 gallons*) the first day, wait 48 hours, then repeat. On non-dropper caps, each inner ring is 1 mL. In freshwater use half dose. Final copper concentration is 0.5 mg/L (0.25 mg/L in freshwater). Leave at this concentration for 14 days. Do not redose without testing (MultiTest: Copper™). Although most fish tolerate Cupramine™ to 0.8 mg/L, it is not advisable to exceed 0.6 mg/L copper."
I do 1 drop per gallon on the first day, another 1 drop per gallon 48 hours later, and another 1 drop per 2 gallons another 48 hours later (1 drop per gallon for hardier fish). I then just wait and see. If the fish begin to get better, I stop dosing. If I change water, I will immediately add 2 drops per gallon on new water, wait 24 hours, then add the remaining 1 drop per 1 or 2 gallons.
This has worked for me.
Dr Colliebreath
New member
I use a similar approach - ramp Cupramine up slowly over 4-5 days and only go to .35 in the absence of identifiable parasites.
Dr Colliebreath
New member
They are all somewhat of a risk, depending on the individual fish and the type of coral. YLN and CBB are two of the best choices to put in a reef with a pretty good chance of them not destroying coral.
stuifbol
New member
Most of the times 0.2 is even sufficient....you can always dose extra if it's not enough....IME
grtz J
grtz J
I really want to try a CBB, but have been afraid due to their captivity history.
Also, would they be ok in a 120 g dt?
djkms
Fish Freak
Getting a Orange Kleini shipped to me tomorrow. I found the article:
http://www.qualitymarine.com/News/Species-Spotlight/Highly-Underrated-Fish---Orange-kleini-Butterfly-%2805/31/12%29
Rather interesting. I did a search here on RC and from the limited experience posted most said they are not reef safe. Well im not one to believe everything I read on the interwebz so im gonna give it a shot! According to QM they are pretty safe except around softies. We shall see how it does in my mixed reef after QT. A buddy of mine ordered one as well to test the waters. Both MAC certified from Fiji I believe.
http://www.qualitymarine.com/News/Species-Spotlight/Highly-Underrated-Fish---Orange-kleini-Butterfly-%2805/31/12%29
Rather interesting. I did a search here on RC and from the limited experience posted most said they are not reef safe. Well im not one to believe everything I read on the interwebz so im gonna give it a shot! According to QM they are pretty safe except around softies. We shall see how it does in my mixed reef after QT. A buddy of mine ordered one as well to test the waters. Both MAC certified from Fiji I believe.
Dr Colliebreath
New member
bamf25,
A cbb will do fine in a 120. You are correct that they are difficult to acclimate and maintain and thus will require additional care (they may only 1 or 2 or3 types of food and you have to be careful to ensure they get enough to eat as they aren't greedy competitors for food).
A cbb will do fine in a 120. You are correct that they are difficult to acclimate and maintain and thus will require additional care (they may only 1 or 2 or3 types of food and you have to be careful to ensure they get enough to eat as they aren't greedy competitors for food).
jjk_reef00
New member
I typically ramp up to 0.5 over 4 days. You are lucky to have such a good LFS.
Here are the ones I've had no problems with:
Chaetodon unimaculatus
Chaetodon lunula
Chaetodon punctatofasciatus - stopped eating for 2 days but quickly regained appetite
Chaetodon mertensii
Chaetodon trichrous
Chaetodon auriga
Chaetodon collare - stopped eating for almost a week but began eating very small amounts and made it out of qt, his appetite was great once he made it out of cupramine and into the dt
These are the ones I've had problems with dosing 0.5 cupramine over 4 days:
Forcipiger flavissimus - was a large size and didn't eat well from the start, also was twitching within a couple of days of receiving it
Chaetodon rafflesi - I've tried 2 of these guys and they both turned a little red in some spots after cupramine. The first one died and the one I have now was taken out of cupramine as soon as I saw any red color and immediately moved into the tank transfer qt. He has stopped scratching and is eating well.
Chaetodon ephippium - I've tried 2 of these with no success, one was a small size. Both picked at food for a few days but died within 2 weeks of cupramine.
Chaetodon pelewensis - ate great for 2 weeks then stopped for 3 days after adding cupramine. Put him into tank transfer and he is now eating again and will go into my dt this saturday
Chaetodon melannotus - I tried 2 of these guys both small, the first one never ate. The second one was eating great and stopped eating and died within 3 days of dosing cupramine. The next time I will definitively do tank transfer on this fish.
Chaetodon falcula - I tried 2 of these guys the first was very large, never really ate. Made it through cupramine but died a few months later in the dt. The second one wouldn't eat at all for a week. I got him to eat some frozen and clam. He started scratching so I dosed cupramine. He was dead with 2 weeks. I also noticed red tint in both of these fish after dosing cupramine.
Chaetodon capistratus and Chaetodon striatus - both are difficult fish that I received as small fish and never really ate. I figured they would die once I dosed cupramine.
I'm way too paranoid to take that risk with my dt even if it is only a 150 now :worried:
jjk_reef00
New member
Almost every BF I've ever received has come in with some disease so qt is a must. I treat every fish with prazipro and I use to treat every fish with cupramine. I will now perform tank transfer, observe the fish and treat cupramine if necessary. I'm not saying not to use cupramine (I will still use it on the majority of my fish that I'm confident will handle it). I'm just sharing my positive experiences with tank transfer with fish I've seen react poorly to copper.
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