Caribbean Biotope Seagrass Tank

I would be very cautious adding Chromis viridis to your tank. There have been lots of problems with Uronema marinum lately, and they seem to be dropping like flies.

That aside, your tank is absolutely, positively stunning! I can't stop reading this thread! I think you've inspired me to add a 200+ gallon seagrass/mangrove forest shoal tank to my bucket list! Royal grammas are one of the fish that really sucked me into this hobby, and seeing the way you've pulled it all together with your unique style of design/upkeep is really incredible.

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Thanks for the tip, Chibils! And welcome!

I'm glad you're enjoying the thread! Thank you for your compliments on my tank! I love your seagrass/mangrove tank idea. I looked past grammas for years. Now I'm loving them!
 
I've never seen a harem of grammas, it's wonderful! I didn't even know you could do that!

I'm addicted to the idea. And I don't have any experience with the chromis personally, but I've seen it on many many threads recently. Uronema is nasty stuff.

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I took a look at the articles and posts regarding Uronema-I had never heard of it! I noticed that none of the posts were made in the last few years. I wonder if the predilection for having it applies to the Blue Chromis, Chromis cyanea. This is the species I'm considering-it's caribbean.

One of the theories posited that since green chromises are small and cheap, they are often badly handled, in their journey from reef to tank, and this may be the cause of their affliction. Whatever the cause, if I decide to get some, they will be quarantined.

Another concern is their tendency to gradually kill each other off. I wonder if there is any way to avoid this. Having lots of caves in the fake wall should help. If you could sex them, maybe a small harem could work. I will not add fish that stress each other, and the other fish in the tank. Besides it being unhealthy for them, it becomes unpleasant to view the tank for me! I want my stress to go DOWN when I watch my aquarium.

Chibils, I have found several species that use the harem social structure. I hope to add a few more.
 
Michael Hoaster said:
I took a look at the articles and posts regarding Uronema-I had never heard of it! I noticed that none of the posts were made in the last few years. I wonder if the predilection for having it applies to the Blue Chromis, Chromis cyanea. This is the species I'm considering-it's caribbean.

One of the theories posited that since green chromises are small and cheap, they are often badly handled, in their journey from reef to tank, and this may be the cause of their affliction. Whatever the cause, if I decide to get some, they will be quarantined.

Another concern is their tendency to gradually kill each other off. I wonder if there is any way to avoid this. Having lots of caves in the fake wall should help. If you could sex them, maybe a small harem could work. I will not add fish that stress each other, and the other fish in the tank. Besides it being unhealthy for them, it becomes unpleasant to view the tank for me! I want my stress to go DOWN when I watch my aquarium.

Chibils, I have found several species that use the harem social structure. I hope to add a few more.
Click to expand...

From it sounds like it, its possibly like Neon Tetra Disease. Both fish are readily available for collection, kept en masse and because they are so easily get, they are cheaper than others and because of poor handling like you said, are stressed and and more prone to diease.
 
Right, nawilson89!

So, between Uronema and Darwinian Selection, maybe I don't want these fish. But I was really wanting to do a school of schooling fish, 'cause, s'cool.

So, what are my other choices? There's a few other caribbean chromises available, but they all get big, mean and ugly-compared to their juvenile selves. I considered getting Silversides. They're kind of plain, but a large school would look super natural! I wish there was a caribbean shrimp fish available. Those would be amazing in the grasses! But, those are more of a seahorse/pipefish, slow fish tank kind of fish, and probably wouldn't keep up at feeding time. The masked goby looks like a good schooler, but kinda small. I'd get a school of butterfly fish if I could, but I can't, with an anemone. I was going to add a school of chalk bass, but I think the grammas would fuss with them, from what I've read.

Oh well, I'm open to suggestions!
 
What about cardinalfish? No, not the two types that everyone has.. (PJ and bangaii)

Like twospots, barred, flame/red, and mimic cardinalfish? I really like the mimic, which is for sure Caribbean, and I really like the yellow/orange lined cardinalfish, but not sure if they are found in the Caribbean.

They only get up to 2.5" and pretty sure they school. Not to mention the bright colors.
 
I considered the flames, but they get a little too big. I'm not familiar with the mimic-I'll check it out. What do they mimic?
 
Looks like they mimic the black-lined blenny. Unlike most cardinalfish that hover in place under a ledge, the mimic's are more active swimmers.

Being that cardinalfish are somewhat a nocturnal fish, I feel like they would prefer to hang around the root on the darker side of the tank which would be pretty cool.
 
My mistake Michael! I did not realize you were referring to Chromis cyanea, since 90% of the time "blue chromis" just means C. viridis to people. You're probably much safer with the blue chromis, at least I would think you are.

Then again, having groups of chromis/damsels seems to be an issue for just about everyone. I think the idea of a school of butterflies is something we've all drooled over - shame about the 'nems though.

And the cardinals... They seem to have the same issue as the chromis from what I've seen. I've actually started a thread in the reef fishes board about this very issue earlier today, to see if there are any successful cases of people keeping groups of Apogon cards long-term.

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OK, Sam, so the mimic cardinal fish is more of a singular or pair bound fish, so not so much of a schooler. A small school of juveniles could work for awhile, but not long term. I'm really looking for something that will stay peaceful and stay in school. I might try a pair of these. They are pretty cool looking fish!
 
Chibils, I'm glad you brought Uronema to my attention, regardless. So the blue chromis is still an option, but I don't want to see six die to end up with one.
 
Nawilson89, I still plan to do a harem of around four cherub angels, but they'll be the last fish I add, so that's a ways off. Right now, I just want to find something I can get 7-10 of, that will peacefully coexist in a school, both as juveniles and as they mature.

Maybe my tank's not big enough. I was thinking that, with all the caves in the wall available, a school of blue chromis might not kill each other off, because anyone getting picked on could escape to safety. It's working with the grammas! I wonder if plenty of feedings would help as well. I would imagine some of the reported aggression could stem from competition for food, in lightly-fed reef tanks. I feed 3 times a day. I have no concerns about overfeeding, so that could help. Maybe my tank situation is different enough, that I could succeed, where others have failed? It doesn't seem likely, but there are a few success stories out there!
 
Michael Hoaster said:
Nawilson89, I still plan to do a harem of around four cherub angels, but they'll be the last fish I add, so that's a ways off. Right now, I just want to find something I can get 7-10 of, that will peacefully coexist in a school, both as juveniles and as they mature.

Maybe my tank's not big enough. I was thinking that, with all the caves in the wall available, a school of blue chromis might not kill each other off, because anyone getting picked on could escape to safety. It's working with the grammas! I wonder if plenty of feedings would help as well. I would imagine some of the reported aggression could stem from competition for food, in lightly-fed reef tanks. I feed 3 times a day. I have no concerns about overfeeding, so that could help. Maybe my tank situation is different enough, that I could succeed, where others have failed? It doesn't seem likely, but there are a few success stories out there!
Click to expand...

I would have thought your tank would have been large enough even for groups of fish at a max of 3 inches. If you were to do chromis would you want to do for more than 10? I don't have a source, but I remember someone telling me long ago that most chromis will kill each other off in small groups, but live better in larger groups.
 
Probably prohibitively expensive, but Holanthias martinicensis is a Caribbean deepwater anthias that gets to a good size (~8in in the wild, probably 5-6 in aquarium) and is very comfortable.

Planktivores, so no worries about nems or sponges or corals. But since it's not regularly collected... Might cost a fortune apiece.


There's also Odontanthias hensleyi coming off the coast of Puerto Rico and possibly Curaçao. Same size, probably same rarity and cost. Also deepwater. 😕
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Chibils said:
Probably prohibitively expensive, but Holanthias martinicensis is a Caribbean deepwater anthias that gets to a good size (~8in in the wild, probably 5-6 in aquarium) and is very comfortable.

Planktivores, so no worries about nems or sponges or corals. But since it's not regularly collected... Might cost a fortune apiece.

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Click to expand...

I never even though about Anthias!
 
nawilson89 said:
I never even though about Anthias!
Click to expand...
After some more research, it looks like Pseudoanthias pictilis is a Caribbean fish! They're available from LiveAquaria and most LFS can probably get them in. Might be seasonal since they're not as popular as lyretails.

... These might be better since you've got a shallow seagrass lagoon instead of a deepwater NPS coral tank.

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Interesting options, Chibils, thanks!

They're probably too big, and too expensive. Plus they are more deep water species. I'm really looking for common, cheap, bullet-proof kind of fish. I'm all about EASY.

Nawilson89, I was thinking a school of 7-10 fish.
 
Good point about the easy, you've already covered that... 😁

The pictilis anthias are similar to any other Pseudanthias regularly available in the hobby. QT properly, prazi them, and make sure they get lots of food and they do pretty well. Some are harder than others but I don't think pictilis are one of them. And they're not deepwater like the others.

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