caulerpa thoughts

[got2envy]

Wow! great read...I <3 Caulerpas of all kinds...I have been trying to get as many as I can for my 40g

If anyone wants to trade...hit me up

 

[listen2bob]

I am one of those lucky 1:1000000 who use it in a refugium of a mix reef tank which has had it get carried away in the display, but have gotten it out of the main display since using a variety of herbivores (emeralds, blue legs, red legs, scarlets, me). Emerald Crabs have been the most successful (other than my 2 hands) at removal from the display. I also have never had it go sexual on me, but I keep it lit 20-24 hours a day. (like having a little down time for the pods and whatnot growing down there) I also dont mind that it traps detritus as I use it as natural floss filter and harvest once a week for nutrient export.

The major downside to its use is the environmental damage that it does as an invasive speies here in Florida as well as many other places in the world. Caleurpa in the wild can and will crowd out native vegetation as well as other sessile inverts.

 

[Dont Ask Me]

I am also a lover of caluerpa(sp?)

I have always used it in my fuges, although i know alot of people beleive in it being lit 24/7 i have mine lit about 15 hours a day (5pm-8am), seems to work great for me and i have never had the problem of it getting in my display.
Must be doing something good, as i dont run a skimmer, my corals are all growing well and water params are always perfect.

 

[Dont Ask Me]

Ill also add i only use taxifolia and harvest a mass amount once every 3 months for exporting nutrients.

 

[Plantbrain]

Keeping macro is not a new concept. In the early 90's the Germans were keeping heavily (and I mean heavily!) planted tanks, and many still do. Most found that while they worked in the short-term, the long-term goal was not being fulfilled. Decaying vege matter and the absorbtion of trace elements, not to mention the risk of it going sexual, were cited for its eventual abandonement. The stuff works great in a species tank, but it fell out of favor in coral tanks for a variety of reasons.

This "issue" was due to not pruning (thus exporting) and keeping biomass table, if you have anything growing exponentially in a small finite loaded space with a finite load of nutrient inputs, it will crash without some rather simple management.

Decay occurs because they do not keep the fuge clean, pruned and tidy.
If the biomass is stable and the load rate is stable, the needs are being met for the macros to grow and the export is done, this a simple 2 box model, system.

It does not fail, the Aquarist's assumptions/neglect and poor management does. All macros, including Cheato absorb trace metals, this is a not an issue if the traces are dosed at a rate high enough for both organisms.

Again, poor management.

My reasons for not supporting it are simple: Cheato is a tougher seaweed, and it's not been found to be invasive like Caulerpa in the environment.

As far as sexual: keep the NO3 at 5ppm or so, do not allow the NO3 to bottom out, it's like poison and causes the weed to go to the sexual spore stage, sort of like stressing a weed that goes to seed, then the seeds come back with a vengence.

It's fairly well known that this genus does not go sexual if the nutrients are stable and high enough. Some use long 24/7 light, but this is wasteful IMO. Just keep the N up a little bit and prune. As long as the N is up and the biomass is stable, things run fine. You also remove the PO4 better this way and run the tank as P limited systems, which is a huge advantage, vs stressing both N and P limitations. You only need one and P is preferred for a limiting nutrient for most systems if you chose one.

Bobbing between N and P at very low levels, then it's better to go to a tougher group, the micro algae: ATS's instead of a fuge with macros.
ATS's can handle leaner/wider ranges.

If you like macros, then focus on their needs.
They will take good care of the tanks if you manage them correctly.

This is more a trade off in management and the aquarist habits desires etc, not the blame of the species. Still, I'd rather not see folks use some members of the genus, rather, Chaeto.

Regards,
Tom Barr

 

[Plantbrain]

I am one of those lucky 1:1000000 who use it in a refugium of a mix reef tank which has had it get carried away in the display, but have gotten it out of the main display since using a variety of herbivores (emeralds, blue legs, red legs, scarlets, me). Emerald Crabs have been the most successful (other than my 2 hands) at removal from the display. I also have never had it go sexual on me, but I keep it lit 20-24 hours a day. (like having a little down time for the pods and whatnot growing down there) I also dont mind that it traps detritus as I use it as natural floss filter and harvest once a week for nutrient export.

The major downside to its use is the environmental damage that it does as an invasive speies here in Florida as well as many other places in the world. Caleurpa in the wild can and will crowd out native vegetation as well as other sessile inverts.

I think you mean CA and the other locations and species?
There's only 1 non native species in the Keys I believe.
I'm not aware it's much of an issue there either. If you have some info, please forward it.

thank you,
Tom Barr

 

[scubabum1983]

love it, still use it. it went sexual on me once and wiped out my entire 90 reef with about 2000 bucks in livestock. but with that said it needs to be monitored understood so far as yes it is a risk. and educate yourself on thinning it out and signs of trouble before you put it in your tank.

 

[Plantbrain]

love it, still use it. it went sexual on me once and wiped out my entire 90 reef with about 2000 bucks in livestock. but with that said it needs to be monitored understood so far as yes it is a risk. and educate yourself on thinning it out and signs of trouble before you put it in your tank.

+1, but many people would swear death and loss of limb before accepting it back into their tank systems if they lost that much$$ in coral:uzi:

So strong feelings of "no way ever again!!!" will prevail.
Without testing it independently, folks gain little insight into what causes the alga to goes sexual, or how to actively induce the macro to go sexual.

Once you know this, prevention and management is far easier and we know a lot more about managing it. There may be more than 1 method or parameter to induce it and compounding factors, like light intensity, alk, Ca, etc.......total biomass etc.

I found bottoming out the NO3 did it consistently with most species.
Some where much touchier than others, some seem fairly tough.

Higher light=> in general=> more likely to induce sexual stages.
At least down to the light compensation points(I only went to about 60 micromols, I'm sure it is lower for some species).

Less care with Alk/Ca= more likely to go sexual/melt.

Less pruning (boom bust biomass, no trimming/export etc) => strong likelihood of melting/sexual at the higher biomasses

Bottoming out of PO4(limitation is moderate to strong), with good NO3(say 5-10ppm)= LESS likely for it to melt/go sexual.

These are general patterns I found.

Regards,
Tom Barr

 

[Norbytattoos]

This "issue" was due to not pruning (thus exporting) and keeping biomass table, if you have anything growing exponentially in a small finite loaded space with a finite load of nutrient inputs, it will crash without some rather simple management.

Decay occurs because they do not keep the fuge clean, pruned and tidy.
If the biomass is stable and the load rate is stable, the needs are being met for the macros to grow and the export is done, this a simple 2 box model, system.

It does not fail, the Aquarist's assumptions/neglect and poor management does. All macros, including Cheato absorb trace metals, this is a not an issue if the traces are dosed at a rate high enough for both organisms.

Again, poor management.

My reasons for not supporting it are simple: Cheato is a tougher seaweed, and it's not been found to be invasive like Caulerpa in the environment.

As far as sexual: keep the NO3 at 5ppm or so, do not allow the NO3 to bottom out, it's like poison and causes the weed to go to the sexual spore stage, sort of like stressing a weed that goes to seed, then the seeds come back with a vengence.

It's fairly well known that this genus does not go sexual if the nutrients are stable and high enough. Some use long 24/7 light, but this is wasteful IMO. Just keep the N up a little bit and prune. As long as the N is up and the biomass is stable, things run fine. You also remove the PO4 better this way and run the tank as P limited systems, which is a huge advantage, vs stressing both N and P limitations. You only need one and P is preferred for a limiting nutrient for most systems if you chose one.

Bobbing between N and P at very low levels, then it's better to go to a tougher group, the micro algae: ATS's instead of a fuge with macros.
ATS's can handle leaner/wider ranges.

If you like macros, then focus on their needs.
They will take good care of the tanks if you manage them correctly.

This is more a trade off in management and the aquarist habits desires etc, not the blame of the species. Still, I'd rather not see folks use some members of the genus, rather, Chaeto.

Regards,
Tom Barr

What's the ATS?thanks great thoughts

 

[Norbytattoos]

I love the stuff

Here is my old 120g seahorse tank that I covered the sand bed with caulerpa prolifera

Hi how is it come the leafs are so short?I have the same but mines are a lot longer...thanks

 

[jraker]

Algae Turf Scrubber

 

[Michael Hoaster]

That may not be C. prolifera.

Where did this thread come from? I don't recall seeing it in the old helpfuls section. Good discussion on caulerpa from a few years back. Tom Barre's posts are very informative.