check my plan please (Ich in 220 reef)

[downset21]

220 gal reef tank: chromis, tangs, angels, blennies, gobies, shrimp, snails, wrasses, etc)

I have ich that is visible on 3 of my fish (two swallowtail angels and a kole tang).

The Plan:

1. 20 gal hospital tank with aquaclear filter, heater, pvc pipes for hiding spots. Use display tank water.


2. medicate with a copper based medication for at least 6 weeks and do weekly water changes.

3. supplement garlic in the food (hospital tank and display tank inhabitants)

4. Avoid catastrophic break down of this tank that I've worked so hard on.






I have been reading frantically trying to figure out how to approach this. I'm sick to my stomach over this and am hoping that I can get some help to tweak my approach here if needed. What I think I am lacking is a means to kill the ich in all of it's stages that are currently in my display tank.

 

[desjardinii]

Recently I had a really bad infestation that seemed to come from nowhere. I had two choices, remove all the fish and treat in a very large hospital tank that could support them for several months or remove all the LR and inverts and convert the dt to the hospital. I opted for the latter but before the replacement bio filtration (marine pure balls) was even seeded enough to support the tank, especially with copper, all the fish started dropping like flies. I now only have one survivor, pretty devastating stuff as my fish were extremely healthy and some very old. I believed they were all fairly immune and was totally unprepared so my only advice is to act fast in case it turns into an epidemic, -good luck.

 

[downset21]

Any treatments to get the free swimmers in my display?

 

[downset21]

Also, im sorry about your tank... This is a nightmare!

 

[desjardinii]

Any treatments to get the free swimmers in my display?

No, you have to remove the fish and wait for the parasites to die out and thanks, it is a nightmare, I'm in the twilight zone atm, one of my fish was over 20 years old, lived longer than any dog I've ever owned...

 

[cknreef]

adding my recent experience with Ich.. came down on my small Potters Angel in a 29bio cube. added two cleaner shrimp and overnight the Ich was gone. Hope this helps!

 

[desjardinii]

I wish it was that easy but shrimp can't eradicate Ich from your tank.

 

[vashawn]

yo bro don't fell bad it happens.
Im going threw this right now. 300 gal mixed reef. Basically I lost a 5" achilles, 10 anthias, 1 borbonius anthias 3 1/2" all because the wife wanted a powder blue. We did QT it for 3 wks but when it went into the display the achilles went after him. They both broke out and infected 1/2 of the tank!
As of now not buying any fish for another 4 mths or more.
survivor are 6" sohal, 2 queen anthias, bellus pair, watanabei pair, purple tang.

I looked at my wife and said this is what happens when u dont listen!!!
I always love the PB tang but there the worst when it comes to ick.
I did a fresh water dip on the survivor and left them in small swimming pool i took for my baby niece. lol.
I used the DT water and treated with copper. Its been 1 week so far. I feed them everything w/garlic. Probaly keep them in the pool until mid nov by then hopeful my DT will be clean.
All other inverts and corals are good.
I plan on doing a big water change in all the sys this sat.
GL...

 

[scooter31707]

IMO, the only effective way to treat and get rid of ich is the TTM. It's much safer than Cooper and less stressful on the fish. Cooper came be ineffective if not dosed at the right dosage (0.5ppm) and can be toxic to fish if overdosed. For as the DT, you have to go fishless for at least 72 days (90 to be safe) to rid ich in there. Cleaner Shrimp "DOES NOT" rid ich.

 

[downset21]

There are so many small fish that hide in or under rocks... this is gonna be hell


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[scooter31707]

Did you quarantine prior to putting them in the DT? If not, I hope you learned a lesson that quarantine is a very safe practice and it can prevent this from happening. Good luck catching the fish. Maybe try some traps, etc. Also a lot of garlic is bad for the fish organs. I only use garlic once a week. I use Selcon (vitamin) every other day.

 

[downset21]

Did you quarantine prior to putting them in the DT? If not, I hope you learned a lesson that quarantine is a very safe practice and it can prevent this from happening. Good luck catching the fish. Maybe try some traps, etc. Also a lot of garlic is bad for the fish organs. I only use garlic once a week. I use Selcon (vitamin) every other day.

I was waiting for this post. No I didn't QT due to space issues and wife complaints about the current large set up. However this has gotten me thinking about purchasing a small plastic cow trough or plastic tub to use as a QT tank or hospital tank in my basement. I have some old fx5 filters that might be serviceable in this regard. Does anybody think the plastic will be a problem?

I have also read about the garlic and I will heed that advice. I will start researching selcon as well. Thanks for the input.


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[homerclease]

I wish you the best outcome possible in your situation. I have dealt with ich a lot in the past. It can kill everything in untreated quickly like stated above. I have seen the tank transfer method work really well. But the display has to stay fish less for 72+ days..

 

[scooter31707]

I was waiting for this post. No I didn't QT due to space issues and wife complaints about the current large set up. However this has gotten me thinking about purchasing a small plastic cow trough or plastic tub to use as a QT tank or hospital tank in my basement. I have some old fx5 filters that might be serviceable in this regard. Does anybody think the plastic will be a problem?

I have also read about the garlic and I will heed that advice. I will start researching selcon as well. Thanks for the input.


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Don't know exactly what that is, but I have had great success with a brute container with a heater, airstone, and wavemaker. To conduct the TTM, all you need is 2 buckets, 2 small heaters, airstones, air pump, and air tubing.

 

[homerclease]

That is the same way my friend does it scooter.. works well

 

[ThRoewer]

I just noticed an ich outbreak in my East Pacific /Sea of Cortez tank, likely due to a temperature dip below 22°C (tank is unheated).

My course of action is as follows:
1. remove all inverts (snails & hermits) I can find.
2. lower the salinity to 1.009 (hyposalinity)
3. wait a month before ramping the salinity up again

All fish in there were quarantined, but they were not all prophylactically treated, particularly not the BSJ which were likely the primary hosts (they were scratching infrequently since I got them).
The fish I noticed having spots were the pipefish and the jawfish - the blennies seem to have enough immunity to fight it off (some of those survived a serious infection in QT).

 

[ThRoewer]

double post

 

[ThRoewer]

adding my recent experience with Ich.. came down on my small Potters Angel in a 29bio cube. added two cleaner shrimp and overnight the Ich was gone. Hope this helps!

Coincident at best. Shrimp can't get to the parasites on the fish and are unlikely to catch all the ripe protomonts before they can encyst.
In theory, in a naked tank, if you have enough shrimp that don't get fed, they may eat the protomonts that fall of the fish. It is for sure not a reliable method to eradicate ich.

Healthy and fit fish can acquire various degrees of immunity against ich after exposure. This is usually behind the success stories of "alternative" treatment methods.

IMO, the only effective way to treat and get rid of ich is the TTM. It's much safer than Cooper and less stressful on the fish. Cooper came be ineffective if not dosed at the right dosage (0.5ppm) and can be toxic to fish if overdosed. For as the DT, you have to go fishless for at least 72 days (90 to be safe) to rid ich in there. Cleaner Shrimp "DOES NOT" rid ich.

TTM is a good prophylactic measure for new fish, but not ideal to treat an outbreak in a well stocked system. If you have more than a handful of fish to treat it not only becomes easily a logistics nightmare but can also be stressful to the fish (not the moving, but being ganged up in rather small tanks).
It can also become costly quickly when you have to fill tanks larger than 20 gallons - maybe shrugged of by some, but definitely something to consider.

Also, IMO TTM is only bullet proof if combined with hyposalinity as there have been observations that ich may encyst on bony structures of certain fish. Hyposalinity prevents ich protomonts (of most strains) from encysting.

And copper would be the last thing I use against ich.

 

[downset21]

I'm definitely going to avoid copper as I've heard that angels are sensitive to it. It looks like I have to try to catch all of the fish. I can't do hypo on my display and the tank transfer method would be feasible if I was only treating the three fish. I'm still trying to get all my ducks in a row here and find space to do something here. I was hoping to have them out by today but it couldn't be done


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[downset21]

Don't know exactly what that is, but I have had great success with a brute container with a heater, airstone, and wavemaker. To conduct the TTM, all you need is 2 buckets, 2 small heaters, airstones, air pump, and air tubing.

Do you bleach the containers after transfer? Also, it doesn't account for the ich that is probably in my tank and I don't have anywhere to keep my fish for 72 days.


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