Coral Tank from Canada (1350gal Display Tank)

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plan is great as usual...but if you run the doser for 1 min. in every one hour,if i am correct,then overflow to the sump as well as to next culture 'point' will occur at that time...

1)will it be enough for rotifers to get ample phyto without any other manual addition/stirring?
2)post larval stage those brine will eat rotifer voraciously...will like to see 2 diff. place for larval and adult brine shrimp culture ,while larval one feeding the mysid also..

Excellent point. The baby brine shrimp may be more photosensitive and thus more likely to overflow to the mysis. You are correct though, a bottle of brine shrimp hatching and manual feeding or a graded (two tank) system would work better.

Mysis will be the slowest growers. I added some macro algae to help sustain them.

The other issue I need to contend with is getting the harvested food to the display. This kind of thing would work better over the display tank, but the only space I have is over the overflows and it would make lighting it 24/7 a problem.
 
I would use holes covered with micron mesh to separate the phyto from the rotifers, so they can constantly feed on the phyto that passes through the micron mesh but not contaminate the culture. My experience with phyto is also that an airline can't give enough flow to keep it from settling in the corners if you use a rectangular breeding vessel. Adding a small return pump is no problem though as it doesn't damage the phyto, you could than pump the phyto from the bottom to the surface in a internal box that also has micron mesh used as a filter so if the phyto does get contaminated it is filtered out in this box. The same filtering on size with mesh barriers could also be used down the line, including one to separate small from large brine shrimp. Added advantage could/would be that the dissolved waste products from the rotifers, brine and mysis can be used by the phyto as food.

Excellent points. One issue would be baby rotifer fitting through the mesh to the phyto. For additional water movement I could use conical cylinders connected together with small pipes. An earlier design was a vertically stacked series of such containers with a drip line or standpipe. It took up too much room and wasn't clean & simple.

I could use magnet spinners or sone kind if a surge for extra water movement.
 
From what I have read on culturing, often it is the algae portion that crashes first. Also, you will probably want to grow more than one type of algae for full nutrition. To accomplish this it seems to me it would be better to have multiple algae vessels that would flow into multiple rotifer vessels, etc. This way the crash of any one element will not necessarily cause your whole feed system to fail. Several breeder suppliers have some form of hanging IV-bag type systems that look both practical and inexpensive.

For artemia cysts, can you not purchase them already decapsulated? That would reduce one more layer of complexity so the system could run hands free longer.

Just random thoughts.

Dave.M

To clarify, this is more of a semi-automated feeding device than an all-in-one farm and fast food. We will have some backup culture vessels for each food item. Manual feeding will be dine with a Baster.

The goal is to provide small amounts of each food to the tank frequently without compromising water quality or making a full time job out of it.

I was thinking of using two that measure 30"L x 12"W x 18"H, but it might be more reliable as more smaller units. Remember each tank is lower as you
Move down the line.

What other kinds of algae are you talking about?

Keep the ideas coming. Once we all agree on a decent design, I will build it and start the testing.
 
Yes ozone contact time can't be beat with these big American brutes. Residual ozone is much less likely with so many organics bombarding the bubbles for a full two minutes.

Have you noticed how often the ozonizer is on/off?

One experiment we may do is a balance between a sterilizer/ozone system and a natural system. The idea is we shut down the pump to the venturi nightly to allow plankton to swim freely without ozone or the skimmer interfering with them directly or indirectly by removing TOC or more importantly, bacteria. We are also considering taking the refugium offline during the day while it is in the dark period so it doesn't release Co2 into the display tank or leach out nutrients during its photosynthetic respiration. This will also limit secondary metabolites (competitive chemicals given off by algae that stunt growth, known as allelopathy). The refugium would go back online during the evening while the lights are on it (reverse photoperiod) so it can convert Co2 to O2 and balance PH while removing excess nutrients.

Our RK2 25PE effluent feeds the refugium so we may be able to accomplish all this with one move. It would just mean shutting the skimmer off during the day or losing our reverse photoperiod for the refugium. I would prefer to shut things down at night while the plankton come out for their nightly swim and coral feeding polyps are open, but there are arguments on both sides of the fence.

good idea

the unit I'm using is on for 10 out of every 12 hrs and I notice a significant improvement in the volume of foam when its on

I'm using this http://www.tmc-ltd.co.uk/aquarium/v2ozone-generator.asp
 
mr.wilson said:
What other kinds of algae are you talking about?
If you are talking about feeding rotifers you are talking microalgae. Different species of microalgae provide different amounts of various types of proteins and fats. You would want a variety of microalgae cultures to ensure a healthful supply and the widest range of nutrients, e.g. Nannochloropsis oculata plus Isochrysis galbana.

An alternative to growing your own algae would be to buy pre-grown and concentrated algae pastes like Instant Algae and dose these to the rotifers directly. That would eliminate one level of complexity in your feeder system and allow for more automation.

djm
 
Chago - have you had trouble with the Merlin ASOV?

I think GE had had its fill of that system.

Russ

ahhhh Russ now I understand what you mean.... and I'm laughing histericly because I mentioned this to Peter in private weeks ago. I told him I didn't want to say it on the board just in case GE does not pull the plug. Although I too heard that there done with the Merlin.
 
I don't have a reef tank but have been infatuated with them since the early 90's.
After alot of research, the attraction then to me was the hobby was far ahead of the professional/scientific community. I decided I really wanted a reef tank. As a kid I managed a tropiocal fish store in Los Angeles, so I knew almost everything about fresh water. But before diving in I purchased and read every book I could find on the subject. I found a couple reef geek guys working in the LFS's and paid them to just have their undivided attention for hours. In 1994, knowlegable but still no reef tank, I attended a reef conference hosted by the Desert Marine Society in Arizona. All the big names were there: Dr Addy, Sprung, Delbeek, Tullock, Frakes, Herstitch, Thiel, and Moe. I was enthralled at the debate as to what was the best practice and "cutting edge" ideas. Just as today, industry and the scientific community are behind this very unique "hobby". After all that time and money spent I realized I did not have the time or funds to devote to a reef tank.

Many years passed and I stumbled onto this wonderful site. I was facinated to see how far the hobby has come and I am still obssesed. This site is quite overwhelming as it has so much information.

I was attempting to go through the topics to see what was new and trendy now, when I found the big tank build thread. At first, I flew through all the big build threads just look to at the pictures, (I like most of us like pictures) and then for some reason I decided to read yours from start to finish. (actually, I read the "reef in the sky" thread first, very cool thread as well)

Anyway, as a pure observer and critic from the peanut gallery, your tank build thread is cutting edge. Don't take this wrong but your actual tank is almost secondary compared to the whole documented/thread on this site. As a spectator, from the outside looking in, I am totally digging this whole thing!

It's been said before but your vision (and i don't mean just the tank) from the start has already been accomplished, ie; the masters, input from the pros and everone else, keeping the integrity of the thread, responding to all, and best practice.

Any guy or gal with the funds could have written the check and ended up with a big L shaped reef tank, but not you.

Thanks, I've enjoyed every page.

Mark.

ps, The most important part is yet to come as far as how the whole thing will look, which is the corals. I have seen pictures of your garden and your wife had to have a similar vision as well. After the hardscape was completed she had to decide on what kind of plants to plant and where, with the knowledge of what they would look like when they grew up. You might want to consult her on the coral placement!

pss, When I finally build my tank, I will have five masters.

Although not in order, now on to a start to finish read on ChingChai's build.
 
Any pics of that new water system yet? Better still...how about the whole fish room?

You can expect a water system update tomorrow night. Chago has one very minor adjustment and it will be ready for prime time. I can tell you as we move to full production that the engineering and workmanship absolutely honours our first principle of best practices. I can tell you it is totally silent. I can tell you the total tds output is..........000. I can tell you that the efficiency of the system is second to none. Finally I can tell you that the design and engineering is totally transparent and honestly should answer any nagging questions that might be hanging out there with respect to RO/DI. It certainly has for me. Pictures and narrative will be up tomorrow night.

Peter
 
I don't have a reef tank but have been infatuated with them since the early 90's.
After alot of research, the attraction then to me was the hobby was far ahead of the professional/scientific community. I decided I really wanted a reef tank. As a kid I managed a tropiocal fish store in Los Angeles, so I knew almost everything about fresh water. But before diving in I purchased and read every book I could find on the subject. I found a couple reef geek guys working in the LFS's and paid them to just have their undivided attention for hours. In 1994, knowlegable but still no reef tank, I attended a reef conference hosted by the Desert Marine Society in Arizona. All the big names were there: Dr Addy, Sprung, Delbeek, Tullock, Frakes, Herstitch, Thiel, and Moe. I was enthralled at the debate as to what was the best practice and "cutting edge" ideas. Just as today, industry and the scientific community are behind this very unique "hobby". After all that time and money spent I realized I did not have the time or funds to devote to a reef tank.

Many years passed and I stumbled onto this wonderful site. I was facinated to see how far the hobby has come and I am still obssesed. This site is quite overwhelming as it has so much information.

I was attempting to go through the topics to see what was new and trendy now, when I found the big tank build thread. At first, I flew through all the big build threads just look to at the pictures, (I like most of us like pictures) and then for some reason I decided to read yours from start to finish. (actually, I read the "reef in the sky" thread first, very cool thread as well)

Anyway, as a pure observer and critic from the peanut gallery, your tank build thread is cutting edge. Don't take this wrong but your actual tank is almost secondary compared to the whole documented/thread on this site. As a spectator, from the outside looking in, I am totally digging this whole thing!

It's been said before but your vision (and i don't mean just the tank) from the start has already been accomplished, ie; the masters, input from the pros and everone else, keeping the integrity of the thread, responding to all, and best practice.

Any guy or gal with the funds could have written the check and ended up with a big L shaped reef tank, but not you.

Thanks, I've enjoyed every page.

Mark.

ps, The most important part is yet to come as far as how the whole thing will look, which is the corals. I have seen pictures of your garden and your wife had to have a similar vision as well. After the hardscape was completed she had to decide on what kind of plants to plant and where, with the knowledge of what they would look like when they grew up. You might want to consult her on the coral placement!

pss, When I finally build my tank, I will have five masters.

Although not in order, now on to a start to finish read on ChingChai's build.


I remember what a profound experience it was for me when I discovered ChingChai's thread almost from its inception. I checked it every day and almost felt the heat and humidity as the tank took shape. I sense that same kind of energy in your post and I am sincerely touched.

I still check his thread regularly as I have learned that this journey truly is a continuing evolution and there are still more gifts to receive from his thread. We do have a strong community in this thread and I'm sure given your tenacity and determination in sifting through the entire history of this build makes you a full and complete citizen. Welcome to the group Mark, we are pleased to have you join.

Thank you for your generous praise.

Peter
 
No need to respond to my response, but you and your team respond to all and I thank you, which is one of the many reasons why all love your whole vision on your endevor.

I have a couple of insignificant micro questions in regards to this thread/novel/text book you and your team are writing:

Did the little "fresh water" clown fish survive?

Are you encouraging Mr. Wilson to publish in the near future? I think he needs a push! I have done it myself, many years ago, a big commitment time wise, but worth it. For him it would be easy, just cut and paste!

Did Mrs. Nineball's flowers change color?



Although I have not yet posted on Mr. ChingChai's build, I can see what an inspiration he was to you. Truly incredible.

I'll be lurking,

thanks, mark
 
No need to respond to my response, but you and your team respond to all and I thank you, which is one of the many reasons why all love your whole vision on your endevor.

I have a couple of insignificant micro questions in regards to this thread/novel/text book you and your team are writing:

Did the little "fresh water" clown fish survive?

Are you encouraging Mr. Wilson to publish in the near future? I think he needs a push! I have done it myself, many years ago, a big commitment time wise, but worth it. For him it would be easy, just cut and paste!

Did Mrs. Nineball's flowers change color?



Although I have not yet posted on Mr. ChingChai's build, I can see what an inspiration he was to you. Truly incredible.

I'll be lurking,

thanks, mark


Yes to all questions..........

The clowns are alive and well in the Wilson Bars. I think I am going to leave them there and see if any of the pairs will produce offspring. It looks to me like they are trying. I have to go to the clown threads to see what I can do to encourage them.

I have been nudging Mr. Wilson on the book writing front but I think we have agreed to bring the "fish room" to full production first then the serious committment to writing can begin.

Not sure what you meant by Judy's flowers changing colour........


Peter

Peter
 
Not sure what you meant by Judy's flowers changing colour........

Way back in spring/summer (hundreds of post ago!!) you were asking (for Judy) how the change colors of flowers by adding something to the soil... pine needles & something else?

I am curious too, do it work?
 
Water Management 101

Water Management 101

This is the update on water management for the entire tank ecosystem. As most know who have followed this thread from the beginning most of the focus (if any, really) on the RO/DI systems was on volume output in GAL per day with virtually no attention TDSI or quality. I just assumed that the fancy box did its job and never started to second guess it until recently when I discovered I had to change most of the media every six weeks. I honestly don't know why the two units failed to operate properly but I do know it was very disturbing to think that I was starting out this adventure with such a poor foundation. I had the good fortune or should I say WE had the good fortune to encounter a knowledgeable resource on the thread who would eventually become a special member if the inner cabinet as I put it. Chago or Drago as he is really known has many similar characteristics that are the hallmark of the good members of this community. He does not mind sharing information. He is passionate about this hobby and he is NOT afraid to say "I don't know". I can attest to the quality of his efforts and his incredible work ethic. He does not relax until it is right which is one of the best instincts for long term business success. None of these traits has hurt the new water system as you will see below. As a member of the inner cabinet Drago is welcome to post a lead discussions on best practices for water management on this thread.
We are now in full production for our new RO/DI system and I am encouraging anyone lurking or following this thread to feel free to ask questions or post comments on the result. Although Drago has accepted the challenge to build an environment that reflects best practices around water quality his water business is more commercial in nature and does not focus on the aquarists community. As a result of watching him work and seeing the results Mr. Wilson and I have encouraged him to think seriously in building some units for folks who are not 'DIY'. I say this because there are some aspects of Dragos design that really address a number of failings with consumer products on the market today. If anyone wants to follow up with Drago for purchase please do it through PM's or off line. This will ensure that this thread continues to be Switzerland when it comes to product placement games that are not welcome. If you are predisposed to the DIY approach then this is definitely the place to ask questions and get advice. Keep in mind that the goal here is best practices not product comparisons or how to get stuff cheaper. If the knowledge base of this community is enhanced we all benefit in just about every way imaginable, and 'THAT' as Martha would say "is a good thing".

I am going to do each picture in its own post so that Drago can use them individually to explain the treatment process simply and clearly.

Peter
 
Way back in spring/summer (hundreds of post ago!!) you were asking (for Judy) how the change colors of flowers by adding something to the soil... pine needles & something else?

I am curious too, do it work?


Awesome, you folks are just awesome. Incredible memories. No the pine needles and rusted iron did not work after one month of trying but aluminum sulfate did turn the hydrangeas a terrific blue.

Boy you guys are great!!!

thanks for the explanation Prairie, its nice to know you are still lurking.

Peter
 
Picture 1

Picture 1

These are the numbers you want to see each and every day when you walk into the fish room.



0_0_627d7dcf9afba3f22da0af54b474da00_1
 
Picture2

Picture2

This is the full wall solution......we could have put it all in its own enclosure but I didn't want that. I wanted it to be very easy to maintain.


0_0_2febc8acd98b0d454425f5a2fdc2821e_1
 
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