Deltec vs Octopus?
- Thread starter nikonosis
- Start date
rock455
New member
No -- In the beginning you need to let it break in and then after about 24hrs you can set the amount of air going into the injector and walk away -- I have the valve about half open and it does great.
I also clean mine about once a month.
If you want one that you don't have to mess with at all you want the Euroreef -- it is literally plug and play --
I didn't like it because I couldn't really control the skimmate to suit me -- The MR-2 is also expandable -- I have visions of a 500g system in total some day and plan to be able to upgrade my MR2 to handle that tank -- which it can do. Also Andy at MRC is great -- service has been excellent.
I also bought a Ca Reactor from him as well as a custom sump for my 110g system.
I also clean mine about once a month.
If you want one that you don't have to mess with at all you want the Euroreef -- it is literally plug and play --
I didn't like it because I couldn't really control the skimmate to suit me -- The MR-2 is also expandable -- I have visions of a 500g system in total some day and plan to be able to upgrade my MR2 to handle that tank -- which it can do. Also Andy at MRC is great -- service has been excellent.
I also bought a Ca Reactor from him as well as a custom sump for my 110g system.
E-A-G-L-E-S
New member
crab0000.....but if there isn't a load(couple fish-few corals-minimal feeding)....WHERE do the excess organics come from for the skimmer to pull everyday?
moonpod
Premium Member
Beckett skimmers are RELATIVELY twitchier and require a bit more maintenance than needlewheels in particular if you try to skim anything remotely dry. If you try to skim anything that's vaguely dry you tend to collect a lot of stuff on the top of the chamber right before the neck and that stuff needs to go regularly to keep your skimmer going. This is IMO the result of relatively large bubbles generated by beckett injectors. If you set the thing up well on the install of the skimmer, then in general the only other thing is to clean the beckett injectors regularly b/c all manner of "stuff" will get into them. People with little snails in your tank, these things will constantly end up in the injectors, I have no friggin idea why. I have owned a MR3 and it was a good performer, but you're either a beckett devotee or you are not. Nothing "wrong" or "right" about one or the other, they are just different.
nikonosis I have owned an ER 8-2 standard (obviously this is back in the day) and an ER 6-2 RC with a "SP pump" instead of the old sedras. The....thought that goes into these units vs a Deltec is...not comparable. They check enough to make sure the pump won't flood the chamber but beyond that....They've changed the lineup now and I think they've eliminated most of the models that were dogs, but...they still don't compare in terms of performance in the same footprint.
Now here's the rub--what is that worth to you and is the price differential meaningful to you. Now I will say this: the price difference between ER RC units and H&S and Deltec RC units ain't all that much IMO. So...
As for the smaller units and when you begin to compare to stuff like Octopus and Corallife superskimmers, blah, blah, blah, the first thing I will say is that these units are great for the more economical and yes larger segment of the market. IMO they represent a significant effort to mass market a better skimmer than the previous seaclowns and whatever else. The next thing is that they don't really compare on a size basis to what you can get performance wise with steps up in the "skimmer heirarchy". HOWEVER that by no means=your reef is gonna fail without one of these high end units. Again, it's a relative value thing. I've got a bit more slack in my budget and space constraints were a problem for me so what did I buy....a bubble king. That doesn't mean I couldn't find an ASM that would work for my system (well actually given what I want out of my skimmer I couldn't), or a cheaper option, but this skimmer gave me the best combo of size, performance, low heat input, silence and electrical effeciency that were important to me. To someone else it isn't worth it however and there's nothing wrong with that.
nikonosis I have owned an ER 8-2 standard (obviously this is back in the day) and an ER 6-2 RC with a "SP pump" instead of the old sedras. The....thought that goes into these units vs a Deltec is...not comparable. They check enough to make sure the pump won't flood the chamber but beyond that....They've changed the lineup now and I think they've eliminated most of the models that were dogs, but...they still don't compare in terms of performance in the same footprint.
Now here's the rub--what is that worth to you and is the price differential meaningful to you. Now I will say this: the price difference between ER RC units and H&S and Deltec RC units ain't all that much IMO. So...
As for the smaller units and when you begin to compare to stuff like Octopus and Corallife superskimmers, blah, blah, blah, the first thing I will say is that these units are great for the more economical and yes larger segment of the market. IMO they represent a significant effort to mass market a better skimmer than the previous seaclowns and whatever else. The next thing is that they don't really compare on a size basis to what you can get performance wise with steps up in the "skimmer heirarchy". HOWEVER that by no means=your reef is gonna fail without one of these high end units. Again, it's a relative value thing. I've got a bit more slack in my budget and space constraints were a problem for me so what did I buy....a bubble king. That doesn't mean I couldn't find an ASM that would work for my system (well actually given what I want out of my skimmer I couldn't), or a cheaper option, but this skimmer gave me the best combo of size, performance, low heat input, silence and electrical effeciency that were important to me. To someone else it isn't worth it however and there's nothing wrong with that.
moonpod
Premium Member
The frequency of need to clean your beckett injectors varies with one if you are monitoring air injection (put an air guage on the beckett and clean when the it drops--which of course will make you clean your injector more frequently) and two if you've got certain things in your tank like little strombus snails that friggin procreate like crazy and the little baby snails can get EVERYWHERE in particular in my experience my injectors causing obvious drop in air injection.
E-A-G-L-E-S
New member
moonpod.....(your thoughts would be appreciated)
.....but if there isn't a load(couple fish-few corals-minimal feeding)....WHERE do the excess organics come from for the skimmer to pull everyday?
.....but if there isn't a load(couple fish-few corals-minimal feeding)....WHERE do the excess organics come from for the skimmer to pull everyday?
moonpod
Premium Member
pollutants from the air. Your arms sticking in the tank. Life processes in the tank. What happens when you combine CO2 with light energy in a photosynthetic animal? You generate sugars and carbohydrates which become...TAH DAH....ORGANICS! Essentially there are always organics in there being produced, albeit feedings add to it much more rapidly than photosynthetic processes.
Frankly, realistically, I've never seen an "overskimmed" system. I don't believe such a thing exists b/c ideally your skimmer is so overpowering you strip the organics out before they have a chance to sit around. Like BAM. I've got a BK400ext on my tank which is an absolute beast and I can still grow chaeto in my fuge at a good clip. Granted I also have way too many fish and I feed excessively, but....I like it like that ya know?
Frankly, realistically, I've never seen an "overskimmed" system. I don't believe such a thing exists b/c ideally your skimmer is so overpowering you strip the organics out before they have a chance to sit around. Like BAM. I've got a BK400ext on my tank which is an absolute beast and I can still grow chaeto in my fuge at a good clip. Granted I also have way too many fish and I feed excessively, but....I like it like that ya know?
E-A-G-L-E-S
New member
but on a large skimmer(for the tank its cleaning) shouldn't there be weeks where you've pulled out alot, then the weeks where you don't?
ClarkiiClownfish
Active member
I have been in this hobby a decent amount of time (close to 12 years). In that time, I have made many, many, many mistakes that have eventually lead to losing huge chunks of green from my wallet, and a lot of this has come from purchasing skimmers that did not meet expectations. Here is one thing I have learned.
Spray injection skimmers, beckett skimmers, venturi skimmers.....hang-ons, stand alones, sit-in-sump, etc, etc, etc.
I have tried them all.
I am almost ashamed to put this out there, but I spent well over $2500.00 in the first 10 years in this hobby on skimmers for my tanks, BEFORE I broke down and bought a Deltec. I never did get great results, even from an AquaC EV400.
Then I saw a Deltec in person...in action.
I immediately went home and got on the pc and started researching Deltec. Before I saw one in person, I had heard of them, but like a lot of people here just thought they were way overpriced.
I broke down and spent the money on an AP902.
The AP902 pulled out more foul skimmate in 3 weeks than the EV400 did in 3 months.
I spent over $700.00 on that EV400.
I sold it 4 weeks later for $200.00 and didnt even have it a year.
Since then, my Deltec has been performing like no other skimmer I have ever seen in 12 years in this hobby. Why you ask?
I dont know! But I am sure you will argue with me until you are blue in the face, but I dont care. In my opinion, there is no comparison to a Deltec. Why you ask do I feel this way about my Deltec? One word. Experience.
The self-cleaning head is also something that drew me to the Deltec. And that is something that I have not seen any other skimmer manufacturer offer.So I bought one of those too. And it is great. Now my AP902 is pulling even more skimmate, and I have to do less maintenance. AWESOME! Not to metnion my tank has never looked better and been healthier.
So go ahead and bash me for buying an overpriced Deltec with the self-cleaning head. Argue all you want. I think it stems from jealousy anyway. You want one, but probably cant afford one, so you are trying to justify to yourself that they arent worth the money...when in fact, they are worth every penny.
After unsing 6 different kinds/brands of skimmer in the first 10 years I have been in this hobby, I am just so very happy that I will not be buying anymore "underpriced" skimmers that are not well engineered or designed and made of inferior materials. Cuz I know what I get when I buy one of those...and I know from EXPERIENCE that you get an "inferior" skimmer.
Spray injection skimmers, beckett skimmers, venturi skimmers.....hang-ons, stand alones, sit-in-sump, etc, etc, etc.
I have tried them all.
I am almost ashamed to put this out there, but I spent well over $2500.00 in the first 10 years in this hobby on skimmers for my tanks, BEFORE I broke down and bought a Deltec. I never did get great results, even from an AquaC EV400.
Then I saw a Deltec in person...in action.
I immediately went home and got on the pc and started researching Deltec. Before I saw one in person, I had heard of them, but like a lot of people here just thought they were way overpriced.
I broke down and spent the money on an AP902.
The AP902 pulled out more foul skimmate in 3 weeks than the EV400 did in 3 months.
I spent over $700.00 on that EV400.
I sold it 4 weeks later for $200.00 and didnt even have it a year.
Since then, my Deltec has been performing like no other skimmer I have ever seen in 12 years in this hobby. Why you ask?
I dont know! But I am sure you will argue with me until you are blue in the face, but I dont care. In my opinion, there is no comparison to a Deltec. Why you ask do I feel this way about my Deltec? One word. Experience.
The self-cleaning head is also something that drew me to the Deltec. And that is something that I have not seen any other skimmer manufacturer offer.So I bought one of those too. And it is great. Now my AP902 is pulling even more skimmate, and I have to do less maintenance. AWESOME! Not to metnion my tank has never looked better and been healthier.
So go ahead and bash me for buying an overpriced Deltec with the self-cleaning head. Argue all you want. I think it stems from jealousy anyway. You want one, but probably cant afford one, so you are trying to justify to yourself that they arent worth the money...when in fact, they are worth every penny.
After unsing 6 different kinds/brands of skimmer in the first 10 years I have been in this hobby, I am just so very happy that I will not be buying anymore "underpriced" skimmers that are not well engineered or designed and made of inferior materials. Cuz I know what I get when I buy one of those...and I know from EXPERIENCE that you get an "inferior" skimmer.
aurorafish
New member
Well , i do maintaince on a tank with a deltec 850, one with an h&S 200 (2 eheims), and can say they both perform very well. Both are very quiet and pull good "nog", do not add excess heat to the system,etc.The only bad note for either one in my book is a bit high of a price at initial purchase and down the road(replacement pumps). For my personal tank I run a large mazzei venturi (1 inch mazzei Lifereef) 5 foot tall with an iwaki 55 driving it. This replaced the 850 on my system. It outperforms the 850 and is close to the H&S 200. But it does require a powerhog pump and the skimmer is silent but the pump is not!! Of course you need a dedicated fish room or a really tall stand to run it. I have not used the octopus although would be very curious to see it in action. Possible easy mods might be as simple as a gen-x needlewheel or OR needlewheel, not sure till I see one locally. The ASM's are ok for a budget and have plenty of friends with them, but they leak water and cannot be run externally, they pumps are a bit loud and the ones with multiple pumps add excess heat to the system (problems for some, for others not an issue) but, the pricing is great. Euro reefs- have seen many working very well, but they seem unsure on pump selection at the present moment. One important skimming factor that seems to be under-represented on RC is that your whole system has to be designed to get the organics to the skimmer effectively to let the skimmer do its job. Things like skimming a thin slice of the display tanks water going directly to the skimmer with the proper turnover rate, and keeping detrius from settling (good flow) are ultimately what will allow you to maximize the potential of whatever skimmer you are using. I suggest trying to locate someone local with the particular skimmer you are considering and going to see it in action, as that is the true test.
tacocat
Premium Member
"Deltec uses pumps that are manufactured to their specs by Eheim and Aquabee. You pay for that also."
Im pretty sure most the companies that make skimmers, match their pumps to their skimmers.
I forgot to clarify that the pumps manufactured for Deltec are completely different than off the shelf pumps. Their impellor housings are slightly bigger. The pump bodies are not compatible with standard Eheim pump bodies.
"Deltec has along standing reputation for relaibility and good customer support. You pay for that also."
Tunzes has great customer support and makes skimmers, does that mean I should buy one of theirs?
Sure
"If you have $5,000 to $10,000 in livestock, you typically want the most reliable skimmers available."
Yeah, they use Eheim pumps, which are the most reliable pumps around. If the Octopus used one, I would consider buying one.
Personally, I wouldn't buy an Aquabee powered skimmer. They have a good reputation here in the US, but they have been complained about on the other side of the pond.
According to most vendors who sell them, they need frequent cleaning (not attractive to me).
Im pretty sure most the companies that make skimmers, match their pumps to their skimmers.
I forgot to clarify that the pumps manufactured for Deltec are completely different than off the shelf pumps. Their impellor housings are slightly bigger. The pump bodies are not compatible with standard Eheim pump bodies.
"Deltec has along standing reputation for relaibility and good customer support. You pay for that also."
Tunzes has great customer support and makes skimmers, does that mean I should buy one of theirs?
Sure
"If you have $5,000 to $10,000 in livestock, you typically want the most reliable skimmers available."
Yeah, they use Eheim pumps, which are the most reliable pumps around. If the Octopus used one, I would consider buying one.
Personally, I wouldn't buy an Aquabee powered skimmer. They have a good reputation here in the US, but they have been complained about on the other side of the pond.
According to most vendors who sell them, they need frequent cleaning (not attractive to me).
Hello All,
I own an H&S skimmer, and I am very pleased with it, is it worth the extra money I spent? In my mind YES.
I travel allot and when I had my Aerofoamer clone skimmer it would be very temperamental to the point that it would go out of wack and overflow sending all the crap into my tank.
I never once have had that problem with my H&S skimmer. Prior to making my choice I did not find that Deltec was a better product than H&S in fact H&S is better built, and they both performed equally, yet H&S costs less money.
Needle wheels will wear especially due to the force being used to move air, so somewhere down the line you will have to replace it on a Deltec, H&S or other brands.
I feel the high price for these parts are mainly due to protecting there product from copies. I also do not think Ehiem guarantees there pumps when used or modified in these cases, simply because it was not made to work in that manner. Hence a higher replacement cost for the Deltec and H&S manufactures,since they most likely have to absorb these costs themselves...this is just speculation on my part on why they are more expensive.
Also Deltec and H&S both share the patent on the needle wheel design so they are only protecting there market would you do any different?
If they gave there design away you would have a whole lot of knock offs using there impeller and that would not be good for there business which they have invested much time and money to make there product what it is today if you didnââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢t have them there probably wouldnââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢t be a needle wheel skimmer and we would all be using beckets.
I disagree that Ehiem sells special pumps to Deltec and another type to H&S I feel this is false, I took an Ehiem 1260 out of its box and popped in the needle wheel impeller from my H&S with the modified volute and worked all the same.
Does my Skimmer perform better than another needle wheel skimmer, I would say YES mainly due to the Eheim pumps.
Would your livestock suffer because you purchased a less expensive needle wheel skimmerââ"šÂ¬Ã‚¦ I doubt it .
I have seen a whole lot of nice reef tanks that donââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢t use the brand name, but everyone has different husbandry methods of keeping there reefsââ"šÂ¬Ã‚¦I for example feed my fish 6 times a day with a automatic feeder and am away often I do 10% water changes once a month, others who may buy lower quality skimmers may do water changes every week to two weeks, test like mad, feed sparingly, and spend a lot of time monitoring there tanks, Time is money guys think about it.
What it all comes down to is what your needs are, how do you care for your reef.
I own an H&S skimmer, and I am very pleased with it, is it worth the extra money I spent? In my mind YES.
I travel allot and when I had my Aerofoamer clone skimmer it would be very temperamental to the point that it would go out of wack and overflow sending all the crap into my tank.
I never once have had that problem with my H&S skimmer. Prior to making my choice I did not find that Deltec was a better product than H&S in fact H&S is better built, and they both performed equally, yet H&S costs less money.
Needle wheels will wear especially due to the force being used to move air, so somewhere down the line you will have to replace it on a Deltec, H&S or other brands.
I feel the high price for these parts are mainly due to protecting there product from copies. I also do not think Ehiem guarantees there pumps when used or modified in these cases, simply because it was not made to work in that manner. Hence a higher replacement cost for the Deltec and H&S manufactures,since they most likely have to absorb these costs themselves...this is just speculation on my part on why they are more expensive.
Also Deltec and H&S both share the patent on the needle wheel design so they are only protecting there market would you do any different?
If they gave there design away you would have a whole lot of knock offs using there impeller and that would not be good for there business which they have invested much time and money to make there product what it is today if you didnââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢t have them there probably wouldnââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢t be a needle wheel skimmer and we would all be using beckets.
I disagree that Ehiem sells special pumps to Deltec and another type to H&S I feel this is false, I took an Ehiem 1260 out of its box and popped in the needle wheel impeller from my H&S with the modified volute and worked all the same.
Does my Skimmer perform better than another needle wheel skimmer, I would say YES mainly due to the Eheim pumps.
Would your livestock suffer because you purchased a less expensive needle wheel skimmerââ"šÂ¬Ã‚¦ I doubt it .
I have seen a whole lot of nice reef tanks that donââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢t use the brand name, but everyone has different husbandry methods of keeping there reefsââ"šÂ¬Ã‚¦I for example feed my fish 6 times a day with a automatic feeder and am away often I do 10% water changes once a month, others who may buy lower quality skimmers may do water changes every week to two weeks, test like mad, feed sparingly, and spend a lot of time monitoring there tanks, Time is money guys think about it.
What it all comes down to is what your needs are, how do you care for your reef.
Last edited:
clkwrk
Active member
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6668624#post6668624 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by nikonosis
How do you know its a piece of junk? Do you know anything about them at all? Here is a comment from a deltec owner that just saw one in a LFS.
"I own a Deltec APF600 and I was shown one of these to compare. From first impressions the bubble size looked tiny enough but seemed to be injecting less air than my Deltec. As clkwrk said the union turned me off. The other thing I noticed was it has a fairly long neck which would seem to work against getting a good foam reaching the collection cup. The collection cup seemed small but not a big deal unless you are leaving on vacation for 2 weeks. The tank rating seemed to be right in line with Deltec's. With the air injection being lower I would question that.
The skimmer was not actually on a tank yet so I can't comment on the skimmate etc.
Overall seemed to be a neat unit. Quality and customer service will be 2 things to watch for in the coming months."
When i see pictures like this after it running for a couple hours, im pretty impressed
Sorry but my g-3 had that beat in an hr. IMO the octopus are cheap skimmers. Do they work yes . The actual construction is a slap together product and the price reflects.IMO
clkwrk
Active member
especially when you can look at 4 of them side by side and they don't have the same specs? Big ones have the nice large acylic ring like ers to stop the overflow .While others are shorter and allow an overflow . Sloppy glue job also on the bodies of the skimmers. Looks like on good hit and it will break apart at the seams.
JMO
JMO
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