noobtothereef
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Ive read alot of posts regaurding tangs and theyre proper tank size etc, i here alot of mention these dinner plate size tangs, anybody ever seen one of these elusive swimming dinner plates? Got any pics?
Dinner plate size tang
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LemonLemon
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sure.
i have seen near 1ft black tangs in my country before. one LFS brought those giants in two or three times before.
here's another giant black tank posted by myerst last year. (i hope you don't mind me sharing your pics).
i have seen near 1ft black tangs in my country before. one LFS brought those giants in two or three times before.
here's another giant black tank posted by myerst last year. (i hope you don't mind me sharing your pics).
Steve,
Your statement goes back to another thread from last week. Do you mean to say that there are no dinner plate sized tangs in home aquariums because they grew so large that they died as a result?
I'm more inclined to say the reasons are due to captive stunting and to the fact that the mortality rate of fish in some home aquariums is high enough that the far end of the bell curve gets truncated.
I've asked for examples of acute death caused by lack of swimming space, and haven't seen any results.
I have a sohal that is 13 years old, in a 700 gallon tank and is only 7" long....I would say it is stunted, and not destined to become plate sized.
Jay
Your statement goes back to another thread from last week. Do you mean to say that there are no dinner plate sized tangs in home aquariums because they grew so large that they died as a result?
I'm more inclined to say the reasons are due to captive stunting and to the fact that the mortality rate of fish in some home aquariums is high enough that the far end of the bell curve gets truncated.
I've asked for examples of acute death caused by lack of swimming space, and haven't seen any results.
I have a sohal that is 13 years old, in a 700 gallon tank and is only 7" long....I would say it is stunted, and not destined to become plate sized.
Jay
Any idea why? I am pretty sure others have grown larger sohals in smaller tanks.
A friend has a 200g tank with very little rockwork (two islands). His blue hippo tang has barely hit the 4" mark in a few years now. Not normal...
Peter,
No idea - the fish is perfect in all other respects. It lived for five years in a 350 gallon tank, but that shouldn't have initiated the stunting.
I think three things are in play here -
We know that stunting of long term captive fishes does ocurr, (even in the absence of identified husbandry issues)
People tend to use the maximum Fishbase size as "normal adult" size for fish (like saying I'm too short at 6' 1" just because there are 7'4" basketball players)
Less common, but proabably a factor - just because a fish is not sexually dimorphic in terms of coloration does not mean that females and males are identical in all respects. I have the opinion that many huge Naso unicornfish are actually "supermales" like is seen in many wrasses. These huge males are more a function of the social heirarchy than anything else, and in captivity, they may not express those attributes (again, like many wrasses and hogfish - even parrotfish).
Jay
No idea - the fish is perfect in all other respects. It lived for five years in a 350 gallon tank, but that shouldn't have initiated the stunting.
I think three things are in play here -
We know that stunting of long term captive fishes does ocurr, (even in the absence of identified husbandry issues)
People tend to use the maximum Fishbase size as "normal adult" size for fish (like saying I'm too short at 6' 1" just because there are 7'4" basketball players)
Less common, but proabably a factor - just because a fish is not sexually dimorphic in terms of coloration does not mean that females and males are identical in all respects. I have the opinion that many huge Naso unicornfish are actually "supermales" like is seen in many wrasses. These huge males are more a function of the social heirarchy than anything else, and in captivity, they may not express those attributes (again, like many wrasses and hogfish - even parrotfish).
Jay
scchase
Premium Member
I think a lot of it is genitics as well fish from different areas grow to different sizes. The vast majority of fish do not reach max size as well. Ask any fisherman abou thow many trophy (in aquarists eyes full grown) fish the catch versus smaller ones the numbers aren't even close.
myerst2
Active member
I agree with what wa said above simply put, you can't exactly replicate natural conditions. That rostrum I had was 10"+ when I sold her. She had grown an additionally 1 1/2"-2" over the course of a year and a half that I had her and that was in a 180. I'm pretty sure the fish is still alive and living in a 450 gal reef. T
Perhaps it is their diet. My desjardini was larger than 7" at 2 years old. It is probably 8" now, as is my hepatus.
I don't know how you can have an "absence" of husbandry issues. Whether "identified" or not, they exist by definition.
noobtothereef
New member
So im guessing that the largest tangs in captivity would be salad plate size im assuming? Considering the growth stunting in captivity? I just hear this sooo much saying that these tangs get dinner plate size and some cannot be kept is 500g- tanks, i do agree that they need large tanks but do not agree with the whole dinner plate argument.... or maybe im just a big eater and my dinner plates are bigger than others....
I'm not sure what you are driving at.
noobtothereef
New member
Im just trying to find somebody with a dinner plate size tang in home aquaria
Well, I have seen fairly large tangs in aquaria. My Sohal was 10" when I removed him from a 350 gallon tank because he was so terribly ornery. When I got him, he was less than 3 inches. I don't know if s/he was stunted but at that point was 7 years old with me. Turns out the fish lived about another 5 years with someone else but I do not have size after my tenure as his keeper.
Well, I am not sure if I intended to say that, but it may be possible and I may be inclined to agree with your additional assertion about the bell curve getting truncated.
Brian,
When I said, "In the absence of identified husbandry issues" I simply meant that there are no identified husbandry issues that would cause the symptom. It leaves open the possibility that there may be unidentified husbandry issues. If there were identified husbandry issues, then they would be corrected by us (but I've seen them sometimes go uncorrected in hobbyist tanks).
It is unlikely to be diet in this case. The fish is fed by professional aquarists, and the diet has been analyzed by nutritionists at a University, and adjusted accordingly. Besides, there is an Acanthurus xanthopterus in literally identical conditions that IS platter sized, so it seems to be something specific to the sohal.
Other fish known to stunt to a high degree in aquariums include asfur angels and some triggerfish. Some fish that don't (or at least not enough!) include sharks, pacu and pangasids.
Don't get me wrong, I've written extensively on aquarium animals to avoid; at least three articles and a section of a book. Large adult size was a main criteria that I used in evaluating fishes to avoid. Pacu, nurse sharks, pangasids and redtail catfish are among the worst. Surgeonfish just never made it to any of the lists I've developed - they do for specifically undersized tanks, but not as a group. If I added them, there would be no rational reason not to add wrasses, parrotfish and a host of other wide-ranging species. I'd even have to include anthias. Although site-specific, they swim miles each day to hold themselves stationary in the current off the reef face.
Jay
When I said, "In the absence of identified husbandry issues" I simply meant that there are no identified husbandry issues that would cause the symptom. It leaves open the possibility that there may be unidentified husbandry issues. If there were identified husbandry issues, then they would be corrected by us (but I've seen them sometimes go uncorrected in hobbyist tanks).
It is unlikely to be diet in this case. The fish is fed by professional aquarists, and the diet has been analyzed by nutritionists at a University, and adjusted accordingly. Besides, there is an Acanthurus xanthopterus in literally identical conditions that IS platter sized, so it seems to be something specific to the sohal.
Other fish known to stunt to a high degree in aquariums include asfur angels and some triggerfish. Some fish that don't (or at least not enough!) include sharks, pacu and pangasids.
Don't get me wrong, I've written extensively on aquarium animals to avoid; at least three articles and a section of a book. Large adult size was a main criteria that I used in evaluating fishes to avoid. Pacu, nurse sharks, pangasids and redtail catfish are among the worst. Surgeonfish just never made it to any of the lists I've developed - they do for specifically undersized tanks, but not as a group. If I added them, there would be no rational reason not to add wrasses, parrotfish and a host of other wide-ranging species. I'd even have to include anthias. Although site-specific, they swim miles each day to hold themselves stationary in the current off the reef face.
Jay
Well, since the OP was looking for large tangs, I thought I'd grab a picture of one for them (an Acanthurus xanthopeterus mentioned in my previous post):
I didn't put a tape measure to this fish, nor did I have time to use my laser measurement technique, (http://microcosmaqx.typepad.com/jay...ement-of-a-fish-length-estimation-method.html) but I'd say this fish is close to 18" long TL:
Jay
I didn't put a tape measure to this fish, nor did I have time to use my laser measurement technique, (http://microcosmaqx.typepad.com/jay...ement-of-a-fish-length-estimation-method.html) but I'd say this fish is close to 18" long TL:
Jay
noobtothereef
New member
was that tang collected that large or did it grow that large in a home aquaria?
Perhaps if you could explain the purpose of your inquiry we could be of more help.
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