DIY Icecap...its not what you think

Victor,
A thousand times thank you for all the info youve shared!
Are the ballasts the same ones you started with? any problems with themburning out, etc?
Your bulbs are all 4', right? So for running 18" bulbs with the 32w ballasts, (given you swapped from 4x to 2x) sounds like we should just use one lead per bulb, running them 2x.
I was curious about the heat / efficiency with 2x vs. 3-4x. Thanks for the input.
I put 2- 32w leads to a 9w pc- WOW! Don't know that I'd run it there though:)
Chris
 
Well, I was just about to pick up my order at my local electrical store, and then I decided to finish the last couple of pages of posts on this subject....so let me get this straight, Victor, you are no longer using the 4x f32 t8 ballast to light up one t8 bulb??!! I've just finished this 14 page thread and I am, to say the least, confused! But, if this experiment has no good ending, then please make it real clear for me.....Thanks.........H.I.D....KEVIN......OVER.....
 
reefburnaby said:

I am using URI actinics for my lighting. It is working really well and I have used them for 6 months. To drive them, I just use the 4x configuration. I like these more than the T8 actinics and they cost about the same. In fact, I was burning T8 actinics at a very fast rate -- they only last about 3 months. The actinics still come one, but they don't have much actinic power (spectrum shift). Basically, I built a single lamp, low cost, Icecap.

- Victor.
Click to expand...
I take it that you are using the URI actinics VHO and are overdriving them at the 4x, there is no trouble overdriving a T12 on the electronic balast made for T8? Whic of the URI do you think work best with the overdriven NO? the R, White ,or Aquasun?

Do you think that this ends ub being a good light source? I am going to be setting up my new tank and am thinking of using this setup for my 75.
Thanks
 
H2Ogen,

Yes, I still have the same ballast that I have had from the start. They are holding up and I expect them to run for more than 5 years. The temperature from the ballast is warm to touch.

Yupe, I am still using 4 footers and I would suggest the 2x configuration unless you are using T5s or PCs (which can operate better with high temperatures) or you have good cooling.


HID Kevin,

I am no longer using 4x on my T8s since they just burn extra power, produce extra heat, shift the spectrum and generate approximately the same amount of light as the 2xs. Feel free to use 4x, but I have found that 2x is better than a 4x. I only found this out when I bought a PAR meter and started measuring my tank. My T8 actinics were not doing well in overdrive, so I switch to VHOs. So, the 2x overdrive and the switch to VHOs were the biggest changes over the last year. Otherwise, I am still a avid promoter of this technology.

I am still using T8s and I think I will use them for a long time. At least I will continue to use them until 6500K T5s become available in reasonable quantities. I have no plans to go to HID any time soon.

So, is that clear enough ?

Marm64,

Yupe, I am using the URI actinics with 4x configuration. Looking at the tube ends, the tubes look pretty good and show no blackening in the last 6 months. I think VHOs are more robust when they are operating high temperatures, so most VHOs will work well in the 4x configuration. Keep in mind that a 4x will be close to the Icecap (minus the soft start and dimming). Since actinics fair worse than 10000K in regular VHO conditions, the Aquasun and white will do better.

I still think that 6500K T8s will work just fine for 6500K lighting, but the T8 actinics are not good for overdrive.

- Victor.
 
............Thanks Victor, and if you could give me one more question asking session........first, the F32T8x4 ballast is still the same electronic ballast for all applications. I think I'm clear on that. But, while I'm also clear on the T8 xonly 2 bulbs per ballast vs. one bulb per ballast, I'm not clear on the VHO stuff. I'm assuming that the VHO is a T12, and the URI is a name brand of a type of VHO bulb? If so then, I will need 1 VHO white or aquason bulb, made by URI, per ballast x4 set up??!! Or is URI some other type of something I haven't caught on to yet?!!!!!!! And, I know that Actinic bulbs of some sort are the reason for this question! Swear, I went to college and all, but I'm not sure. And, I should be sure before I dive in the deep end!..........H.I.D....KEVIN.....OVER.....................
 
great ideas here!!! currently working on my od system now (lucky me I buy light/ballasts all the time for my company, so REALLY cheap prices on normal items :)).

Anyway, I was playing with the outputs of the ballast to actually see how much brighter the lights would get with each overdrive. While I was doing this, I thought "what if the each overdrive on the lights where on a timer too?" This would let each overdrive (1x,2x,3x, and 4x) come on at diff times of the day (thus mimicking high noon time). It might be more work than its worth, but really neat idea.
 
jjkahler,
I did the test with each lead, too. neat huh! Try it with a 9w pc!!!WOW. Wore goggles for that one :)
Your timers would have to run relays to feed the 600v leads through. May be more cost effective to run each ballast on different timers.

PS: What kind of plant do you run, chief?
Chris
 
I too am confused like HID.

I don't understand the URI VHO part. What are you using to drive the URI, another ballast? Certainly not a VHO (ICECAP) ballast?
 
...from another thread I was able to figure out that URI is a manufacture of the VHO type tubes. I think!! And, I do believe, after reading Victors recent posts several times, that he is using the same F32 T8x4 type electronic ballast to power these VHO tubes to a wattage near the Icecap. And, the original T8 tubes of the 6500k type daylight tubes are being overdriven by only 2 times vs. the original 4 times overdriving that Victor started with a year ago or so. Or course, I could be wrong!! I hope that Victor will post soon to completely clear this up, yet I think it's rather clear now. .....H.I.D....KEVIN......OVER..........
 
Hi,

Sorry for the delay and confusion.

URI is a bulb manufacturer.

http://www.lampsnow.com/superactinicr2.html

Since T8 actinics were not working well, I switched to VHOs. I just swaped the 4x overdrive T8 bulb with the VHOs. Hence, I drove 4x overdrive in to the VHOs.

So how does that work ? Well, the F32T8X4 ballast is designed to pump out ~200mA of lamp current in to each bulb. By jamming 4x 200mA in to a single lamp, we pump 800mA in to the VHOs. Since most VHOs take 1.6A of lamp current, 800mA is about 50% of the designed lamped current. Icecap does something similar (i.e. a HO ballast driving a VHO lamp). HOs in the T12 format consume approximately 800mA of lamp current.

Confusing ? I guess it is. An electronic ballast is quite versatile since its main objective is to regulate the lamp current. The constant lamp current is what allows a single ballast to drive a variety of lamps - from PCs to VHOs. Each bulb type needs a specific lamp current to operate at a certain brightness. For example, F40T12s (4 foot T12s) need about 430mA of lamp current. On the other hand, F32T8 (4 foot T8s) need about ~230mA. So, a ballast that was design to drive a single T8 would drive a 4 foot T12 at 50% brightness. By overdriving, you can power the T12 to full or greater brightness. So, what about voltage across the lamp ? Well, the ballast takes care of that since it can operate in a wide range of voltages. Of course, there are limits to the voltage range and it limits the ballast's ability to overdrive certain lamps. T8s that are less or equal to four feet usually draw around ~200mA and T12s that are less or equal to four feet usually draw around ~400mA. HOs usually draw double the base bulbs and VHOs usually draw 3x to 4x the base bulbs -- hence a T12 VHO draws 1.6A.

Hopefully that clears some of the confusion. Feel free to ask more questions.

- Victor.
 
If you can only overdriving the VHO at 800mA and they should have about 1.6 A are you then only able to get about 50% of the light out of the VHO? Oh the web site you posted they only give about 110 w so this would be more like 1A as opposed to 1.6 A or am I missing something here?

What size tank do you have and what are the bulbs you are using and how much are you overdriving them?

Thanks for all the great info
 
Hi,

Fluorescent lamps are design to operate at its top efficency near room temperature. Anything outside of that range (either lower or higher), the efficiency and light output will drop.

VHOs run hot when 110W is applied to the lamps. In turn, the light efficiency drops. So, if we were able to apply 85W to the VHO, the tube will not get as hot and it will be able to increase its efficiency. Whether the gained efficiency is large enough to compensate for the drop in applied power is questionable. However, if the light output only drops by 15% and you are consuming 70% of the 110W, then the advantages are clear. Use of the electronic ballast also provides slightly higher light output for the same applied lamp power. This is the same ideas that Icecap has been applying to their products. The bonus feature is that VHOs with reduced applied power seem to last longer.

I have not had a chance to measure a full 110W actinic vs my VHO. Based on my measurements, the actinics produce almost the same amount of PAR as my 6500K. My current setup was not intended to bring the maximum amount of power from the actinics. They were just installed to replace my dismal T8 actinics.

My tank is a 90 Gallon tank - 24" deep, 18" wide and 48" long. The sand bed is about 6 inches deep. As you can see, this tank is rather difficult to light was conventional fluorescent lighting.

I hope that helps.

- Victor.
 
Victor,

Thanks again for this GREAT solution. I've been using it for about 3 months and have been very happy with the results. I will try the 2x modification as this sounds like a better long term plan.

For all those looking for reflectors: www.reflect-a-light.com has a AWESOME reflector kit for this application. I bought a 3 light kit (KSM4/SA/4) for under $20 delivered.

Question: Does the VHO bulb use the same bi-pin connector as the T8/T12 ? Any good sources for the URI bulbs.
 
VHO's use the same pins.

NorthCoastMarines seems to have one or two of the URI bulb sizes on sale every Month.

Thanks for the reflector link.
 
Reefer2 :

Any thoughts on how one could fit 4 bulbs with that reflector? What is the width of your reflector? Could you add a single bulb reflector in a 48x18 inch canopy?

Where is the pricing on their web site?

As far as URI, I found ordering from ThatFishPlace does not charge extra for bulbs. I've order from others and been charge upto 8.00 for a box for the bulb.

thanks
 
GROSSR:

I'm not home so I can't measure it now, but I believe it's 12" wide. You should be able to add a single bulb reflector on the side of this one, depending on how your canopy is setup. The kit does come with mounting HW and 6 nice bi-pin connectors. I used 1/2" plywood to secure it to my canopy.

Pricing is not listed. I called the distributor directly. I'm not certain that they'll sell to the public. The salesman asked me for a company name, but did not require a TIN. I ordered 3 reflector kits at $14 ea and the S&H was under $9.

Thanks for the bulb info.
 
I paid $10.60 for 6 bi-pin connectors.

My wife owns an antique shop, I could say it is for the fixtures in her store.

Should not be a problem.

thanks
 
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