DIY LEDs - The write-up

[blasterman789]

Go back to page 171 there is a good summary there. It should answer most of your questions.

Sez "Use Cool-white or royal blue". Wow....I'm surprised. I wasn't aware you could mix all CCT colors with a RB and a CW.

Lots of options there.

You know, many of the recent commercial fixtures I'm seeing hit the market aren't Cree based, and they are starting to mix other LED colors other than RB and 'Street Light Bin' cool-whites. But, they are making and selling lights commercially while you guys aren't. Is there a connection there?:lol2:

I'll PM Misos with some options to do what he wants - Not what you want.

 

[der_wille_zur_macht]

My question is: How many, of what colors would the experts here suggest I use. I started out doubling the OP. But my inexperience tells me I need guidance.

Two disclaimers:

1) LED color choice, ratios, etc. are a rather personal thing, in the same way that some people like 20kk MH and others don't.

2) LEDs as used for reefs are still relatively new, and people are trying different combinations of different LEDs every day, so even the best "rules of thumb" are more or less in a state of flux.

That said, there are basically two decisions to make:

1) Which model(s)/bin(s)/etc. of LEDs to use?
2) Which colors, and in what ratios to each other?

To answer question #1, most people place overall efficiency as a high priority. Currently, that means that Cree products win out - the XP-G for white, and the XP-E or XR-E for colors.

To answer question #2 - well, that's the point at which personal preference and other factors have a strong influence. MOST people follow the "standard" choices that Soundwave laid out in his build - a mix of cool white and royal blue LEDs.

If you use XP-G for the cool white and XP-E for the royal blues, you'll probably want to be somewhere in a 60:40 ratio of royal blue to cool white. If you "cheap out" and use less-powerful LEDs for either color (XR-E whites, Luxeon Rebels, eBay China Special, etc.) then you may need to adjust the ratio depending on the relative intensities of the LEDs you use compared to XP-G/XP-E.

Some people have begun experimenting with neutral or warm white LEDs. The results aren't really "in" yet so consider this an experimental option - the vast majority of DIY builds have used cool whites though, so to some people that may be the "safest" choice.

Whatever direction you think of going, especially with a large build, I'd suggest ordering a few dozen assorted LEDs and a few drivers, and play with different combos. Then you can order the rest of the LEDs you need based on your own impressions.

 

[der_wille_zur_macht]

You know, many of the recent commercial fixtures I'm seeing hit the market aren't Cree based, and they are starting to mix other LED colors other than RB and 'Street Light Bin' cool-whites. But, they are making and selling lights commercially while you guys aren't. Is there a connection there?:lol2:

Yes. The connection is this: DIY'd fixtures are done according to the individual's goals, which may vary. Commercial fixtures are done with the goal of making money. Often this means that the fixture is based on a design that will not exactly comply with any one individual's goals. For instance, many commercial fixtures use LEDs that produce less light per unit of power consumed - in other words, they are less efficient. This gives the manufacturer a profit boost, since the less efficient LEDs are cheaper for them to buy.

'Street Light Bin' cool-whites

Not that it matters, but since you brought it up: after being involved in a project to retrofit a 1,000+ acre campus with LED street, parking, and interior lighting, I can officially comment that the color bins used in commercial street lights are not the same as the color bins typically recommended in this thread for reef aquariums. If anything, a typical street light uses warmer bins. Again though, I don't really see the correlation?

I'll PM Misos with some options to do what he wants - Not what you want.

You constantly insinuate that you have some revelation of knowledge that the rest of us chumps aren't capable of grasping. This is a public discussion forum, created to share and spread knowledge about the hobby. If you've got such amazing ideas, could you please share them with us? We'd love to learn.

You also seem keen to insinuate that those of us who choose to answer frequently asked questions with the most widely accepted answers have some hidden, personal agenda. I'm not really sure where you got that impression. If you've got a bone to pick, let's get it out on the table so we can all move on.

 

[laverda]

I'm still waiting for somebody to verify the below steps-I feel like it is missing one thing.
DWZM gave this advice to someone else on testing/adjusting the amperage of a led string.
Take the last wire from the "-" pad on the last
LED, and connect it (securely, with alligator clips or some other
solid method) to the "+" lead on the multimeter. Then, connect the
"-" lead on the multimeter to the "-" lead from the driver. The
meter is now in series with the LED string.
Turn the meter on, then plug in the LED driver and check the reading on
the meter.
I did all of this (i did not power up driver yet-just a test run) What about the red wire from the driver?
Sorry to keep bugging you guys about this- I feel really dumb.
Wade

The red wire goes to the first + led pad at the other end of your string of LEDS. Your volt meter should be set at amps for this test.
It is ideal if you have a second volt meter so you can read the voltage at the same time, by hooking it to the outputs from the driver. The red lead to the red wire and the black lead to the black wire. Your meter should be set to DC volts using a scale higher then the driver can out put. For a 48 volt driver you want the 50, 100 or 200 volt DC scale depending on your meter.

 

[blasterman789]

To answer question #1, most people place overall efficiency as a high priority

Again, sez you.

Most people buying and ordering LEDs aren't reverse coding the actual flux and bin they are getting. Big difference between the efficiency of 6700k XP-G/XP-E -vs- 5000k.

So, if efficiency were really the goal, everybody would be specifying XP-G R5s in the highest possible CCT bin, which they aren't.

Most people I know going DIY right now are actually trying to keep costs down, and yet there's a pretty substantial premium for the high flux XP-Gs.

If the Rebel for instance is the result of 'being cheap' then perhaps we need a rep for the $4000 light mentioned above to be able to defend his product. I don't see you selling anything.

 

[Taqpol]

Sez "Use Cool-white or royal blue". Wow....I'm surprised. I wasn't aware you could mix all CCT colors with a RB and a CW.

Lots of options there.

You know, many of the recent commercial fixtures I'm seeing hit the market aren't Cree based, and they are starting to mix other LED colors other than RB and 'Street Light Bin' cool-whites. But, they are making and selling lights commercially while you guys aren't. Is there a connection there?:lol2:

I'll PM Misos with some options to do what he wants - Not what you want.

I'm starting to think Blasterman is just a troll. For all his inflammatory remarks, I have never seen him show his amazing "non-CREE, non 3W LED" that is apparently so much better then the "Street Light Bin" LEDs that the majority of DIYers use for their power and efficiency.

Its 72in by 25in by 18in. I wanna be able to (eventually) keep any darn thing I want to in it (as my experience warrants).

My question is: How many, of what colors would the experts here suggest I use. I started out doubling the OP. But my inexperience tells me I need guidance.

I can follow the directions on building them, thanks to the OP's concise instructions. Just having a bit of trouble with the amount, pattern and placement of them!!

Oh Yeah.....this is gonna be a peninsula tank also.....if that makes any difference.

Thanks ahead of time!!!

Misos, I just completed a build for a six foot long tank, and if you go to my homepage and then click on one of the first links named "Taqpol's DIY LED Build" it will take you to a thread where I discussed various construction issues as well as a lot of pictures showing the spread of different optics that we have available to DIYers. I did end up using some CREE Neutral Whites in my white strings, but only because I thought I would like a slightly warmer color. My tank is too new and unstable to really show of coral pics yet, but I will try and get some true color pics of the light in general as soon as I get my SLR back.

So far my favorite DIY LED fixtures color is that produced by Sammy113, I think you can find his thread on here somewhere. Still, all the LEDs we've been working with lately have the PAR to make corals grow so the choice of color is largely personal.

 

[der_wille_zur_macht]

in the highest possible CCT bin

Can you please explain the relationship between "the highest possible CCT bin" and success in a reef tank? I'm missing the relationship you are trying to imply here.

Most people I know going DIY right now are actually trying to keep costs down, and yet there's a pretty substantial premium for the high flux XP-Gs.

Many people are also smart enough to recognize the difference between upfront and longterm operational costs - the "premium" you pay for an XP-G now pays for itself in a few months/years in terms of higher output.

I don't see you selling anything.

Exactly my point! I'm NOT selling anything. I'm here to help, not to knock down others' methods, browbeat people, or make a profit.

 

[westmoorenerd]

Is there any way to get blasterman banned from just this thread? lol

 

[TheFishMan65]

Let's all give blasterman some credit now. He actually came back and responded to a post to his post. I have asked question of him several times and he never seemed to post again. So perhaps he will decide to share his vast knowledge with us.

 

[The Grim Reefer]

noob alert!!!!


I'm gonna bug ya'll with some questions.

I've posted before about a 180gl. I was planning, but I got a really good deal on a 135gl. so thats what my tank is gonna be.

Its 72in by 25in by 18in. I wanna be able to (eventually) keep any darn thing I want to in it (as my experience warrants).

I was looking at that really cool Vertex illuminata......$4560...Aint happening!!!

So I'm looking into DIYing my own.

My question is: How many, of what colors would the experts here suggest I use. I started out doubling the OP. But my inexperience tells me I need guidance.

I can follow the directions on building them, thanks to the OP's concise instructions. Just having a bit of trouble with the amount, pattern and placement of them!!

Oh Yeah.....this is gonna be a peninsula tank also.....if that makes any difference.

Thanks ahead of time!!!

If you ever have an occasion to be in the Denver area feel free to stop in, I can show you what I've built for my 120. Give you a good idea what you'll need to get the results you want over your 180.

 

[The Grim Reefer]

Of course I don't sell anything so my opinion is baseless

 

[beeker]

for colors i suggest cool white, royal blue, cool blue(470nm) and neutral white, this is what i have over my 200g dd, i'm in the process of getting 8 more PAR38's for my 200g 4 20k's with 40 optics and 4 all royal blue bulbs with 60 optics, so i will have a good mix of color over my rockwork

I'll try to have some new pics up in the large tank forum within the next 4-5 days

 

[pheinzig]

Hey yall,
I was thinking last night about adding T5's to my existing Array.
I was wondering if adding a couple Ice-cap's and T5's to run the length of my 68" array
might off set some of the color loss that LED's promote long term. T5's being realistically cheap to operate and replace are a viable addition IMO.

Any thoughts/comments?

 

[Frode]

Hey yall,
I was thinking last night about adding T5's to my existing Array.
I was wondering if adding a couple Ice-cap's and T5's to run the length of my 68" array
might off set some of the color loss that LED's promote long term. T5's being realistically cheap to operate and replace are a viable addition IMO.

Any thoughts/comments?

As you can see in my post yesterday I plan of integrating my DIY LED project into my ATI T5 fixture.
My 32 Cree LED (20 x Q5 XR-E Cool White, 12 x XR-E Royal Blue) build is now side to side with the 6 x T5. But I want to mix the lights more.

I really think it's a great combination. I will be adding 10 more white LED (Cree XP-G R5), and loosing 2 x T5.
To compensate for the more white LED's I'll probably replace 2 white-blue T5 with actanic.

 

[peterbrescia]

Does anyone know how to test to see whitch led is making electrical contact with the heatsink?

-12 roial blue connected to a Mean Well ELN-60-48D with a pot. powered by 9v battery (temporary)

My led do go on, they do dim (but do have a dead zone at the beginning of the pot.) but I see a very low glow when the dim is turned all the way down, and if I touch the heatsink with my finger they get slightly brighter.

Here's the link to my progress so far:
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1894951

 

[TheFishMan65]

Measure the resistance from each LED contact to the heat sink. It should show infinite or no connection.

IIRC Meanwell have a sudden on like 15%. So the "dead zone" sound normal.

What else are you touching when you touch the heat sink?

 

[peterbrescia]

what setting do I use on th emultymeter?

Is ther a way to get read of that ded zone, I would like to dim the blues for moonlight as well.

I'm not tuching anything else
(I guess I have an electrifing personality) :lolspin:

 

[der_wille_zur_macht]

what setting do I use on th emultymeter?

Many multimeters have a "continuity" mode. Use that if yours has it. If it does not, use the lowest resistance mode - it'll be something like 200 ohms. If you get ANY reading between the conductive path (LED solder pads, wiring, etc) and the heatsink, you have a problem. Narrowing down the problem can be tricky, but try probing from each LED's solder pad to the heatsink.

Is ther a way to get read of that ded zone, I would like to dim the blues for moonlight as well.

Not with Meanwell drivers - that dead zone is an inherent part of the driver's circuit. Even with drivers that DO allow full dimming (buckpucks, many DIY drivers), you still would probably be unhappy. A dozen HP LEDs even at 1% is still way too bright for what most people would want out of a moonlight. IMHO, if you want a moonlight, rig up a few common high output LEDs (3mm or 5mm "gumdrops") on a wall wart with current limiting resistors.

I'm not tuching anything else
(I guess I have an electrifing personality) :lolspin:

I would go so far as to not even power it on if you know there's a problem - find the fault and fix it first!

 

[peterbrescia]

Thanks for the help.
I've been tryng to catch up with this thead for a while but I'm still on page 80something.

 

[der_wille_zur_macht]

Based on what you posted earlier and in your other thread, I'm guessing your array had multiple shorts to the heatsink, and it now has fewer. So you are making progress but not quite there yet.

Good soldering technique and clean connections can't be stressed enough here. Strip only as much off the end of each wire as you need. Use an iron powerful enough to create the solder joint quickly. Insulate your screws. And so on.