DIY Sump Design

[aSmallcat]

Nano.. That's not what I've been told.

"Kaldnes K1 Media
Kaldnes Moving Bed process, which has been scientifically tried and tested in fish farming and waste water treatment for over 10 years, is now available for fish keepers and is exclusively distributed worldwide by Evolution Aqua. The media is engineered in a wheel shape and is slightly positively buoyant. This allows a small amount of water flow to circulate the media throughout the vessel. This flow is created with your air pump and air stones or diffuser etc."

Source:
http://diypondfilters.com/media-information/

"None of the common filters used on freshwater tanks use anaerobic bacteria. Sponges, HOBs or canisters, all rely on aerobic bacterial colonies to convert the waste products from fish. There are two main types in our filters; nitrosomonas and nitrobacter. One converts ammonia to nitrite, the other converts nitrite to nitrate. Nitrate is the end product and the amount of nitrate in the water can be reduced by plants, by water changes or both, or by using specialized filters that are rather expensive."

Source:
http://www.myaquariumclub.com/anaerobic-or-aerobic-filtration-7934.html

 

[aSmallcat]

<a href="https://ibb.co/jwFev5"><img src="https://image.ibb.co/hcMKv5/Screenshot_20170624_204308.png" alt="Screenshot_20170624_204308" border="0"></a>

 

[SFish]

That's because he thought you were setting up a salt water tank. This is a salt water form not fresh water. You would be better off posting this on a fresh water site. In salt water you want anaerobic bacteria. By the way that picture is a DIY reactor. Also if you make a small chamber in the sump and run like this you basically made a reactor. The problem with air stones is they plug. Reactors use water to tumble the media. If it's not tumbled it's going to clump up and plug. The idea of the air stone is to tumble the media.

 

[NanoReefWanabe]

And nitrate is not the end of the cycle.. nitrogen gas is. And personally I don't think it matters what kind of tank is set up fresh or salt... dumping dirty water into a bunch of media and filter pads is a bad idea

 

[SFish]

Yes if that's the first section of the sump then it will be a detritus trap. You might as well run a wet/dry filter. Then again maybe you can get a way with it in a fresh water tank but in a salt water tank that would be a problem.

 

[aSmallcat]

I did post this same thread on a freshwater only forum but there are considerably more people at reef central. So I got more feedback from here.

You're right the chamber I was thinking about making is basically a type of reactor. I wanted to use the force of the incoming water but I don't think it'll be strong enough. I'll just buy some media and do a test. Worst case I add an air pump to help circulate.

 

[aSmallcat]

If the fluid bed is moving as it's supposed to I don't think it'll get clogged. One way to find out though for sure right?

 

[SFish]

You establish bacteria in this media which means if you remove it when it plugs you remove the good bacteria which is not what you want to be doing. I garuntee all kinds of crap is going to get trapped under that stuff. It's not a matter of if but when it will clog and if you don't take care of it your NH3 will spike. People went through this with wet/dry filters and there is more space between the balls then what you will have.

 

[aSmallcat]

I wouldn't remove the k1 unless it just wasn't working as you suggest it might not. If it remains fluid I belive the bacteria will grow and due to the colliding pieces the detritus will also remain small and fluid until it is completely broken down or until it moves on the the next chamber.

 

[SFish]

What's going to happen is a bunch of crap is going to get trapped in that stuff some of it will possibly break free and move on to other sections. This is a recipe for disaster. You would be a 1000x better off running a skimmer. You have already made up your mind though and the only way your going to learn is by dealing with the problems this system will cause. I would keep some algae stuff on hand. What's funny as h ll is they claim this stuff is self cleaning. Oh and this stuff is not meant to trap detritus.

Good Luck

 

[SFish]

Note



Note

 

[SFish]

Your set up uses biological media as a mechanical filter as well which is why it's going to fail. This doesn't even take into account that all that trapped waste is going to decay inside the media and cause an algae bloom.

 

[aSmallcat]

I ordered some k1 media today. When it comes in I'm going to test how well it moves under falling water from my overflow. Keep in mind it's buoyancy will change after it becomes properly colonized by bacteria. But at least I'll have a better idea if I'll need an air pump as well to facilitate enough movement.

 

[aSmallcat]

Your set up uses biological media as a mechanical filter as well which is why it's going to fail. This doesn't even take into account that all that trapped waste is going to decay inside the media and cause an algae bloom.

What do you suggest I use as a mechanical filter? I could pre-filter with a sock or something.

 

[SFish]

First of all if you put this stuff in a mesh bag is it going to interfere with it tumbling? The mesh bag is also going to trap detritus. The big problem would be decaying material. Also if you just put the mesh bag by the pipe it's not going to work all that well anyway. Your going to end up channeling around it. These types of media's are a dime a dozen. A lot of them are BS. They are trying to do what live rock does. I would not have picked this media to begin with. You can do the same thing with a ceramic block with out the air pump bs. If you insist on using this stuff then yes I would put a filter sock first or something along those lines. If you really want a good system then I would put a small skimmer in. Forget about the filter sock and keep everything in suspension and let the skimmer take all the crap out. Less work and cleaner water. Also no risk vs a filter sock but you would have to do something to make sure nothing gets trapped in the media you have.

 

[aSmallcat]

Only the course, fine and chemical media will be bagged. The k1 would be free floating in chamber one blocked from traveling the sump by a plastic mesh at the top.

 

[aSmallcat]

The activated carbon will be in a tight mesh bag and the rest in very open mesh bags. The openings in the bags are only as small as they need to be in order to contain the media inside.

 

[aSmallcat]

Testing out my overflow and return. Everything looks good. I think I'll drill another hole in the overflow though for a backup drain. I'm using a ball valve to regulate so it could easily clog enough to cause a problem. A second unregulated pipe will solve that easy.

 

[SFish]

You never want to put a valve on an overflow pipe like that. For the very reason you stated. You need to regulate the flow at the return pump. That overflow is not meant to have two holes. It also looks like you have it going to slow. Not sure if that tank can be drilled for an overflow but it would have been safer to. HOB overflows can fail. If you can I would get rid of the 45 amd have the pipe go straight down. My guess is the return pump is to small. What does the head height curve say?

 

[aSmallcat]

Yeah the return pump could be bigger. There would be no point in regulating this one as it's already open full and not enough to keep up with my overflow.

Next size up it is.