Feeding a mandarin goby

[afm32607]

I read a post here that linked to an advanced aquarist article, I think, regarding feeding do mandarins and getting them to eat frozen. The author said he put his mandarin fish in a net breeder and fed live and frozen foods until it ate the frozen. Just wondering if anyone else might have a link to the article. I finally bought a mandarin and now I can't find the link. Any help? (Also willing to read any other link anyone might feel helpful if I haven't already seen it).

75 gallon with sump and refuge but not sure that helps all that much. Will also put some sump rocks into pod condo type thing but I really want to get it to at least try prepared foods.

 

[afm32607]

Also a net breeder at the top of the tank seems very stressful esp at night when it wants to hunt and sleep. Thoughts?

 

[Reef Frog]

I saw that article in CORAL magazine about 2 years ago. Not sure if it's available on line.

The author marinated live brine shrimp & frozen mysis shrimp together in Selcon so they smelled the same. He first started feeding just brine exclusively. The current trapped them in the corner of the net box where they could be slurped up while staying in one place.

He then mixed the live & frozen together. The thawed mysis eventually gets slurped up and the Mandy doesn't object because it is used to the smell and recognized them as food. Over time the amount of live shrimp is reduced until the fish is eating only the thawed mysis.

Never tried it but it sounded like a great technique. It would be used for trying other foods too like fish eggs since they are trapped in the corners of the net box, giving the fish ample time to find it and realize its edible food.

 

[afm32607]

I guess my issue is the stress on being in the net box and the food pieces that feet stuck in between the edges. Might have been coral magazine

 

[Reef Frog]

Well I don't know about the stress thing, but if they're safe, healthy & eating I'm sure they could endure this for a short time. I never thought my FW Berta cares one bit that his whole world is about 3 gallons! Who knows.

I remember the photos in the article. The net boxes were actually fairly large & the fish didn't look cramped. It had good flow and I think most of all the fish learned to eat frozen food - so I guess the stress wasn't too much. The net sides also blocked vision in and out of the breeder box. It looked like a really good technique to me that would be worth trying for someone who likes the idea of supplementing,'expanding or backing the pod diet of a dragonet with frozen food.

I'm not sure but one might be able to recreate his technique in a dedicated 5 or 10g solo QT if worried about the possible stress of the net box. The trick would be keeping the live brine & frozen shrimp together in one place long enough for the mandarin to find & get to them. The net box does this automatically with the flow in the tank. Check it out.

 

[JackandJill]

Regardless, it doesn't really matter as the mandarin will still hunt and still starve without sufficient pods.

EDIT: however, your tank is a size that is capable of sustaining a mandarin as long as there is sufficient rock and safe zones for the pods to reproduce (functional Refugium or rock piles in DT). And the tank should be set up at least 8 months.

 

[davocean]

Personally I would not spend much time training or helping a mandarin eat unless you have a skinny one that you need to help recover asap.
Spend your efforts making or keeping your tank suitable for one, and that size tank w/ a fuge should be able to support ONE, and I would keep to a single mandarin in that size tank.
Focus on the fuge, but pod piles in display help too.
Eating frozen or prep'd is cool, but a drop in the bucket compared to what they really require.
If you do still feel you wish to do something or it is skinny/in need of help the feeder I saw that I like best would be the one in Paul B's thread on mandarin's.

 

[MondoBongo]

here is my standardly advised reading on mandy's:

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2367532
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2363996
http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2374330

 

[afm32607]

The rocks are well over 4 years old, they were from another tank of mine that i had to get rid of. I have a fuge though no live algae (my tank has trouble sustaining large amounts of macro algae).

She isn't that skinny but not that plump either. I'm most worried that that the netting which prevents it from hunting pods will cause it to lose weight while i try to get it to eat.

I understand that the mandarin will not survice solely on my feedings but it has to count for something and every little bit might help.

 

[davocean]

Not sure what you are using for fuge light or flow on the ability to grow macro issue, but it does not take that much macro to help feed pods.
When I got my female she was picked out by a vendor, and she was so skinny I was pretty certain she didn't have a chance to survive, but I gave her one anyway.
I did nothing special for her other than provide a good fuge, and today she is fat and happy, she and the male spawn regularly.
Your fuge is key to success.

 

[Reef Frog]

No doubt a productive refugium is really the only way to go. Not sure if I'd ever attempt training any fish to eat, but it seems like it would be great if a Mandy also ate some other foods in addition to pods as a back up. I can't see how if would hurt.

For example they will eat fish eggs in their natural habitat and I've seen reports of them eating fish & shrimp eggs in the aquarium. They happen to be very nutritious too. That has to be a good thing I would think as long as pods were the staple diet. And a welcome back up if pod populations crashed for some reason.

 

[Guygettnby]

i have mine in a 72g with over 100lbs of LR, no refugium and have had mine for almost 2 years. mine is nice and fat. eats live brine, frozen brine, mysis, marine reef plankton and goes nuts when i put cyclopeeze in the tank. other wise he just hunts 24/7, i have a huge pod population.

every one i have ever had has pretty much done the same thing. at first they just ate live brine and would hunt 24/7. but after time they eventually starting going after other food when it would pass by them. some times it would take awhile before they would even go after live brine shrimp.

 

[afm32607]

Just an update for those who were following along:

About 5 days into the training the mandarins' slime cocoon was not leaving the netting (though she would pick at frozen brine shrimp) and it looked like a lint catcher in the drier when you don't clean it for a month. So I let the little guy go free, wasn't worth it to poison the rest of the tank as the food and slime that was decaying was pretty gross.

I thought about transferring her to another net breeder but I figured if the article had the mandarin in the netting for a month or two netting it 6-12 times over the next couple months was too much stress for me and the fish. So, I'm going to have to buy more pods every once in a while,

 

[afm32607]

On that note, has anyone ever tested the water in the pod bottles? Should I avoid pouring that in my tank at all costs?

 

[Fish_King_25]

On that note, has anyone ever tested the water in the pod bottles? Should I avoid pouring that in my tank at all costs?

I've poured it into my fuge before with no I'll effects..just turn all your pumps off for like 15-30min when you add them..give the pods a chance to get into your LR rubble and chaeto in the refugium..after that you should be good to go!

 

[snorvich]

Personally I would not spend much time training or helping a mandarin eat unless you have a skinny one that you need to help recover asap.
Spend your efforts making or keeping your tank suitable for one, and that size tank w/ a fuge should be able to support ONE, and I would keep to a single mandarin in that size tank.
Focus on the fuge, but pod piles in display help too.
Eating frozen or prep'd is cool, but a drop in the bucket compared to what they really require.
If you do still feel you wish to do something or it is skinny/in need of help the feeder I saw that I like best would be the one in Paul B's thread on mandarin's.

I agree. You can also create "pod piles" of live rock rubble which are effectively refugia within the tank for copepods. The OP poster has a tank size sufficient for one mandarin unless there are major copepod competitors in the tank.

 

[Curtispants]

I remember a few years ago when mandarins became available from ORA as tank bred, (or was it tank raised?) and was wondering how that turned out? Are the ORA mandarins as finicky as wild caught? Do they take frozen food more willingly than their ocean cousins?

 

[davocean]

^^ Not getting very good reviews, and it's not so much about them being finicky as it is the need to be eating almost constantly.

 

[snorvich]

By the way, there are several "issues" with the article referenced. First mandarins do not need to be "trained" since virtually all will eat Nutramar Ova, the vast majority will eat frozen mysis, and when available many/all will eat pellets. The second issue is that the real problem is not addressed: mandarins don't compete successfully. You can put all these wonderful foods in your tank, but if the mandarin does not get to eat them, it won't turn out well. And, of course, there is the fact that mandarins, leopards, etc, eat constantly. So if you are looking for natural behavior in your tank, make sure your tank has sufficient copepods and no predatory copepod eaters.

 

[Paul B]

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2166449&highlight=feeder

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2253223&highlight=mandarins