Feeling overwhelmed

[KarenLR75]

Husband has 120 gallon tank (10 mos old). We've gone thru cyano outbreaks, etc. Then we got bryopsis. Tried water chgs, etc. suctioning, etc. Finally resorted to fluconozale. While doing 2 wk treatment, we noticed pearly, glowing things starting to appear on rock. Yep...bubble algae. We were going to get bryopsis eradicated & then add rock/rework aquascape.

So we've had skimmer off until 2 wk mark. Bryopsis GONE, but ba starting to spread. He read up on using stronger dose of fluconozale for longer time (4-6 wks) to trying to get ba to stop spreading. Then I look at gonipora coral & realize it's all balled up, it was open & beautiful last night at 10. We've seen it ball up a bit before. Then we realize it has aptasia?!!

Unsure if we should bite bullet & start pulling up ALL rock work and getting BA off or what.

Finally, my lovely blue throat trigger was swimming fine in a.m but this afternoon I see him laying almost flat on sandbed & white tail bristle tooth tang is charging him. They've had brief skirmishes before over territory (another reason for adding more rock) but trigger held his own & was nicest fish we had. I got him out & into bucket of tank water but it was too late. No marks, cuts, etc on body. Husband was hurrying from work to set up a 20 gallon tank we've never erected..in case trigger lived.

Water test: Ph 8.1, Ammonia 0, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 2, Specific gravity 1.026. Unsure if nitrate is due to skimmer not being on in 2 wks or what. Temp was where it should be.

Feel completely disheartened & this is not my tank technically..,but it's hard not to care about it. I go to LFS & post here & try to learn but husband is fish person. I'll post pics.

I have NO idea if gonipora coral can be saved. All I have here is Revive Coral dip. Should we just start removing rock, tackle aptasia where we find it, get ba off..or can we still manage to save coral & get ba contained without removing rock from tank? We have a goby & pistol shrimp so am leery about what removing rock will do to ALL the fish in tank (besides ones stated we have 2 mated percula clowns & a melanarus wrasse).

I really want to know what happened to my trigger. I also want to do whatever is in best interest of other fish & coral (2 montipora, 1 elegance coral, 1 scolymia (?) coral, 2 cleaner skunk shrimp, 1 red shrimp, many hermit crabs). LAST addition to tank from LFS was about 3 wks ago..some narcissus snails that we never saw again. Then it seems all heck busted loose.

I'm at my wit's end...do I treat gonipora with revive or is it too late or revive won't help it?

 

[manilaboy1vic]

TLDR; the tank looks clean..

bubble algae, get a few emerald crab, its not like that bubble algae is taking over..
you can manually remove it too.. just dont pop it.. the bubbles are hardish.. just take a chopstick and wiggle it out.. when you do a w/c take a power head to your rocks to give them a good cleaning.. when doing a w/c the more stuff floating in the water better.. get that crap out of there.


cyano sucks.. i removed my sand bed cuz i got sick of trying to get rid of it.. (years)

your water params look ok.. 2 nitrate??? thats nothing.. you can add some monti in there if you have good lighting. whats your phosphate level??

i found aptasia in my sump after adding chaeto and i removed it very carefully with a chopstick..

check compatibility charts for adding fish.. make sure everything will get along..

try not to stress so much.. and let the tank do its thing.. it looks good to me..... white sand.. rocks arent full of green hair algae... a little bubble algae here and there isnt a big deal.. if it completely takes over then you got major phosphate trouble. but emerald crabs eat that stuff up..

i would be careful adding too much clean up crew.. when my tank had sand, i added a bunch of nassarius snails and they went in the sand and after a long while, never saw them again, dead livestock adding harmful crap to the tank..

i learned its best to added smaller amounts of clean up crew that are easily trackable.. emerald crabs, they stay on the rocks, turbo snails, tuxedo urchin, larger hermits.. and if they die remove asap.

but hang in there.. no need to panic yet.. tank looks clean.. you shoulda seen mine a week ago before i removed the sand..

do you run carbon/purigen or gfo??? your nitrates arent off the charts so.. your doing something right..

 

[Daddi0]

Aiptasia are easy to kill. I use regular white vinegar in a syringe. Just stick the needle in its mouth area and give a little squirt. He will melt before your eyes.

 

[KarenLR75]

TLDR; the tank looks clean..

bubble algae, get a few emerald crab, its not like that bubble algae is taking over..
you can manually remove it too.. just dont pop it.. the bubbles are hardish.. just take a chopstick and wiggle it out.. when you do a w/c take a power head to your rocks to give them a good cleaning.. when doing a w/c the more stuff floating in the water better.. get that crap out of there.


cyano sucks.. i removed my sand bed cuz i got sick of trying to get rid of it.. (years)

your water params look ok.. 2 nitrate??? thats nothing.. you can add some monti in there if you have good lighting. whats your phosphate level??

i found aptasia in my sump after adding chaeto and i removed it very carefully with a chopstick..

check compatibility charts for adding fish.. make sure everything will get along..

try not to stress so much.. and let the tank do its thing.. it looks good to me..... white sand.. rocks arent full of green hair algae... a little bubble algae here and there isnt a big deal.. if it completely takes over then you got major phosphate trouble. but emerald crabs eat that stuff up..

i would be careful adding too much clean up crew.. when my tank had sand, i added a bunch of nassarius snails and they went in the sand and after a long while, never saw them again, dead livestock adding harmful crap to the tank..

i learned its best to added smaller amounts of clean up crew that are easily trackable.. emerald crabs, they stay on the rocks, turbo snails, tuxedo urchin, larger hermits.. and if they die remove asap.

but hang in there.. no need to panic yet.. tank looks clean.. you shoulda seen mine a week ago before i removed the sand..

do you run carbon/purigen or gfo??? your nitrates arent off the charts so.. your doing something right..

manilaboy1vic - Sorry..lol. Shortened post to pertinent points. He was running carbon but stopped for the fluconazole dosing, I think.

Yeah, totally agree with you on CUC. I was tracking all 'livestock' but lost track. We feel that last addition of snails was about the only true trigger for some of these other things that have happened (again, no QT so...it was bound to happen unfortunately).

 

[KarenLR75]

Aiptasia are easy to kill. I use regular white vinegar in a syringe. Just stick the needle in its mouth area and give a little squirt. He will melt before your eyes.

I told husband about this..and I guess lemon juice or hydrogen peroxide are also used for same thing?

Aptasia so far seems to be concentrated all over gonipora coral frag. it's been in our DT for 5 months. Could aptasia have come in on the frag plug and have 'hidden/furrowed' for 5 months?? NO FRAGS/CORALS have been added for 5 months come to think of it.

 

[manilaboy1vic]

manilaboy1vic - Sorry..lol. Shortened post to pertinent points. He was running carbon but stopped for the fluconazole dosing, I think.

Yeah, totally agree with you on CUC. I was tracking all 'livestock' but lost track. We feel that last addition of snails was about the only true trigger for some of these other things that have happened (again, no QT so...it was bound to happen unfortunately).

i dont think adding snails gave you bubble algae.. there just probably something in the rock.. if theres not a full on bubble algae outbreak just pick it off with a chopstick or rigid tubing, gently wiggle it loose and flush it down the toilet..

those snails should pop up when you feed the tank with frozen mysis.. they detect that a mile away usually.

just find your chi, take it one day at at time and dont stress....

sometimes it helps to just not look at the tank and let it be, the longer you look at it the more you think you gotta do

ive been so lazy that i wasnt cleaning my return pump til it stopped working.. heh.. now im on a cleaning terror.. i have spare return so, that led to my lazineess.. goodluck

 

[laverda]

Aptasia will iratate and cause your Gino to close up. Treating it with revive will not help with that. Peppermint shrimp or an aptasia eating file fish both work great at getting rid of aptasia.
For bubble algae I use a length of rigid tubing and some soft tubing to suck them out of the tank. You will probably pop some but the suction should get most of the spores. I dose a small amount of hydrogen peroxide when done to kill and spores in the water column. Is you can get the rocks out easily you can scrape them off and then rinse with a little hydrogen peroxide.
I suspect you Po4 may be elevated and would test to see. Hard to say what happened to you trigger. I doubt the snails have anything to do with your issues, although it is not impossible. Nasarrius snails live in the sand bed and come out when there is food in the tank. Triggers are also known for eating snails, crabs and shrimp.
I know it can be very frustrating when things don’t goo smoothly with your tank.Like someone else said take it slow and things should get better with time. You tank is still young. It’s nice you get involved with your husbands hobby.

 

[homer1475]

I always love it when emerald crabs are suggested for bubble algae, but don't you pop them when removing them! Do you think the emerald isn't popping them when eating them? I have never seen an emerald with a mouth large enough to fully eat even the smallest bubble algae.

Honestly OP, you tank looks fine to me, your freaking out for nothing. A little algae is not a bad thing, a tank with 0 algae is not a healthy tank.

Slow your roll and stop adding crap to your tank for starters. Aiptasia can be dealt with in a variety of ways as can bubble algae, definitely not worth freaking out over. Fish die for no reason, without a necropsy you my never know.

Parameters look fine to me, I actually add potassium nitrate to bring my nitrates up to 2ppm.

 

[OrionN]

Growing bubble algae is a nutrient thing. Better management of your nutrient will help with bubble algae. I have had Bubble algae in the past and coralline algae just growth over them.
I have a large tank and do not want to stick my hand down in it. I have a pointed stick that I poke the larger bubble algae with to pop it and the tangs just finish them off once it pop. I think there is no reason not to pop an bubble algae. Fish and other animals do not eat them whole, then popped them before they eat them. I just popped that algae for them so they can eat them easier.

 

[KarenLR75]

I always love it when emerald crabs are suggested for bubble algae, but don't you pop them when removing them! Do you think the emerald isn't popping them when eating them? I have never seen an emerald with a mouth large enough to fully eat even the smallest bubble algae.

Honestly OP, you tank looks fine to me, your freaking out for nothing. A little algae is not a bad thing, a tank with 0 algae is not a healthy tank.

Slow your roll and stop adding crap to your tank for starters. Aiptasia can be dealt with in a variety of ways as can bubble algae, definitely not worth freaking out over. Fish die for no reason, without a necropsy you my never know.

Parameters look fine to me, I actually add potassium nitrate to bring my nitrates up to 2ppm.

Thanks homer1475 for taking time to post to me.

Which crap are you talking about..flucanozole, CUC, ?

IF revive could have been useful, some urgency in my post was primarily driven by trying to do it in a timely manner (and yes, I was upset I lost a fish & so many things happened at once).

I also wanted to find out if we really needed to pull up rock work or not as re-scaping/adding rock to the tank is on the schedule for this weekend.

Seems folks, including yourself, has indicated so far this is not necessary which is good. The ba is much more widespread that the pics indicate. I know we plan to get some rigid tubing and cut a 45 degree angle in it as per what someone posted on the other current bubble algae thread and then are going after the ba this weekend as well.

We are going to check to see if the gonipora is actually 'rooted' to the rock (not live rock, we have carib sea rock...just in case that matters) or not. What do y'all think about getting the gonipora out of the tank and into a bowl or something with enough tank water..and trying to get the aptasia off of it that way so we're not spreading any aptasia in the DT? I'm just thinking out loud here...if the injections are the best way to go (injecting while in tank)..we're open to that as well..

 

[KarenLR75]

Growing bubble algae is a nutrient thing. Better management of your nutrient will help with bubble algae. I have had Bubble algae in the past and coralline algae just growth over them.
I have a large tank and do not want to stick my hand down in it. I have a pointed stick that I poke the larger bubble algae with to pop it and the tangs just finish them off once it pop. I think there is no reason not to pop an bubble algae. Fish and other animals do not eat them whole, then popped them before they eat them. I just popped that algae for them so they can eat them easier.

OrionN - first off, what cute kids!!! Thanks for replying on my thread. Seems like a lot of other nuisance algae (or maybe it is all algae?) is a nutrient thing in a big way...I know cyano seemed to be. We quit feeding as much..and it may be coincidence but we stopped using pellet food so frequently and have not had any more cyano outbreaks.

One person suggested chopsticks...I almost laughed as I wasn't sure if I had to be able to use the chopsticks as 'intended to eat a meal' which I've never been able to successfully do! lol.

 

[Tripod1404]

I always love it when emerald crabs are suggested for bubble algae, but don't you pop them when removing them! Do you think the emerald isn't popping them when eating them? I have never seen an emerald with a mouth large enough to fully eat even the smallest bubble algae.

Lol yeah, same with rabbitfish or anything else they eats them. Plus if they have spores in them, those spore will be released regardless of you poping them or not.

I never had a bubble algae our break, but I have few here an there. BA is one of the few species of algae that is naturally found in coral reefs, it is particularly well adapted to low N and P like corals. It wont take over unless there is a massive nutrient problem. In my case, i just pop or dislodge BA that are close to corals, I dont even remove the free floating BA after that, I assume they eventually get crushed by power heads.

 

[KarenLR75]

Aptasia will iratate and cause your Gino to close up. Treating it with revive will not help with that. Peppermint shrimp or an aptasia eating file fish both work great at getting rid of aptasia.
For bubble algae I use a length of rigid tubing and some soft tubing to suck them out of the tank. You will probably pop some but the suction should get most of the spores. I dose a small amount of hydrogen peroxide when done to kill and spores in the water column. Is you can get the rocks out easily you can scrape them off and then rinse with a little hydrogen peroxide.
I suspect you Po4 may be elevated and would test to see. Hard to say what happened to you trigger. I doubt the snails have anything to do with your issues, although it is not impossible. Nasarrius snails live in the sand bed and come out when there is food in the tank. Triggers are also known for eating snails, crabs and shrimp.
I know it can be very frustrating when things don’t goo smoothly with your tank.Like someone else said take it slow and things should get better with time. You tank is still young. It’s nice you get involved with your husbands hobby.

Laverda, thank you for your empathy. Sometimes when us newer people post, we may be upset..more upset than we need to be but I appreciate that people took time to reply at all - I take the replies as people intending to help me 99% of the time.

I was calmed down by about midnight..lot of work stress going on too..and the anniversary of my Mother's passing & Mother's day coming up..well, it is just an overall rough time. We all have them. Life is hard sometimes..period.

The tank issues were just more of the proverbial 'straw' that broke me yesterday.

How much hydrogen peroxide do you dose per gallon? Not sure that I'm going to do that but I see hydrogen peroxide dosing come up a lot so I'd like to record the recommended dosage if I ever do it.

We were told the snails (10 of them) would come up the 1st time we fed the tank. We added them at night towards front of tank..they burrowed. The next day when we fed mysis, only 1 snail came up. After that we never saw any of them come up again. So does that mean within less than 14 hrs that all the snails died? Puzzling..

I'll ask husband to run Po4 test. Thanks again!

 

[laverda]

Life can get rough sometimes for all of us. I prefer to remove rocks from the tank and remove as many bubbles as practical the pour a little hydrogen peroxide over the rock before putting them back in the tank. I have had 100% results this way. I dose just 30ml when when I can not remove the rock and treat algae in the tank on my 300 gallon tank.
I don't see anything that would cause a problem for your snails. You may want want to check for chlorimines.

 

[KarenLR75]

Hey laverda,

We checked PO4 and it is .052..a little high? It's not scary high, is it? Also, we use RODI water only..if that matters in regards to chloramines?.

Also ran a few more tests:
Alkalinity - 8.1, Calcium - 449

The gonipora is still curled up in a tight ball. Oddly, the aptasia seemed to have..gone somewhere? Is it hiding?

 

[laverda]

Hey laverda,

We checked PO4 and it is .052..a little high? It's not scary high, is it? Also, we use RODI water only..if that matters in regards to chloramines?.

Also ran a few more tests:
Alkalinity - 8.1, Calcium - 449

The gonipora is still curled up in a tight ball. Oddly, the aptasia seemed to have..gone somewhere? Is it hiding?

.05 is lower them my phosphates are and should not be an issue per say. One way to control algae in the display is to grow it in the sump or refugium, using up the nutrients it would need to grow in the display. I feel a simple ATS (algae turf scruber) is the easiest way to do so. You can easly make one for $30 or less.
Unless your RO/DI specifically says it removes chlorimines it will not remove all of them. Special chlorimine buster cartridges are available to use in your RO/DI from BRS and the like. You can add some "prime" by Seachem to your RO/DI water to be sure.
Your ALk and Ca are great.

 

[albano]

How long have you had goniopora ? Unless it was an aquacultured piece, they are very usually hard to keep more than a few months.

 

[BronxReefer]

after reading your initial post, i was not expecting to see a nice looking tank in your pictures! looks good! i think everyone has been through these issues, its just tough you are experiencing them all at once. hang in there... i've spent probably hours of my life with a piece of live rock over a bucket, a head flashlight, and a pare of tweezers just picking off bubble algae etc. -- its a pain but its things like this that will make you appreciate your tank when its perfect

 

[KarenLR75]

How long have you had goniopora ? Unless it was an aquacultured piece, they are very usually hard to keep more than a few months.

Hey albano,

It was put in our tank on 12/29/17 so it's 4.5 months 'old' (for us at least). I remember finding out after we got it that it was another 'hard to care for coral'. The first coral I got was an elegance coral so I sure know how to pick them.

After finding out last year that the gonipora (got a scolymia at the same time) was also hard to care for, we put ourselves on 'hold' for acquiring more corals until we are better educated.

We've had the elegance coral still looking happy and proud since 9/13/17 (it's from Australia thankfully) so it's '8 months old' in our tank.

 

[KarenLR75]

Unless your RO/DI specifically says it removes chlorimines it will not remove all of them. Special chlorimine buster cartridges are available to use in your RO/DI from BRS and the like. You can add some "prime" by Seachem to your RO/DI water to be sure.
Your ALk and Ca are great.

Laverda - Hhmm...I'll ask my husband on this. We did get it from BRS and just ordered a new filter kit, resin, etc. but I don't recall seeing anything specific to chloramines (i.e. a cartridge).

Thanks for bringing up this point!