Filter Socks & Siphon Starting

[farfromsea]

I've been debating using filter socks or not for a while. Ordered some and stupidly bought ones of the wrong diameter. My current filter sock is about twice as wide and fits 2 flexible PVC pipes in it. Now that I have these small socks I'm thinking to use 2 socks in the sump, one for each pipe coming out of the overflow.

My one qualm with changing the filter sock is I have to shut off the system and restart my HOB siphon every single time. Thinking to just return the filter sock and forget the entire thing.

Anyways, is there a way to start the siphon for the u-tube without using my mouth? Don't really want to drink conch poop every week. If not I may just stop using filter socks.

 

[GimpyFin]

Just curious, why are you having to redo the u-tube siphon each time you shut off the pump to change filter socks?

 

[farfromsea]

So I bought the system used and there is no way I would have designed it like this but alas...

The sump is just a 30 gallon glass tank that the previous owner added some acrylic strips to in order to create a sort of holder for the filter sock. The holder is just a square shaped "ring" if that makes sense. It is a pretty tight fit and so the only way to take the filter sock off is to first take the flexible pvc pipes out and then lift the filter sock upwards.

I would have foregone the entire thing and just used one of those little clip hang on the tank holders they have for filter socks but I'll take what I can get on craigslist I suppose lol

 

[GimpyFin]

Sounds interesting. So, you have to mess with the HOB overflow box and remove the u-tube when you are working with the pipe to get the sock out?

 

[farfromsea]

Yes there isn't a lot of room back there because it is all sitting under a cube so unless I want to risk spraying water everywhere I prefer to shut it all down and restart it again, but I do not want to drink any more tank water

Do they sell little bulbs you can start the siphon with or something just like they have for gravel vacuums?

 

[GimpyFin]

I just have about 3 feet of 1/4 inch flexible vinyl tubing. Run it up just past halfway on the u-tube, start sucking, and just as I'm getting water in the vinyl tubing and the bubble is mostly gone, I pinch/kink it and gently pull it out of the tube. I usually don't any water in my mouth, maybe just a drop if I'm sloppy.

 

[Tarawa]

When I start a siphon for a gravel vacuum, I use a small pump in the sump, then pump water up thru the vacuum into the tank, then kill the pump and the water comes back down, instant full siphon.

 

[Bl4ckDr4g0n]

Why not just get rid of the acrylic piece all together, and buy filter socks with strings instead of plastic rings. I put a brass hook inside my stand and tie my filter sock up to it around both the siphon and emergency pipes.

 

[CStrickland]

Yes there isn't a lot of room back there because it is all sitting under a cube so unless I want to risk spraying water everywhere I prefer to shut it all down and restart it again, but I do not want to drink any more tank water

Do they sell little bulbs you can start the siphon with or something just like they have for gravel vacuums?

You should be able to shut down the flow and then restart it without having to reprime the siphon though. That's what is confusing about your overflow. Both ends of the u tube should be always submerged in their separate parts - one in the tank and the other in the box on the back of the tank. The drain from that box to the sump is separated from the utube by a baffle so the u tube can't ever suck air even when the flow is cut. Because both ends are always underwater - they can't pull air. This is an important function of a u tube overflow because it's not uncommon for the power to cut out momentarily for all different reasons. If the u tube sucks air from either end when you kill the flow, breaking the siphon, it's not working right.

Maybe I'm not picturing your overflow right, but if you have to prime it every time you shut off the return pump it's not set up properly. This isn't something you should work around, it's something you should fix.

 

[farfromsea]

You should be able to shut down the flow and then restart it without having to reprime the siphon though. That's what is confusing about your overflow. Both ends of the u tube should be always submerged in their separate parts - one in the tank and the other in the box on the back of the tank. The drain from that box to the sump is separated from the utube by a baffle so the u tube can't ever suck air even when the flow is cut. Because both ends are always underwater - they can't pull air. This is an important function of a u tube overflow because it's not uncommon for the power to cut out momentarily for all different reasons. If the u tube sucks air from either end when you kill the flow, breaking the siphon, it's not working right.

Maybe I'm not picturing your overflow right, but if you have to prime it every time you shut off the return pump it's not set up properly. This isn't something you should work around, it's something you should fix.

Hmm this does sound like the way it should function. I will look more closely into what happens when I shut the pumps off again. There HOB has three chambers. The left and right chambers have those PVC tubes to silence the gurgle (the thing still sounds like a leaking toilet but whatever)...can't remember the name and a quick/lazy google search didn't pull up what I would think the correct terminology is. Anyways, so the third middle chamber is where the U-tube is. I suppose now that you bring it up the middle chamber should never drain out on its own when the pump is off.

Will report back after I mess around with it tomorrow.

Thanks for the tip!

 

[farfromsea]

When I start a siphon for a gravel vacuum, I use a small pump in the sump, then pump water up thru the vacuum into the tank, then kill the pump and the water comes back down, instant full siphon.

I got a gravel vacuum that has a little bulb on it that you squeeze to get it started because I can't deal with a wild toddler and all of this lol. So I am going for the lazy route. Your idea is clever, however. My pumps I think have wider outputs than the vacuum hose so I would have to get an adapter if I did that.

My main wish here though, was some "automagic" way to get the U-tube to siphon again

 

[farfromsea]

Why not just get rid of the acrylic piece all together, and buy filter socks with strings instead of plastic rings. I put a brass hook inside my stand and tie my filter sock up to it around both the siphon and emergency pipes.

This idea is quite appealing as well. However the acrylic piece is majorly glued in there and I am paranoid I will destroy something by trying to rip it out. It is a solid rectangle and perhaps 2" wide (not thick) on all sides. "If it ain't broke don't fix it" they say haha. With my luck I would somehow rip apart the sump/tank.

Also I don't think I have emergency pipes :uhoh2:

 

[MondoBongo]

i have about half a dozen of these things laying around the house:

https://www.amazon.com/Python-Squee...sr=8-1&keywords=python+squeeze+siphon+starter

never get a mouth full of tank water again.

 

[CStrickland]

The problem with using bulbs or tubes is that sooner or later it will lose siphon when you aren't around to start it again. Then the return pump will keep sending water into the tank but since it's not draining through your hob overflow it will end up on your floor instead.

 

[farfromsea]

The problem with using bulbs or tubes is that sooner or later it will lose siphon when you aren't around to start it again. Then the return pump will keep sending water into the tank but since it's not draining through your hob overflow it will end up on your floor instead.

Alright so I messed around with the tank finally and when I shut down all of my pumps the siphon doesn't break and the water just sits in the middle compartment with the u-tube. Granted I didn't test this for a copious amount of time but the animals have to breathe so I like to work quickly. So far it doesn't seem to drain.

What is wrong though with starting a siphon with a bulb? During a water change the siphon will break and I will have to restart it again but once it is going it will keep going so long as the water levels are correct....

I thought the only way to start a siphon was with airline tubing!