Fwc

How did this become a bash on the LFS??

The LFS is your friend. They couldn't care less if a hobbyist sells a frag to another hobbyist. I can tell you one thing, I've gotten some killer deals on frags at my LFS that any hobbyist probably wouldn't sell them for.

When I had my big tank and frag tank etc. I had a FL Aquaculture License just to stay as legit as possible when I went to frag swaps etc. The inspector who came to my house once a year for those 3 years was cool as sh*t and we would BS for hours!

Just like any other hobby, a few bad apples can ruin the bunch. If anyone wants to bash the FWC or Government, or things of that nature....go for it!

Just be careful about blaming it on/or bashing the LFS because you never know when you are going to need them.................

Aaron
 
The reason for registration is not to keep you down or make you feel bad or to take your hard earned money. There are many shady people in the world with what seems to be a large concentration in Florida.
Registering allows an inspector to visit where you are culturing corals and make sure you are being responsible and obeying laws. Protecting endangered species.
It is easy for many people in Florida to take a boat out and collect protected species and ship them all over the country. $75 a year for this service seems pretty reasonable.
Stores are ****ed for sure that people are selling frags from their house. Not paying taxes most of the time. It 100% is putting them out of business. Sure they still make some money but not enough anymore. Not everyone has been around as long as some of the old heads but stores used to be jam packed with corals. Wall to wall and all racks full. I would say there might be 25 to 50% of the livestock most stores used to carry and it is dwindling.
 
Last Oct. at our TBRC meeting, we had an FWC person speaking about this very subject. Perhaps we can invite her again and see if there has been any headway in establishing clear rules. There are not, in regards to the hobby, however there are rules regarding licensing for businesses.
 
Webmanny said:
I was under the impression that Texas had a few banks too, but I may be remembering this wrong. Either way, I think your second point brings it to a close. They want more money. Problem solved. :)
Click to expand...

Yes, Texas flower banks. Several have cold water reefs as well.
 
Instead of trashing them, let's box em up without water and ship them to FWC as an eye opener to address the issue. The smell should wake them up.
 
I think there has been some confusion. I don't think anyone is bashing on LFS and they shouldn't be. I am 100% with them on the fact that they should be the only ones legally selling corals. I buy corals all the time from my local stores and I am super happy that we have so many in Tampa.

I do weekly visits to at least one of our sponsors without fail and I always buy something. Most times it is bulbs, salt, carbon and the occasional Coral.

My main problem and what everybody's problem should be, is with the lack of clear rules from the FWC. I'll give you a few scenarios of what I think should and shouldn't require a permit/license.

This is just my two cents. I hope I haven't offended anyone with my comments before. I assure you, it was not my intention. I know this is a touchy subject for many and some are very passionate about their ideals and point of view.

Should not require a license:
  • Growing corals originally bought from LFS or traded with a friend.
  • Trade coral frags for other coral frags online, in trade shows or in person
  • Sell or trade in corals to LFS so they can resell them or for sir credit.

Should require a license or permit:
  • Collecting corals anywhere
  • Selling corals online via stores or Craigslist(over a certain amount $$$)
  • Growing large amounts of corals. i.e. large farms with the intention of selling via store front or online
 
Mrs Postal said:
Last Oct. at our TBRC meeting, we had an FWC person speaking about this very subject. Perhaps we can invite her again and see if there has been any headway in establishing clear rules. There are not, in regards to the hobby, however there are rules regarding licensing for businesses.
Click to expand...

Yes I was there for that meeting. She did say they were meeting again soon and hoped to talk about this but currently no solution has been made for hobbiests. Also that we get lumped in with the retail because they have no place to put us. I made suggestions that seemed like plain old common sense to me. In the end I liked her but I don't think she had much power. I would like to see her come with another guest that does have a bit of power to get the rules set for hobbiests. Also to define what a hobbiests is compared to retail. Because of the whole fwc stuff and not wanting to be a business I haven't really sold corals in a year. The paying taxes part is not a concern. Shoot I would have about $20,000 in write offs this past year alone. We all know in this hobby it's easy to show mass exapences so I don't think that's a big concern for most of us. Yes I have a pretty large setup, but over the past year I haven't even sold $400 in coral and more then 50% of that was back to local fish stores for credit. So should I be retail if I have a lot of water volume, coral sales volume, coral sales inccome, this all needs to be defined and I don't see why it is taking years.

This is a big deal and needs to be taken care of. Honestly I don't feel they r even working on it but they do have time to go around to hobbiests to police them. Yes I do say hobbiests. The 2 people I know that we're visited resently have 1 tank. Only selling what they can grow. Anyways I don't care what type of government it is big government always gets in the way of positive progress. It doesn't help the situation.

I have more to say but I'm done for now. This whole thing makes me irritated.

Roger
 
Great post Manny. Roger the only thing with government and big businesses seem to be the lack of "common sense". In today's day and age I feel as though they all forgot what it is. Rules, regulations, procedures, policies and mandates. I see the same flaws in government as the big corporation I work for. Common sense is a valuable tool in decison making and thought processing, yet issues seem to be logically and intellectually solved. All without looking at the common sense solution, which ironically sits right before them many times. Knee jerk reactions are how bad policies and rules are formed. I wouldn't worry though, I'm sure they'll come up with an asinine solution which requires either paying money and/or more regulations to abide by. National reef tank/marine specimen registration list? Tax stamps like with weapons? Hopefully a solution or clarity will clear the gray area with reef hobbyists. Lol. I'm sure the breeze will blow and die down at the end of the day.
 
liverock said:
The laws regarding this are already in effect...there just enforcing them now..
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Yes but a hobbiests with one tank should have the same rules as a salt water retailer. Even the speaker from the fwc said that we shouldn't be lumped in but we r because they have no place for us. That's the rules/laws I'm talking about.
 
Yes but a hobbyists with one tank should have the same rules as a salt water retailer


They do have the same rules....

enforcement will follow the laws as written...until there are new laws...
 
liverock said:
Yes but a hobbyists with one tank should have the same rules as a salt water retailer


They do have the same rules....

enforcement will follow the laws as written...until there are new laws...
Click to expand...

I guess you didn't understand sarcasm there. Yes I know the laws are the same. But they should not be the same that is the whole point.
 
Florida Aquaculture certification is $100, not $75.
Floridaaquaculture.com. 850-617-7600 for info on registering. Pick up the phone and they will email you the info needed. License is good from July 1st through June 30th. No proration.
Fwc license is for buy and flipping. Not fragging.
You need to be certified for aquaculture to frag and sell.
 
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