Good bye to overpriced Red Hornets!!!
- Thread starter CrazyZoa
- Start date
Correct, my point exactly. I'll be attacked for speaking up, but you won't see that kind of attention being paid to those 50 threads that I mentioned above. It just seems that that which is going to help, prolong, benefit, improve or enhance ones reef keeping experience is placed on the back burner, until someone needs urgent help. Then, they will rush here and demand urgent and expeditious answers, not links, but answers. Why not be proactive and pose those questions, ideas, concerns and hypothetical now. Every zoa forum is suffering on the net as there are very few daily replies on anything other than names, hype, pricing and ID's. Go take a peek and see. We currently have 5 days of post on the first page, if that is what the board wants, then we are going to continue loosing experienced reefers who can and will help us all.
Mucho Reef
Mucho Reef
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Friday Night
New member
Wish it was that easy to say "goodbye" to overpriced zoas.. but the retail stores r going to continue to milk that cash cow teet untill it runs dry. As well as there are suckers born evey min.. So unless people do thier homework prior before buying a frag or just not buy at all boycott.. then its a never ending cycle...
And that's what I've done. I've boycotted every single source of zoas and palys I had and the LFS and OLs. I haven't purchased a single polyp in 3 years. I found a store who was selling at a reasonable price and I purchased 3 frags loaded with polyps for $ 25 each.
Tripel_Hornet
In Memoriam
i am honored to have a vendor come here and said they will change the name of a zoa they were calling it something to close to have it be confused with something else. i will visit vivid and hopefully buy something there in the future cause honest resellers are hard to come buy.
why boycott resellers? it happens in every item bought and sold. its been going on since forever, and its not just zoas. if you boycott this hobby, then go boycott the clothing industry, cars, and whatever else is overpriced.
someone who pays a high price for something is not a sucker. i am no sucker cause i been in this hobby for 6 years and if i like something enough i will pay what i want to get it.
i dont mind paying a little more for something i really like. hopefully i can grow them out and sell them cheaper for what i paid and bring down the price a little and share what i have with other fellow reefers.
i dont think hornets are rare, but they are in demand. i dont see other people selling them alot so i think that will make their asking price go up alot. if they are not rare i wish all who have them go and sell some to flood the market with them cause they are a very beautiful polyp.
why boycott resellers? it happens in every item bought and sold. its been going on since forever, and its not just zoas. if you boycott this hobby, then go boycott the clothing industry, cars, and whatever else is overpriced.
someone who pays a high price for something is not a sucker. i am no sucker cause i been in this hobby for 6 years and if i like something enough i will pay what i want to get it.
i dont mind paying a little more for something i really like. hopefully i can grow them out and sell them cheaper for what i paid and bring down the price a little and share what i have with other fellow reefers.
i dont think hornets are rare, but they are in demand. i dont see other people selling them alot so i think that will make their asking price go up alot. if they are not rare i wish all who have them go and sell some to flood the market with them cause they are a very beautiful polyp.
Friday Night
New member
Your right the higher the demand you can set your price at whatever u want... but with the same token it has become "mainstream" now where everyone has a shot and buying it at a decent price.. or theres enough in circulation you can trade for it... its just good to see that it has become "available" to everyone ...
aquaph8
Love The Fish
Im kinda mixed on the subject. These polyps are only high priced for a limited time. Eventually they get out there and the price slowly comes down. Purple deaths and Nuclear greens are a great example. In the mean time it kinda gives people without an excess in funds to make an investment and grow a $100 polyp into 5 and fund there hobby that they would otherwise have a hard time paying for. Yeah, unfortunetly retailers are gonna do the same, but if its not one thing it will be another thats just how sales works. Its really not that these polyps arent available to everyone, their just not available during the hype. If you dont want to pay the high prices dont buy them when its the cool thing to do. Boycott all you want, but someone's gonna buy them wether you do or not. Personally nobody sees my tank that would know one zoa from another, so the bragging about high prices would be pointless. Regardless of price, buy what you like and what you can afford. I dont support the name thing to the extent it has become but it is nice to quit calling them them the orangish red ones with the green thingy. Expensive or not, just have fun with it.
Akwarius
New member
It's sort of funny to hear veteran reefers talk like the hobby is going to hell in a handbasket. Is it possible that you see less "help me my zoas are melting threads" because most zoa enthusiasts have a better understanding of the corals they keep than those of yesteryear? Or they ran a search and solved the problem themselves? Why not post a picture of a beautiful healthy zoa colony that you are proud of? Does it need to be followed with tank specs ad nauseum? I admit that I get tired of picture threads that have two pages of "that zoa is sick" replys, but if it gets people excited about the hobby, then who cares. I guess it comes down to the purpose of the zoa forum. Can it be for admirers and collectors, or only those seeking advice?
Btw. If you think that red hornets are common and need to be cheaper then flood the market. Maybe there's a reason this hasn't happened already.
Btw. If you think that red hornets are common and need to be cheaper then flood the market. Maybe there's a reason this hasn't happened already.
glextank
New member
Over here in our corner of the NW, we try to do what we can to make the cool stuff available to everyone. We do "pay it forward" frags, and lots of people sell stuff fr way less than they got it. I got a purple hornet frag as part of an 11 frag pack for $80. So it came out to like $3 for the polyp.
Another point on the naming thing: I saw a "dragonfly" zoa back like 2.5yrs ago, when we were first getting into corals. I thought it was really cool and wanted to have it someday. Well, this weekend a fellow reefer had some "dragonfly" zoas for sale, but couldn't post pics. Guess what, I remembered I like those, cuz I recognize the dragonfly name. I couldn't remember what the sam hill it looked like, but I knew I liked it.
Also, like the LA Lakers zoa, I can't remember what it looks like off the top of my head, but I knowit's badass. Just my .02. : )
Another point on the naming thing: I saw a "dragonfly" zoa back like 2.5yrs ago, when we were first getting into corals. I thought it was really cool and wanted to have it someday. Well, this weekend a fellow reefer had some "dragonfly" zoas for sale, but couldn't post pics. Guess what, I remembered I like those, cuz I recognize the dragonfly name. I couldn't remember what the sam hill it looked like, but I knew I liked it.
Also, like the LA Lakers zoa, I can't remember what it looks like off the top of my head, but I knowit's badass. Just my .02. : )
I really don't think it's funny at all. I assume your are speaking to me, so I'll respond. I'll say it again, many experienced reefers have left this forum for all the reasons I listed above. I have spoken to them, so that's a fact. I didn't say the hobby was "going to hell in a handbasket". But since you brought it up, I'm inclined to agree that the hobby has been affected.
I don't see less help me threads, I see less people answering those threads yet the same doesn't hold true for the name and picture threads. There are 50 threads in 5 pages with less than 5 replies, so people are asking, don't you agree? It has been stated dozens of times by many people here, but you directed your reply to me specifically, and that's ok.
There is nothing wrong with posting a happy and healthy picture to be proud of, I'm the one who created the photo sticky at the top of the page.
You stated that you didn't mean to offend me when I ask questions about the pictures in another thread, yet you come right back and support the fact that my questions were offensive to you. How does asking someone about their success offends you? Crazyzoa, whom I think was the OP agrees with me and didn't feel my post was in anyway offensive. "Specs ad nauseum? Asking about ones success with a few questions which will always help someone else is now frowned upon? Yes, I agree, the hobby has changed. Pictures have their place, and you're right and I agree 100%, it comes down to the purpose of the zoa forum or ones interpretation of it. The purpose of some is pictures, and that's great, the purpose for others is to try and help, share, listen, learn, give back and promote discussion. Neither is wrong, it just comes down to purpose. So again, I agree with you.
What you call Red Hornets are very common and have been around for many many years. I agree, they all are grossly expensive and over priced and this is attributed to the reefers buying them and not the LFS or suppliers. The LFS have done what any smart business person would do. They see private sellers getting rich, so they aren't going to be left out and they jump on board.
It's not just me BTW, many many people agree. I think Anthony Calfo says it best in the link below starting at paragraph 6 thru 13. The entire article is great I think and very informative.
http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2005-02/ac/index.php
Mucho Reef
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Good for you. That is what I have always tried to do. That is the best way to flood the market with those prices. Much respect.
Akwarius
New member
Mucho, I never said that I was offended by anything that you posted, nor did I misquote you. Perhaps you should reread my post. I appreciate a lively debate on this subject and it is one worth having. However, I would like to keep things positive and not let it degenerate into nit picking each others posts.
The op-ed piece by Anthony Calfo was very entertaining. He seems to mirror your sentiment. He directs his ire toward trends in coral species. The discussion is about a color strain of one coral species. The red hornet zoanthid is sought after because of it's impeccable color and rarity. Though many hobbyist claim otherwise, this thread has failed to prove that true red hornets are common. Yes, there are alot of lava ring type colonies out there, but how many of them are capable of becoming the version that commands such high prices. I say few until proven otherwise. The price will continue to drop as people propogate it, just like what happened to the purple hornet.
As for hype, I can't go out and buy a scolymia for under $100, and most of the nice ones are over $300. That's an entire species of coral that I can't afford to own!
The op-ed piece by Anthony Calfo was very entertaining. He seems to mirror your sentiment. He directs his ire toward trends in coral species. The discussion is about a color strain of one coral species. The red hornet zoanthid is sought after because of it's impeccable color and rarity. Though many hobbyist claim otherwise, this thread has failed to prove that true red hornets are common. Yes, there are alot of lava ring type colonies out there, but how many of them are capable of becoming the version that commands such high prices. I say few until proven otherwise. The price will continue to drop as people propogate it, just like what happened to the purple hornet.
As for hype, I can't go out and buy a scolymia for under $100, and most of the nice ones are over $300. That's an entire species of coral that I can't afford to own!
dark_stranger
New member
$25 per poly!!!! thats just crazy & even if I wanted to sell corals at that price over here, no one would buy them, you guys have to much money burning holes in your pockets... and I bet retailers love it.
Just my $25 worth
Just my $25 worth
$25 per poly!!!! thats just crazy & even if I wanted to sell corals at that price over here, no one would buy them, you guys have to much money burning holes in your pockets... and I bet retailers love it.
Just my $25 worth
I hear you loud and clear. Might take a trip to the UK and look you up and maybe you can show me around mate.
Well i would assume there would be no crying over a 25$ polyp compared to a 180$ polyp. Yes i know they are different, but SIMILAR. AND Vivid did not call them Original Red Hornet or LE Red Hornet. They called them VIVID red hornets. I havent read anywhere that they said it would color up and have alternating skirts or anything. JUST a wysiwyg photo and a price. Nothing about rarity or what it will be just a straight up picture with a price. NOW you can see the actual item your getting and you can tell obviously its not an original but is still close enough to pay 25$ for it.
Something about this hobby turns adults into little whiney children. Every forum or every thread there is a bashing or some insult about price or this or that about some company. NO ONE IS FORCING YOU TO BUY ANYTHING. The buyer made the decision to purchase a 25$ polyp that is nice, because the true 180$ polyp is outrageously over priced. I guess its Vivids fault... lol ridiculous.
And it was someone who made this thread. I would understand about bashing Vivid if they promoted it and was like "we got RED HORNETS FOR ONLY 25$ a head!!!!, super rare, buy now for cheap!! Get it for a great price and go cry about it on forums!!!!"
But it was some hobbyist who started the thread so its no big deal. I think they should keep their name and not have to change to to accomodate for some whiney adults.
Something about this hobby turns adults into little whiney children. Every forum or every thread there is a bashing or some insult about price or this or that about some company. NO ONE IS FORCING YOU TO BUY ANYTHING. The buyer made the decision to purchase a 25$ polyp that is nice, because the true 180$ polyp is outrageously over priced. I guess its Vivids fault... lol ridiculous.
And it was someone who made this thread. I would understand about bashing Vivid if they promoted it and was like "we got RED HORNETS FOR ONLY 25$ a head!!!!, super rare, buy now for cheap!! Get it for a great price and go cry about it on forums!!!!"
But it was some hobbyist who started the thread so its no big deal. I think they should keep their name and not have to change to to accomodate for some whiney adults.
dark_stranger
New member
[violation]
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aquaph8
Love The Fish
VividAquariums
Sponsor
Aquaph8, we would not risk our reputation over one set of polyps or purposely choose to falsely advertise. No one hear ever said, let's trick people.
Our employee said, they look like red hornets, let's call them vivid red hornets. We did not think it through. Lesson learned.
I understand your suspicion but it's simply not true.
Dave
Our employee said, they look like red hornets, let's call them vivid red hornets. We did not think it through. Lesson learned.
I understand your suspicion but it's simply not true.
Dave
russ13
Member
if you like the way a coral looks,does it realy matter to you if it is a real red hornet.what is in a name.i do have many le corals and i know that if you are growing corals to frag and sell them,people will pay more money for the named or LE frags.but if you just want a nice looking tank with colorful corals why would you pay the extra money?are theese two polyps that different?
aquaph8
Love The Fish
Fair enough. I see where your coming from. It means a lot that you would correct the issue. I would see no problem with the name if people didn't buy them thinking their getting something else. Thanks for your reply and sorry if I sounded kinda harsh in my post. Please understand I have bought polyps thinking im getting something other than what I really got. Dont worry not from Vivid. Its really bad enough that most vendors use many forms of different lighting and photo techniques to make corals look better than they probably will in the consumers tank. Thanks for your reply.
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