if you ever have any problems with it being to cold, IMO the best thing to do is have a solar panel collecting energy, and having an electric heater in there, it might cost around 600 and up but its sure worth it in the long run, I am currently doing that with my own greenhouse without the coral tanks :/
Greenhouse project
- Thread starter dendronepthya
- Start date
dendronepthya
Premium Member
wonrib00,
I am still working on the purified water. I'm mulling some options, but I haven't found the most cost effective option just yet.
Zain,
We use a gas heater on a thermostat to heat the air. When you are dealing with this type of volume, you cannot heat or cool the water directly. In Anthony Calfo's book, he mentioned that the most cost effective way to stabilize the temperature in the tanks is to try and maintain a constant air temperature. During the day, the tanks build up some heat from the sun and slowly radiate it over the night. The water acts as a great heat sink and takes a lot of the burden off the heating and cooling systems.
Some greenhouses set up barrels of water just to act as a heat sink.
I am still working on the purified water. I'm mulling some options, but I haven't found the most cost effective option just yet.
Zain,
We use a gas heater on a thermostat to heat the air. When you are dealing with this type of volume, you cannot heat or cool the water directly. In Anthony Calfo's book, he mentioned that the most cost effective way to stabilize the temperature in the tanks is to try and maintain a constant air temperature. During the day, the tanks build up some heat from the sun and slowly radiate it over the night. The water acts as a great heat sink and takes a lot of the burden off the heating and cooling systems.
Some greenhouses set up barrels of water just to act as a heat sink.
I read through that article and I still don't get it about the surge.
I understand water in the bucket, air fills it up and then the watercomes back in. Is the surge/force created at your 2 PVC pipes above the water or is it created by the actually water movement into the bucket. Or is that one in the same? I'm really asking where exactly does the surge happen?
What it you had only the bottom of the bucket in the water and used a pump to remove the air from the bucket. Using the same inside plumbing that the normal CSD uses, eventually you'd have a syphon start and thus a very rapid surge would insue, in theory. Would that work or would it be to much for an air pump?
I understand water in the bucket, air fills it up and then the watercomes back in. Is the surge/force created at your 2 PVC pipes above the water or is it created by the actually water movement into the bucket. Or is that one in the same? I'm really asking where exactly does the surge happen?
What it you had only the bottom of the bucket in the water and used a pump to remove the air from the bucket. Using the same inside plumbing that the normal CSD uses, eventually you'd have a syphon start and thus a very rapid surge would insue, in theory. Would that work or would it be to much for an air pump?
dendronepthya
Premium Member
The surge is created at the bottom of the bucket when the air quickly leaves the bucket. There is a big whale-spout like splatter that comes out of the PVC exhaust, but that is more of a side effect. It creates waves no doubt, but it also creates a lot of salt-creep. I am working on having the exhaust blow into the middle tank where I can control it a little better.
? I loved the pics about the plumming, even though it made me feel like a bit of a geek.
sfsuphysics
Active member
So I assume the 64 dollar question is that the green house does infact recieve enough light? Seems like a fantasy dream for me, although in this #@*&(!(*@& city land is at a very high premium, so having a large backyard where one could do something like that (even on a small scale) is prohibited.
A question though, is there any reason why you decided to have frosted panes in the room rather than clear? Is the difused light more desirable? Less algae problems?
A question though, is there any reason why you decided to have frosted panes in the room rather than clear? Is the difused light more desirable? Less algae problems?
dendronepthya
Premium Member
Thanks guys.
The amount of light coming into the greenhouse is a lot more than what I was expecting. It is the middle of summer, and during the day, I will get PPFD (read: darn close to PAR) readings of around 2000 in direct sunlight. That is basically what you would expect from about an inch away from a 400W halide. I am already planning on building some shade cloths because I think any coral I put into the tanks right now would bleach and die immediately. During the winter, it will be a different story altogether, so I wanted to have shade cloths that can be moved away easily.
The polycarbonate panels aren't really frosted. It is the strcture of the sheets that tends to scatter the light. I will have to take a closeup of the sheet material to show everyone. They are actually more clear than not.
I plan on getting a lot more done in the greenhouse later this month when some more goodies come in the mail. I'll post pictures again when that gets finished.
The amount of light coming into the greenhouse is a lot more than what I was expecting. It is the middle of summer, and during the day, I will get PPFD (read: darn close to PAR) readings of around 2000 in direct sunlight. That is basically what you would expect from about an inch away from a 400W halide. I am already planning on building some shade cloths because I think any coral I put into the tanks right now would bleach and die immediately. During the winter, it will be a different story altogether, so I wanted to have shade cloths that can be moved away easily.
The polycarbonate panels aren't really frosted. It is the strcture of the sheets that tends to scatter the light. I will have to take a closeup of the sheet material to show everyone. They are actually more clear than not.
I plan on getting a lot more done in the greenhouse later this month when some more goodies come in the mail. I'll post pictures again when that gets finished.
dendronepthya
Premium Member
There have been a few questions on the polycarbonate sheets, so I thought I'd post a pic. You can sort of see that is really is pretty clear, but from a distance it scatters and distorts the light.
dendronepthya
Premium Member
This is a treat for those still interested in the RCSD. I took a short movie of the RCSD as it was firing. You can't really see much of a surge in the tank, but you can see the exhaust when it fires. It is why I am so concerned about creating a huge salt-creep mess and thinking constantly about a muffler system.
http://www.shrugsoft.com/coral/images/rcsd.mov
http://www.shrugsoft.com/coral/images/rcsd.mov
partagas
New member
"There have been a few questions on the polycarbonate sheets, so I thought I'd post a pic. You can sort of see that is really is pretty clear, but from a distance it scatters and distorts the light."
Just a quick questions about sheets. How is it at holding heat in? Also how much does it ditort light?
Just a quick questions about sheets. How is it at holding heat in? Also how much does it ditort light?
dendronepthya
Premium Member
You can see in the picture that looking through the sheet is kind of like looking through plastic. Because the structure of the sheet is a series of vertical rows, the walls of those rows breaks up the image you see. You can see general shapes and things outside of the greenhouse, but it would be difficult to make out any detail.
In terms of light, it does reduce the PAR in the greenhouse significantly. I would guess we are losing about 20% (just a guess), but what is getting through is still very intense. It is intense enough that I am already planning on building shade cloth frames for the tanks. I can tell that on a sunny day, direct sunlight will probably cause mass bleaching.
The sheets are designed to be decent insulators because of the air pocket in the sheets. We have not gone through a winter yet with the greenhouse fully sealed and the gas heater on. Even in the partially constructed state however, it was always about 10 degrees warmer in the greenhouse than outside. I think once we winterize all the doors and vents as well as fire up the heater, the greenhouse will be able to maintain heat pretty well. Having a 2500 gallon heat sink doesn't hurt either. Water temperatures remain remarkably stable when the air temperature is stable.
In terms of light, it does reduce the PAR in the greenhouse significantly. I would guess we are losing about 20% (just a guess), but what is getting through is still very intense. It is intense enough that I am already planning on building shade cloth frames for the tanks. I can tell that on a sunny day, direct sunlight will probably cause mass bleaching.
The sheets are designed to be decent insulators because of the air pocket in the sheets. We have not gone through a winter yet with the greenhouse fully sealed and the gas heater on. Even in the partially constructed state however, it was always about 10 degrees warmer in the greenhouse than outside. I think once we winterize all the doors and vents as well as fire up the heater, the greenhouse will be able to maintain heat pretty well. Having a 2500 gallon heat sink doesn't hurt either. Water temperatures remain remarkably stable when the air temperature is stable.
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