help with possible precipitate

[Ewan]

Hello,

I have a problem that appeared lately, that I've never dealth with before. The variables are almost endless, so I'll try to keep it to the point.4 weeks ago I tore the reef down so that we could do some large renovations in the basement. The tank was very lightly stocked, as I have been anticipating this move for a long time.

When the tank was set back up, everything went well. No noticeable spikes, and I kept up with 10% WCs every 4 days with tropic marin salt. I have a calcium reactor on this tank, but it is offline until I am stocked up again.

After what I believe to be an overdose of kalkwasser, The tank turned cloudy 1 week ago. The day before this event, it was very hot in the room, as the woodstove was going. The chiller turned on several times that day. Safe to say temps were 3-4 degrees above normal at certain part of the day.

I have read "What is that Precipitate in My Reef Aquarium?" several times now, and I elected not to panic, as per the directions. However, it's been 1 week, and I'm not seeing any improvement.

Here's some fun facts:

ph has gone from 7.9 avg to 8.1 avg (noted 1 hour after lights on)
Alk went from 8.7dkh to 6.4 dkh
Ca went from 475 to 410 ( I am comfortable with 410... just the drop concerns me)
and Mg went from 1350 to 1200ppm!!

my Diatom filter does NOTHING to 'cut the fog'. I have used the diatom filter a few times to clear up the orange phosban cloud, and numerous other clarity issues for friends and club members. I've NEVER seen the diatom filter not get the job done. It's my ace-up-the-sleeve for quick cleanups.Also, the cloudyness is like a smoke in the tank, you can see this smoke rolling in the currents.

Admittedly, I did (2) waterchanges in 3 days. 15% each. This also did little to help. I was surprised and disappointed about that.

So, I've got a brute container mixing fresh salt water, and I'm ready to do some big waterchanges, unless there is something else that I should do. I have never had such an event, any help would be appreciated.


Oh- also, I typically keep:

Alk - 9dkh
Ca - 420ppm
Mg - 1300ppm

The 'before' numbers above were with kalkwasser alone. I'm currently building a home theater, so the aquarium is in a holding pattern until that project is done, at which time I'd like to begin to stock it again. I didn't anticipate these problems with a couple of leather corals and some coralline-encrusted rock.

Thanks for any help.

-Rob

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

So the tank water is still milky?

This sounds unusual as usually the water looks like milk where you cannot see individual particles in the current.

Is there no low flow place place in the system for things to settle?

Are you skimming?

The diatom filter left it just as cloudy?

I'd stop the limewater for a while to be sure it is not an ongoing issue. It is clear settled limewater, not milky limewater, right?

The other possibility is a bacterial bloom causing the cloudiness. Add any organic materials to the tank, either accidently or on purpose?

 

[Ewan]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13833283#post13833283 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Randy Holmes-Farley
So the tank water is still milky?

This sounds unusual as usually the water looks like milk where you cannot see individual particles in the current.

Is there no low flow place place in the system for things to settle?

Are you skimming?

The diatom filter left it just as cloudy?

I'd stop the limewater for a while to be sure it is not an ongoing issue. It is clear settled limewater, not milky limewater, right?

The other possibility is a bacterial bloom causing the cloudiness. Add any organic materials to the tank, either accidently or on purpose?

The tank water is still milky. There is a sump with relatively low flow, and a skimmer. The diatom filter leaves it just as cloudy! I even double-checked the fittings, etc.

I stopped limewater 3 days ago, and I'm topping off with RO/DI only for a few days.

I did so many careless things in such a short amount of time, I did add some aminos a few weeks ago.

I can't figure out what it is, but I'm guessing a possible bacterial bloom perhaps? In any event, I have lots of mixed saltwater on hand, perhaps I should proceed with water changes. It's certainly not a milky color, rather visible particles. They must be very tiny to get by the diatom filter though. I ran it on 3 occasions. Initial impressions were a slight improvement, but after a short while it was back to square one.

I guess that would be consistent with a bacterial bloom, huh?

 

[Ewan]

Also skimming wet, and I use a 100micron filter sock, changed out every 2 days. No apparent impact.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

If you fill a glass and can still see the ppt against a dark background, try adding vinegar to it. If it dissolves then it was calcium carbonate. If it does not, or just settles out, then it might be bacteria.

Is it coating the glass and rocks? Calcium carbonate precipitates often settle onto these things pretty quickly.

 

[Ewan]

I filled a glass and put it on a black desk with a strong lamp, but the ppt was very hard to see. I added vinegar, and it settled to the bottom (the best I could see... )

It's not coating the glass or rocks, and I've had events in the past that settled out rather quickly, and left a powdery haze on the glass and rocks. Usually solved overnight though... nothing like this.

Maybe a nasty cycle on my hands, despite my best efforts. I would have to guess that it does not look to be precipitate from overdosing limewater... I guess I just can't spot a bacterial bloom.

I guess there was a time I couldn't spot red bugs either. Now I can see them from across the street.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

So that all is suggestive of a bacterial bloom.

What exactly did you add for amino acids?

Adding a UV, at least temporarily, might help.

 

[Ewan]

zeovit aminos. Just a couple of drops. Also fed some questionable frozen fish food, which was thrown out recently... should have been thrown out a long time ago.

Thanks for your time. Much appreciated!

-Rob

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

A few mL shouldn't have been a problem. I'm not sure what caused it.

 

[Sk8r]

When you were moving things around, is it possible your test kits got exposed to extremes, broke down, etc? Get your lfs to do a dkh and ph test just to be sure. Also, watch your pumps: if you are having precipitate to that degree, you may experience a pump stoppage (vinegar will fix it). If you are getting powdery precipitate onto the glass, choosing a convenient time to do a pump-clean may save you an ill-timed emergency.

 

[Ewan]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13833788#post13833788 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Sk8r
When you were moving things around, is it possible your test kits got exposed to extremes, broke down, etc? Get your lfs to do a dkh and ph test just to be sure. Also, watch your pumps: if you are having precipitate to that degree, you may experience a pump stoppage (vinegar will fix it). If you are getting powdery precipitate onto the glass, choosing a convenient time to do a pump-clean may save you an ill-timed emergency.

Hi Sk8r. Sorry I missed you post. I appreciate you taking the time.

I moved the tank from one room to another while I was doing the renovation, however, tings were placed in different tanks, there were buckets with pumps everywhere. Probably lots of chances for things to be less than ideal.

I did take the opportunity to clean all the pumps, my sump and the overflow while the tank was apart. Several years back, I was keen on keeping my alk in the 12+dkh range After creating a calcium carbonate sump-within-a-sump, I backed wayy off the high ALK and Ca over the years. Much less CaCO3 buildup since. I'm no stranger to cleaning pumps though...

It's been almost 2 weeks, and the cloudyness has let up enough for my wife to comment on it (that makes me happy), but it's not the crystal-clear water that I strive for. Not yet. It certainly appears to be a bacterial bloom, and I've got it on the run. It's subsiding in to a flatworm outbreak, which I'm not happy about. I've never had an issue with flatworms in the past. There's been nothing added to my tanks in literally 3 years!!! Ever since I moved back to Canada.

Back to the bloom, I've been changing 25% of the water every other day, and the results are good after 3 changes. I ordered a sterilizer, and I'm hoping that will help me clear up the remaining haze.

I recall seeing a good article about flow rates for target organisms with UV sterilizers, but I can't find it for the life of me. Anyone happen to have a link?

Thanks,

-Rob

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

If you still have cloudiness, then it is very unlikely to be calcium carbonate, and the UV is a good bet to try. It will probably come with a flow recommendation. You'll probably be after bacteria here, and they are easier to kill than many parasites.