Help with tank troubles please

[chuckawd]

A good friend of mine has had a 30 gallon tank set up for almost 4 years running strong throughout the time it has been up. A quick run down of his equipment is as follows:

-30 gallon
-Marineland 350 GPH HOB filter with bio-wheels
-Skimmer
-tap water with water conditioner
-Lighting has changed over the years from PC, to 4 bulb PC, back down to 112 watts of t5 lighting and that is where it stands now.
-The tank is loaded with coral from softies all the way to higher end chalices and acros, frogspawn etc. Lots of zoas as well
-5 smaller fish and a decent sized CUC
-All levels test well
-SG 1.026
-ammonia, nitrite, nitrates 0, 0, 20ppm
-Po4 .025
-Calc and Alk are both 450ppm and 9dKh

Now, the issue he is facing is that his corals are essentially dieing or bleaching. Two of his largest colonies of acropora are turning white, a huge powder blue is starting to turn to skeleton, all softies are doing ok, a few of his acans are basically sunken in and showing skeleton.

So we are looking for any suggestions as to what is going on here. The only thing we can think of is the fact that he's been using tap water for 4 years now and, most likely, there's a build up of nutrients in the water that we can't do anything about without breaking down the tank and moving all corals to various other tanks.

 

[jfl14609]

when you say powder blue do you mean acro or tang?

 

[jfl14609]

also a small tank with a lott of corals do you run carbon

 

[Capt_Cully]

First thing I'd do is a HUGE water change! 50% or so. Remember to let the fresh mixed salt water to mix and aerate for 24 hrs. Nitrates are concerning with regard to acroporas. Any temp swings? Need a Ca, Mag, and dKH STAT! That's the jumping off point for me.

Hopefully we can get this figured out in time.

Edit: i see the ca & dKH....

 

[low riderr]

could be warfare among the coral ,i would get carbon running and a poly filter wouldnt hurt.really need to think about an rodi system also.

 

[victorcan]

The tap water with conditioner would be the 1st thing to address. You can't be in this hobby w/o a rodi in my opinion... It is just suicide to try using tap... Also heavy carbon dosing is a must going w/ softies in a tank w/ sps I had a similar prob with acros about a yr ago got rid of my leathers and things rapidly improved after a big water change ... Why things went well for 4 years and than all the sudden go bad is unknown could be a million things... But to correct it I would start with rodi 50% waterchanges 2/3 x p/ weekfor the next couple weeks the leathers may be spawning and the put off some nasty crap in the water...


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I am here: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=43.022428,-78.693124

 

[chuckawd]

Thanks for all of the replies everyone!! I really appreciate your help thus far. He is running carbon in the HOB filter as well as pads etc. He is also running nitrate reducing pads and phosorb in the filter. What we are thinking is that it is just a major build up of nutrients in his tank from using tap and it seems like the tank has reached a saturation point of no return. Unfortunately, setting up a RODI system or buying it from the LFS is not an option right now.

Everything is happening fast in this tank as if it's crashing. Although I have never actually witnessed a tank crash, I have read plenty of horror stories about it happening and I hope that is not the cash. He has been doing massive WC of 50% or more for the past month since he has noticed a general decline in coral health but in just the past week, things have taken what appears to be a turn for the worst.

Also, the powder blue is a chalice I believe. At least that's what he is calling it. Might not be the correct name but it's beautiful.

Below is a picture of the tank from 2 months ago when it was thriving:

 

[jfl14609]

Looking at the amount of coral in that tank i see two main things first carbon carbon carbon. that tank is a massive chemical warfare. second ditch the tap no matter what. if your doing tons of water changes you very well may be adding some metals into the system that are less than desirable. I would also recommend a better skimmer on a side note

 

[teamdulski]

Carbon
Good Skimmer
30-50% water change with RODI water

 

[PufferNut]

Hey you come down to the strip again soon and you buddy has a jug I can hook you up with some ro/di. I have about 40 gal waiting in a brute at all times.

Heck if he would hook me up with a frag or two I might deliver even

 

[cardiffgiant]

Good feedback here. I would also go with carbon (I like ROX 0.8 from bulk reef supply), and water change with RODI. As others have noted with the tap water, after 4 years of using it to top off from evaporation, there could be high metal and mineral content in the water. Any difficulty in keeping snails or hermits would raise a red flag.

Also, any possibility of a recent alkalinity swing?

 

[Gary Majchrzak]

allelopathy

allelopathy

I agree with what Jeff posted.

do large water changes- even if it's with tap.

 

[Capt_Cully]

Too expound, be sure to siphon off as much detritus from every nook and cranny that you can.

 

[Gary Majchrzak]

A good friend of mine has had a 30 gallon tank set up for almost 4 years running strong throughout the time it has been up. A quick run down of his equipment is as follows:

-30 gallon
-Marineland 350 GPH HOB filter with bio-wheels
-Skimmer
-tap water with water conditioner
-Lighting has changed over the years from PC, to 4 bulb PC, back down to 112 watts of t5 lighting and that is where it stands now.
-The tank is loaded with coral from softies all the way to higher end chalices and acros, frogspawn etc. Lots of zoas as well
-5 smaller fish and a decent sized CUC
-All levels test well
-SG 1.026
-ammonia, nitrite, nitrates 0, 0, 20ppm
-Po4 .025
-Calc and Alk are both 450ppm and 9dKh

some changes I would suggest:
*get rid of the bio-wheels
*install RO and stop using tapwater conditioner
*expect Acropora to fare poorly in allelopathic warfare

 

[chuckawd]

Thanks again everyone for all of the help!! You all really are great group of people.

The plan of attack for right now is to add as much carbon to the system as possible and do a massive WC. Sadly, RODI isn't possible for various reasons but this is what we have to work with.

I am certainly thinking now that, since it's mostly acropora that's being affected, it is chemical warfare in such a densely stocked tank. TOnight, he is moving all of the soft corals out of the tank and leaving only LPS and SPS and a few muchrooms and adding lots of carbon with a big WC. I will report back ASAP with any results!!

Thanks again for all the help!!

 

[pascal32]

some changes I would suggest:
*get rid of the bio-wheels
*install RO and stop using tapwater conditioner
*expect Acropora to fare poorly in allelopathic warfare

(1) read above
(2) add a poly pad - first line of defense whien things go south
(3) check magnesium - LPS will recede without proper magnesium levels
(4) carbon
(5) softies love chemical warfare (see 4)
(6) read the quote from Gary again
(7) check for copper

Keep us posted!

 

[chuckawd]

UPDATE: It's been three days since we have taken any sort of action towards the tank but I believe we have figured out exactly what the problem is. Salinity was almost nothing or at least at the very bottom of the hydrometer. I personally use a refractometer for accuracy and will be loaning it to this guy with the tank troubles. He has slowly been bumping the salt levels up for a few days and is currently at 1.020. This has to be at least part of the cause of all of these ordeals.

The reason the salinity has dropped so much I firmly believe is because of these nitrate reducing pads he started using roughly a month ago. All of these issues have only been happening within the last month as well and they were absolutely caked with salt when we pulled them out.

Hopefully we will begin to see some improvements in the next few days!!

 

[josepha]

Certainly the salt is a major contributor to your problem, however definately not the only problem. Jeff, Gary, Mark, Pascale and others all had good suggestions. I agree with the nitrate concern and that could be a result of the bio wheels, tap water and water changes needed. I also agree that the tank is tightly packed and needs constant water changes with RODI and carbon with carbon changes.