How this Geezer did it in the beginning

[Paul B]

Spieszak. I collected these amphipods today about 1:00 in the afternoon. We ate on the boat, took a nap, took a swim, read the paper, looked at the fish jumping and now it is 6:48. I threw them in my tank a half an hour ago.

I don't know if that is clear but I could go collecting, and it takes 20 minutes to get back to the dock, then it is about another 20 minutes to my house, then I change the water that I collect with the amphipods because that water is not that great and I changed it again at my marina. I really don't want much of my marina water in my tank. But after that, I dump them in. Why does it make a difference? I don't have to aclimate or quarantine them or anything, sometimes I may look at their teeth to see if they have gum problems but generally they all go in.
For every one you see there are fifty babies that you can't see in the picture.
I collected about 3 times more than this today but my wife kicked over the bucket and I had to hunt for them on the carpet of the boat.
I can easily collect thousands of them but I go every few days so I don't need that many.

 

[Paul B]

I will probably go again this week if the tide is right. I asked people to go collecting many times but the last two times everyone cancelled that morning which drives me crazy so I don't like to invite people collecting any more.
It takes a lot of time to get the boat ready to go there and when I want to go, I want to go.

 

[MX175]

subscribed.

 

[Sunshine252]

All of this from Long Island? My husband did some dredging work up there a couple of years ago and it would have been awesome to do some collecting but it was the middle of winter, of course. LOL Love this thread!

 

[spieszak]

The reason i'm asking is i have a trip coming up, and was considering just some mud/sand... with the plane trip, it would probably better than 8 hours in closed container from water to tank...seems like an excessive amount of time to me...kind of wanted to hear your thinking...

 

[markaren]

Paul...briefly off topic, well sorta. I put NSW and complete cultured "Real" Live Rock (years old with critters) and guess what. The tank hardly Cycled. Thank you for enabling me to be brave enough to ad raw...real...fresh "stuff". I am positive it has made my experience exciting and successful immediate.

...please resume your scheduled broadcast...

 

[skidoctor]

I'm contemplating the same scenario as Spiezak. I'm heading to Cape Cod in july which is an 8 hour drive. I was wondering if it would be worth it to do some collecting. Nothing in particular- maybe some sand and rock, pods, inverts- whatever I can find while wondering around. I thought to bring a bucket and a battery operated air pump. I figure it will have as much chance of survival as any on-line purchase which has to be shipped.
I guess my real question is whether or not these will be compatable with my tank since it is sounnatural and sterile?

 

[Shells4]

Skidoctor--we collect every year and drive from South Carolina to northern Indiana, a minimum of a 14 hour drive. We also start collecting a couple of days before we leave SC. We just do a water change everyday. On the way home we run an air pump and about half way home do a small water change. We fill up a couple milk jugs with ASW. We do get some strange looks at the rest stop while we are changing water. We always have very good survival rate.

Paul, the hermits you are referring to we keep in our tank. We keep our temperature around 80 and they have been alive a couple of years so far. My dad has some that lived several years. Just interesting since they are from cooler water. Maybe we just have been lucky.

 

[Paul B]

Amphipods have no problem staying in a bag or bucket for 8 or 16 hours. They live under rocks with very little oxygen and the temp gets very high, into the 90s. But If you collect them, I would put them in a cooler and try to keep them cool. As long as you don't collect thousands of them, they should be fine. Stacey, even in a closed bag they will be fine, just put in 1/2" of water to keep their gills wet and put in something for them to hold on to like a plastic piece of window screen, nothing that will rot in the bag like seaweed. That would use up the oxygen. They don't even have to be completely under water as long as they are in a very damp substrait.
I once sent a bag of them to Bob Goemans in Arizona in the summer time and he thanked me for the boiled shrimp.

the hermits you are referring to we keep in our tank. We keep our temperature around 80 and they have been alive a couple of years so far.

The New York Hermit crabs live in water that goes from about 35 degrees to about 75 degrees. They do not live long in a reef tank but they will live for a few months. The ones you find in South Carolina are used to much warmer water which never gets to 35 degrees. Those would be semi tropical. I have tried NY hermits many many times but I don't collect them any more. My avitar is a NY hermit which was about 1/2" long.

Mark, I told you so. :lol:

I guess my real question is whether or not these will be compatable with my tank since it is sounnatural and sterile?

SkiDoctor, that is up to you, they will survive and be an asset for your tank but I know people worry about paracites and everything else in a sterile tank. If you are the type of person that quarantines everything, then you may not want to do this as you can't dip there amphipods in fresh water. They die very quickly in fresh water.
You could keep them in salt water and change the water a few times over a few days as any paracites will not live on amphipods. I have never had any problems with this but not everyone has my tank or should do follow my methods. My tank stays healthy through the addition of natural bacteria and amphipods along with some NSW. It will take a while to get your animals in a state of health where you can do these things.
If you mainly feed flakes and pellets, then I would not recommend putting anything natural in there as your tank may be very suseptable to paracites.
This is my theory and many people will not agree with me.
If you don't agree with this, they you should not be reading this thread because it is full of things that many people will not agree with and if they were standing in front of me would be smacking me up side my head for my theories. :blown:

 

[skidoctor]

I definitely do not quarintine anything. I did my first water change last week after 6 weeks of letting the tank go. I've got some great cyano in my sump, no filter sock which lets critters in the fuge get all the crap. My tank is healthy, but definitely not sterile. I test only when it seems something is wrong, and the inhabitants have lived through some of the dumbest saltwater mistakes like temperature fluctuations to bad silicone sealant. I feed a frozen mixture or mysis and certainly not on a scheduled timeframe. I've tried pellets but they fall to fast and just cover my sandbed. I wouldn't know how to "dip" something if its or my life depended on it.
I think I'm going to try- what's the worst that can happen? Granted, everything can get infected, but then I'll have to learn how to uninfect. I've heard that bleach can cure that

 

[anbosu]

I remember when Kalk dosing came out and I had to build this plexiglass container with a stirrer in it, the water would enter and the stirrer would mix it all up and put it in my tank. The tank never looked so bad and had more problems than when I was adding kalk. I don't know if it was something I was doing wrong but the corals were not happy. Stupid invention if you ask me. Now I just use Randy's home made two part calcium and there is no problems. Before Kalk I did experiment with lizzard calcium. They sell this calcium supliment that you are supposed to put on iguana food. You are not supposed to put it in fish tanks but the fish didn't know the difference. Fish, lizards, they are all cold blooded animals with scales so I figured it was the same thing. It didn't hurt anything but It probably didn't help either.
I don't ever remember dosing anything else but I probably tried a few things.
I never used any of that Purple Up or Marine Snow, vitamins or anything else.
I did use vitamin C for a while to try to cure HLLE and for some reason it seemed to work on a French Angel but I was also giving him fish oil so I am not sure which made it better or if it was just luck. A fish like a French Angel really looks lousy with HLLE because they are black.
What even happened to French Angels, they used to be one of the most common fish but now you rarely if ever see them. They must come from some place where collecting is banned. I think I saw them in Hawaii

They are all over in the Keys, they just get too damn big for most aquariums, so they aren't sold very often retail.

 

[spieszak]

I definitely do not quarintine anything. I did my first water change last week after 6 weeks of letting the tank go. I've got some great cyano in my sump, no filter sock which lets critters in the fuge get all the crap. My tank is healthy, but definitely not sterile. I test only when it seems something is wrong, and the inhabitants have lived through some of the dumbest saltwater mistakes like temperature fluctuations to bad silicone sealant. I feed a frozen mixture or mysis and certainly not on a scheduled timeframe. I've tried pellets but they fall to fast and just cover my sandbed. I wouldn't know how to "dip" something if its or my life depended on it.
I think I'm going to try- what's the worst that can happen? Granted, everything can get infected, but then I'll have to learn how to uninfect. I've heard that bleach can cure that

Uninfecting can be a nightmare, and there are times when your losses are major, or complete before you have a chance. Its your choice to make though, and there is just no guarantee either way....
I have a little 5 gallon tank with not much in it that I'll be using for my "experiment" if I do decide to do this.

 

[skidoctor]

That's an even better idea. I have a 7g tank I had set up for quarintine. Never used it so I shut it down. I think I'll re-set it up before I go, and then use that to dump my findings in. Thanks for the suggestion.

 

[Paul B]

Uninfecting can be a nightmare, and there are times when your losses are major,

I wonder why I never have these problems with infecting, un-infecting, ich, the heartbreak of psorosis and all of that. I guess I am just lucky
I built this mobile today. And finished the room

 

[spieszak]

I wonder why I never have these problems with infecting, un-infecting, ich, the heartbreak of psorosis and all of that. I guess I am just lucky
I built this mobile today. And finished the room

The mobile is awesome! Uhmm is cookie monster hanging by his neck? Your least favorite of the muppets?

And to the "why you haven't had those problems",...you have a proven technique working for you...i'm willing to admit i'm not up to your level as far as thats concerned, and i personally feel better about a 5 gallon experiment tank than i do a large dt ... call it choosing to err on the side of caution if you like..

 

[Sunshine252]

That is SO cute! You are a man of many talents...

 

[Paul B]

Uhmm is cookie monster hanging by his neck?

Well I guess he is looking down at the baby, which is not in there yet and may be born this week or next.

Caution is of course better

 

[spieszak]

Caution being better is subjective....doing somethings with caution results in being afraid to act... but in this case it makes ME feel better...
Congrats on the pending arrival!

 

[mgargiullo]

Paul, this is inspiring. I'm going to have to try this. I'm only about 45 minutes inland from Manasquan. I know when I used to dive, you could see all kinds of stuff at the inlet in late August.

 

[Paul B]

I'm only about 45 minutes inland from Manasquan

Isn't Manasquan where in like 1907 a bullshark swam up river and ate three kids?
I think that was the place. Try not to collect bullsharks, they will eat all your amphipods.
I really don't know how you guys keep tanks without adding stuff from the sea.
And Yes, I understand not everyone lives near the sea. I have spent quite some time in Kentucky, Indiana, Colorado, Arizona and parts of California away from the sea.
I loved Colorado but could not live inland. (I was stationed there for about 5 months) If Colorado had an ocean it would be perfect. An Ocean and Christi Brinkley, then it would be perfect. I think I am part fish and I just have too much seawater in my veins to stay away. My family have been fisherman in Sicily since time began. We used to sell fish to Jesus, but we gave him a discount.
My parents and of course, me were born in the US.
So I am all American.

I also don't know how people keep tanks without a diatom filter. There are numerous things I don't know. 16 actually, there are 16 things I don't know, probably more also.
Why don't everyone feed live blackworms? I guess they are not available everywhere because people from all over the world ask me where to get them.
I tell them to go around the corner from my house and just buy them, but I guess that is not always possable. Earthworms work and are great for larger fish, even anemones love them.
Whats the thing with bloodworms? I am tired of telling people they are not worms. Mealworms are also not worms just like camels and emu's are not worms, there are lots of things that are not worms.
Why doesn't everyone hatch brine shrimp? I don't know. Simple things to do.
Why are there so many posts about problems, mini cycles, ich, and hair algae? Who knows? But I think that most tanks are existing on the edge of crashing. I am not sure why but my "theory" is that they are too sterile and have nothing from the sea in them. Thats my theory but many of my theories may not be correct, they are just random thoughts that pop into my mind and I mull them over trying to figure them out, sometimes un successfully. All of this fish tank stuff is common sense. Well all of it except for the chemistry part, that is Randy's deal. And I find that that takes care of itself. Especially for many people who (for some reason) change water every day which I feel is a waste of time and actually detrimental.
(another theory) To me, seawater is kind of stable and in all the years I have been doing this (and that is since Eisenhower was president, yes we had a President named Eisenhower) I have never had to adjust pH. :fun2:
I just like this picture, (and with out baby brine shrimp, I am not sure I can keep this guy, long term)