:lol:
Great thread, and congrats on having such a long-running tank. That's quite an accomplishment!
How this Geezer did it in the beginning
- Thread starter Paul B
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:lol:
Great thread, and congrats on having such a long-running tank. That's quite an accomplishment!
Genesis Corals
New member
I have enjoyed reading this thread. Congrats on having a long marriage and a long reef.
Sir, You are a gentleman and a scholar, and a hero. All of our vets are heroes, people just forget it some times. I just found this thread last week. Yeah, it took me a week to get though all of the pages, and then people kept posting and there were more pages to read. I think it is great that you started this post to show us noobs, tank only up for two year, how the hobby has evolved, and I expect many new members do not understand all of the trials that were involved with fish care in the early days. I even enjoyed the random side stories. As another poster said, many pages ago, it is like sitting on the porch with Grandpa. You have a way of writing that I really enjoy. Not only do you get the information across, but there is usually a bit of humor and you are always polite. Politeness is something I rarely see on the internet. People seem to think that they can be mean because they don't have to see the person they talk to, or yell at, in person. Look at me, I started rambling and I know I am less then half of your age.
Again, thank you for this thread. It was a great read, and I am a little sad to be all caught up because now I don't know what I will read when I have a few minutes, or need a laugh.
Again, thank you for this thread. It was a great read, and I am a little sad to be all caught up because now I don't know what I will read when I have a few minutes, or need a laugh.
Paul B
Premium Member
I am glad you enjoyed it, I was not sure anyone read this stuff as 97% of it is not about fish and the last 3% is about Paris Hilton.
I try to be polite and it is true there is so much animosity on these forums, I mean it is a hobby, not a contest. People tell me all the time that my corals lack color. I don't know, maybe they do. But they are what I like to see and I just don't have any colorful corals and I don't use photoshop. (I don't really know how to use it or I would have my pictures of me look like George Cluney). :uhoh3: I was swimming laps this morning and I was thinking that I can really keep fish healthy for a long time but I have had some problems with other animals. A few years ago my neighbors who have turtles and lizzards running freely all over their house asked me to watch their tortoise while they went to California for vacation. It was a little yellow tortoise about 3" long and when I was a kid I always had them. So the day they were leaving I took the creature and put him in the little tank they gave me. They told me to give it a dish of water and some lettuce.
So I got the turtle in this tank and as my neighbors were driving away I checked on the tortoise. The cute little thing walked over to the water, looked up at me, smiled, and dropped dead.
I mean literally, it croaked and my neighbors hadn't even gotten to the corner. Did you ever try to perform CPR on a reptile? Not a pretty sight.
So I froze it until they came home and I had to tell them I killed the thing in 2 minutes. :facepalm:
That was not the only time I had a problem with a reptile. A few years later my closest friend and his wife were also going to California. Until now, I never put it together that it may have something to do with California. Everything you buy says it causes cancer in California. Anyway, my friend goes to California and has this 4' Iguana they want me to lizard sit for.
They gave me this huge tank and said to give it apple sauce, banannas and crickets. There was this big tree limb in the tank and they told me he sits on this limb all day. So the first night I have the thing, I am sleeping and my wife says she hears a cricket. Now if my wife sees an ant I have to sell the house and move to a different state. So I say I will investigate. I didn't tell her this lizard eats crickets and I had a bucket of them in my workshop.
So I go downstairs and there are crickets jumping all over the place. Like fifty of them. My wife yells down to se if I caught "the" cricket.
I told her that I am chasing "him" and it may take a while. I get out my shop vac, and this is a Manly shop vac, not one of those sissy shop vacs that will suck up belly button lint, this thing will suck snot out of your head from across the street. I am crawling around sucking up crickets and I got most of them. There were a few stragglers that croaked a few days later but luckily, my wife didn't hear them.
Anyway about the lizard. The first day I get the thing I bring him in my back yard and I have a leash on him. I put him on his favorite log, and he immediately falls off and lands up side down with his feet in the air. Great, I had visions of that stupid turtle. But he was alive and I didn't have to pound on his chest, get the paddles or anything like that. He could move his front legs but his back legs were paralyzed and he would pull himself along with his front legs and drag his back legs. Now I saw lizzards all over Viet Nam and I know they can run pretty fast. This one couldn't catch a sea urchin stuck in peanut butter in a parking lot.
So I bring it to my neighbors who are the reptile experts. I wasn't sure they would help me after I killed their turtle, but they told me I had to feed it Alpo dog food and sprinkle calcium on it. (I am always involved in animals that need calcium) So I get Alpo and calcium and in a few days the thing started walking and running. In a weeks time he was doing the macarana.
I was happy about that. A few weeks ago my other neighbors wanted me to watch their dog. I never had a dog and know nothing about dogs so I told them the story about the tortoise and Iguana. For some reason, they got someone else to watch their dog.
This guy walked up to me out of the jungle in Nam and we became friends, he would eat rats and sit on a Howitzer all day.
I try to be polite and it is true there is so much animosity on these forums, I mean it is a hobby, not a contest. People tell me all the time that my corals lack color. I don't know, maybe they do. But they are what I like to see and I just don't have any colorful corals and I don't use photoshop. (I don't really know how to use it or I would have my pictures of me look like George Cluney). :uhoh3: I was swimming laps this morning and I was thinking that I can really keep fish healthy for a long time but I have had some problems with other animals. A few years ago my neighbors who have turtles and lizzards running freely all over their house asked me to watch their tortoise while they went to California for vacation. It was a little yellow tortoise about 3" long and when I was a kid I always had them. So the day they were leaving I took the creature and put him in the little tank they gave me. They told me to give it a dish of water and some lettuce.
So I got the turtle in this tank and as my neighbors were driving away I checked on the tortoise. The cute little thing walked over to the water, looked up at me, smiled, and dropped dead.
I mean literally, it croaked and my neighbors hadn't even gotten to the corner. Did you ever try to perform CPR on a reptile? Not a pretty sight.
So I froze it until they came home and I had to tell them I killed the thing in 2 minutes. :facepalm:
That was not the only time I had a problem with a reptile. A few years later my closest friend and his wife were also going to California. Until now, I never put it together that it may have something to do with California. Everything you buy says it causes cancer in California. Anyway, my friend goes to California and has this 4' Iguana they want me to lizard sit for.
They gave me this huge tank and said to give it apple sauce, banannas and crickets. There was this big tree limb in the tank and they told me he sits on this limb all day. So the first night I have the thing, I am sleeping and my wife says she hears a cricket. Now if my wife sees an ant I have to sell the house and move to a different state. So I say I will investigate. I didn't tell her this lizard eats crickets and I had a bucket of them in my workshop.
So I go downstairs and there are crickets jumping all over the place. Like fifty of them. My wife yells down to se if I caught "the" cricket.
I told her that I am chasing "him" and it may take a while. I get out my shop vac, and this is a Manly shop vac, not one of those sissy shop vacs that will suck up belly button lint, this thing will suck snot out of your head from across the street. I am crawling around sucking up crickets and I got most of them. There were a few stragglers that croaked a few days later but luckily, my wife didn't hear them.
Anyway about the lizard. The first day I get the thing I bring him in my back yard and I have a leash on him. I put him on his favorite log, and he immediately falls off and lands up side down with his feet in the air. Great, I had visions of that stupid turtle. But he was alive and I didn't have to pound on his chest, get the paddles or anything like that. He could move his front legs but his back legs were paralyzed and he would pull himself along with his front legs and drag his back legs. Now I saw lizzards all over Viet Nam and I know they can run pretty fast. This one couldn't catch a sea urchin stuck in peanut butter in a parking lot.
So I bring it to my neighbors who are the reptile experts. I wasn't sure they would help me after I killed their turtle, but they told me I had to feed it Alpo dog food and sprinkle calcium on it. (I am always involved in animals that need calcium) So I get Alpo and calcium and in a few days the thing started walking and running. In a weeks time he was doing the macarana.
I was happy about that. A few weeks ago my other neighbors wanted me to watch their dog. I never had a dog and know nothing about dogs so I told them the story about the tortoise and Iguana. For some reason, they got someone else to watch their dog.
This guy walked up to me out of the jungle in Nam and we became friends, he would eat rats and sit on a Howitzer all day.
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Paul B
Premium Member
Test kits did not exist at that time because virtually no one (except me) kept salt water fish. Nitrate kits came out first and I used to change my water when the nitrates went up to about 50. There was no reef tanks, only fish and fish are not that sensitive to nitrates. Our tanks grew algae on everything but we just removed the dead coral skeletons that we used for decoration and soaked them in bleach. That cleaned off the algae and as a side benefit, removed the nitrates along with the algae.
I rarely use test kits now and if I wanted to know a parameter I would bring some water to a LFS and they will test it for free. Let them buy the test kits. A couple of weeks ago I brought in some water and this is my readings.
Salinity 1.026
Nitrate 40
PO4 .25
Calcium 420
If you read these forums, those readings don't look great. But I have no algae, my SPS and LPS are growing very nicely, almost all my fish are spawning including the 20 year olds and all seems well. Should I tweek the parameters to lower the nitrates, lower the PO4 or change the salinity? I don't think so.
I go by the look of the tank overall. If the corals were bleaching, I would look into it, if the fish stopped spawning, I would change something, but there is absolutely nothing wrong with the animals so why would I change anything? :smokin:
In this picture (circa 1973) you can see that blue devil over his nest of eggs. Notice the green tinge on the dead coral skeletons. We didn't want that and as soon as the eggs hatched, I probably removed all that coral and bleached it. We wanted bright white dead coral. That's the way salt water tanks were. Very unhealthy by today's standards. But even then I was breeding fish. The secret then and now is live worms.
This picture is when I just was installing my tank in a wall. (1976) You can see a couple of the white skeletons I just bleached and put in there.
I rarely use test kits now and if I wanted to know a parameter I would bring some water to a LFS and they will test it for free. Let them buy the test kits. A couple of weeks ago I brought in some water and this is my readings.
Salinity 1.026
Nitrate 40
PO4 .25
Calcium 420
If you read these forums, those readings don't look great. But I have no algae, my SPS and LPS are growing very nicely, almost all my fish are spawning including the 20 year olds and all seems well. Should I tweek the parameters to lower the nitrates, lower the PO4 or change the salinity? I don't think so.
I go by the look of the tank overall. If the corals were bleaching, I would look into it, if the fish stopped spawning, I would change something, but there is absolutely nothing wrong with the animals so why would I change anything? :smokin:
In this picture (circa 1973) you can see that blue devil over his nest of eggs. Notice the green tinge on the dead coral skeletons. We didn't want that and as soon as the eggs hatched, I probably removed all that coral and bleached it. We wanted bright white dead coral. That's the way salt water tanks were. Very unhealthy by today's standards. But even then I was breeding fish. The secret then and now is live worms.
This picture is when I just was installing my tank in a wall. (1976) You can see a couple of the white skeletons I just bleached and put in there.
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SpartaReef
New member
Vastly different from today's reefs and very different view on parameters. I agree though, if everything is doing good, why change something? Other than to experiment of course.
Whiterabbitrage
New member
Thank you Paul for the cool stories and for bringing back memories of days gone by.
appellativo
New member
Thanks for the laughs Paul!
Im trying to rig a worm tray for culturing/keeping. Wish me luck as I am unhandy AND broke
Im trying to rig a worm tray for culturing/keeping. Wish me luck as I am unhandy AND broke
Mudbeaver
New member
Great read
Great read
Hi great your thread, lots of good info and fun stuff.
I'd like an opinion and you seem to be the person to ask since you've used them.
I'm building a system a 150g reef tank with a refugium that will feed my reef via gravity. In my reef i'll have only a 2" sand bed. My 75 g fuge however will house a collection of macro-algae. A friend of mine got spooked about using mud in his tank,so he gave it to me, i'm not i'll use it for its substrate quality plus i plan to have a deep sand bed is 5 inch thick enough? The fuge will also contain seahorses on one side and in the other angler or scorpion fish . Thank you for your time.
Chris
Great read
Hi great your thread, lots of good info and fun stuff.
I'd like an opinion and you seem to be the person to ask since you've used them.
I'm building a system a 150g reef tank with a refugium that will feed my reef via gravity. In my reef i'll have only a 2" sand bed. My 75 g fuge however will house a collection of macro-algae. A friend of mine got spooked about using mud in his tank,so he gave it to me, i'm not i'll use it for its substrate quality plus i plan to have a deep sand bed is 5 inch thick enough? The fuge will also contain seahorses on one side and in the other angler or scorpion fish . Thank you for your time.
Chris
Paul B
Premium Member
If you are going to install a DSB using mud, it will crash in a week or two as it is to, well, muddy. You can make a DSB from sand but being I dislike DSBs I would not be the person to give advice on them as I think they should put a fence around DSBs and burn them.
But 5" of sand seems fine. :smokin:
But 5" of sand seems fine. :smokin:
Mudbeaver
New member
LOL ok my buddy must of read some of your thread lol. No mud, but i'm good with the 5" , got ya , congrats on the anniversary and your success, and thank you for your wisdom :wavehand:
Paul B
Premium Member
I broke one of my cardinal rules and hired someone to fix the air conditioner on my boat. $350.00 and it lasted 4 weeks. It uses freon that you can't buy any more so I can't get it myself. I may take the thing out and take it home to fix which is a real pain, or just get a new one, but they are almost $2,000.00 for a tiny one.
That is the main reason I never hire anyone for anything. People just don't fix things correctly and if you want something done right, you have to do it yourself.
That is the main reason I never hire anyone for anything. People just don't fix things correctly and if you want something done right, you have to do it yourself.
samindenver
New member
Great read. It sounds like you and I are about the same age. I also moved to a marine tank in 71 while I was in graduate school. I was lucky in that I lived in the LA area. I had a 55 gal tank (which was a huge tank at the time). Being in LA I used fresh sea water and had to go down to the Newport or Balboa every weekend to get fresh water for water changes. Underground filters were the norm back then and I experimented a bit by taking an undersink water filter and hooking it to a exteral pump to make a canistar filter (boy I wish I had patiented it). I would read everything that I could find on saltwater aquariums but there was very very little available. Somewhere I got the idea to make a DYI (I say DYI but everthing back there was DIY) UV filter. I took a UV 3' floresent light and put it on the floor behind the tank then wrapped it with clear tubing and let water trickel through it with a small pump. In LA there were a few fish store and only a few of those carried saltwater fish. Somehow we managed though. There were no test kits refractomoters or anything like that. Everthing was fly by the seat of your pants. By late 72 to early 73 we were even able to find a few pieces of coral but nothing looked anything like the corals we have available today.
In 73 I moved from Claremont to Denver and tried to move the fish and tank with me. I put the livestock in a 5 gallon bucked and tried to use a battery powed air pump to keep the airflow going while driving accross the country. I left around midnight because of the summer heat (no air conditioning in my car). Well about 2 in the morning while driving through the California desert the temp hit 102. Well anyone for sushi? By the time I got to Denver I was able to find a few fish stores and we were able to restock my tank. I've been in and out of the hobby ever since.
How times have changed.
In 73 I moved from Claremont to Denver and tried to move the fish and tank with me. I put the livestock in a 5 gallon bucked and tried to use a battery powed air pump to keep the airflow going while driving accross the country. I left around midnight because of the summer heat (no air conditioning in my car). Well about 2 in the morning while driving through the California desert the temp hit 102. Well anyone for sushi? By the time I got to Denver I was able to find a few fish stores and we were able to restock my tank. I've been in and out of the hobby ever since.
How times have changed.
Paul B
Premium Member
Yes, you are also a Geezer :lmao:
I love Denver and lived there for about 5 months when I was stationed in Colorado Springs. But it really needs an ocean and I can't be away from one for that long.
I remember those days well, but the hobby was more interesting then because we had to experiment and everything was a challenge. We bought a fish and had no idea how to take care of it but that was the challenge. Today it is simple, the internet makes it confusing because there are to many opinions from people who kept one or two fish and their methods become fact even though many times they are completely wrong. I am sure in those days I had ideas that now I realize are very wierd and toxic. Luckily there was no internet for me to publish those wrong theories. I started a book in the 70s and still have it, but today it would be considered so outdated that Marvel Comics may want to use it in there Super Hero comic books as a way to eliminate all marine life :lol:
I love Denver and lived there for about 5 months when I was stationed in Colorado Springs. But it really needs an ocean and I can't be away from one for that long.
I remember those days well, but the hobby was more interesting then because we had to experiment and everything was a challenge. We bought a fish and had no idea how to take care of it but that was the challenge. Today it is simple, the internet makes it confusing because there are to many opinions from people who kept one or two fish and their methods become fact even though many times they are completely wrong. I am sure in those days I had ideas that now I realize are very wierd and toxic. Luckily there was no internet for me to publish those wrong theories. I started a book in the 70s and still have it, but today it would be considered so outdated that Marvel Comics may want to use it in there Super Hero comic books as a way to eliminate all marine life :lol:
reeftanknewbie
New member
Amen to that one:mtool::mtool::mtool::mtool::mtool::mtool::mtool::mtool::mtool::mtool:
appellativo
New member
Paul, I would kindly but firmly insist that they come make good on it if it were me. Good luck!
Paul B
Premium Member
The problem is that they are the only company on Long Island with in 50 miles from my marina and I am at their mercy. They put Freon in the thing and it worked for a few weeks. I am in negotiations for them to take the thing out, solder the leak and put it back in. I want them to deduct $300.00 from the $700.00 repair bill.
Hopefully I will get them to replace the Freon with the newer type that I can get and install myself for the next time it leaks. Probably in 3 more weeks.
I just got back from Manhattan and it is not even 9:00am. I left here at 5:30 this morning to beat most of the rush hour traffic but of course there was an accident and the 30 minute ride took over an hour. I really hate going to Manhattan as I worked there for 40 years and I thought I would never have to see the place again. But my Daughter lives there and of course my granddaughter so I have to go in all the time. If it was up to me, I think they should put a fence around it and burn it. After my Daughter leaves of course.
My Grandaughter helps drive the boat.
Hopefully I will get them to replace the Freon with the newer type that I can get and install myself for the next time it leaks. Probably in 3 more weeks.
I just got back from Manhattan and it is not even 9:00am. I left here at 5:30 this morning to beat most of the rush hour traffic but of course there was an accident and the 30 minute ride took over an hour. I really hate going to Manhattan as I worked there for 40 years and I thought I would never have to see the place again. But my Daughter lives there and of course my granddaughter so I have to go in all the time. If it was up to me, I think they should put a fence around it and burn it. After my Daughter leaves of course.
My Grandaughter helps drive the boat.
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