I intend to do no water changes in a large system.

I understood this idea isn't meant to be sold, but how do I say this...

I think the project would be more compelling if people could look at it and instantly be able to relate to it. That being if it were merely packaged in a suitable size for the common living room. Interesting nevertheless... of course.

ah,I see,I missed that,I guess because it is compelling to me,but I am weird that way :lmao:

I would love to have all those tanks set up in a system like that,but my wife would kill me if I tried to do something like that in our living room...home decor is not one of my strong suits though :D
 
what an awesome concept and well planned out. tagging along, i'd love to find out how it works out down the road
 
madreefist!!!
please come back!
you are indeed mad and that is what makes this thread so interesting.
you have a crazy enthusiasm that is infectious.
i'm very interested to watch your system develop.
i hope you'll post some updates soon
 
hmmm What do you intend to put into the tank? besides cleaners? if you have no ideas ide like to suggest a Giant Puffer, although they are a bit rare and hard to care for it would fit right in in your tank. Oh and do you know where i can purchase mangrove seeds?
 
In considering that I'll effectively have 225+ gallons of 'aquarium', and even more system-wide, the idea of 25'ish% water changes every 'time scale' doesn't only sound like work, but sounds like it'll add up in salt fees. Especially taken under the pretense that the same filter media's that can be exhausted will also have to be replaced regardless (labor + money). Nevermind the electricity and light replacement costs.

On-the-cheap yet grand-scale is a major theme that drives me. To me it seems like initially going overkill on the sustainable / natural / rechargable methods as much as possible, and add suppliments when needed would save time and money.

In the past couple weeks since I've gotten back into this full swing, I've been looking for claims of zero water changes or at least close to that tune.
-Apparently people are running tanks with awesome results using simply sealed 5 gallon buckets filled with "sugar sand" (Home Depot play sand) hooked up in line.
-Multiple sources claim zero water changes using 1 floating mangrove seed pod per 10 gallons of 'aquarium'.
-Boyd Chemi-Pure claims no water changes w/ the media's replacement time of up to 6 months.
-Others claim BioPellets can give these sorts of results.
-I read a thread on here yesterday where the guy is building a special fuge system where brine shrimp live inside the runoff detritous chamber and eat the aquarium detritous and then reproduce. He describes a method that allows only the BBS to pass thru into the plumbing back into the main tank.
-A key component in GARF's designs is a plenum underneath the DT substrate.

[If anyone knows other methods claimed to give near/zero water changes please let me know. I want to design everything like this in before I do final plumbing.]

Those last 2 I didn't even read until yesterday. In my old days in the hobby I always wanted to do mangroves, but I forgot the floating seed pod method until yesterday and that using that method 'only requires' 1 pod per 10g. I didn't have the 16g mangrove platform style vessel until 2 days ago, got it for free real lucky. In my old days I recall seeing stuff that looked like biopellets, but don't remember ever reading about the science behind that method in those days.

My reasoning is that if people get awesome results with single approaches from that list above, then I'll scale them (all) up as far as I can and try to do each better.

Like with the 5g DSB buckets. I figure the average reef tank is about 100g, while 5g buckets are only 15" tall. Here I'm employing approx 100g of LIVEsand+LIVEmud+flora+fauna at a depth of about 36". If people actually run '100g' tanks with a 5g bucket DSB as their ace in the hole, then my DSB alone should run 225g nicely.

I don't intend to plenum the DT's, but even better I hope will be to plenum the DSB. This will 'force' the microbes to spread thru the other layers in there which should speed up the maturity even better.

My idea the past couple weeks was to use outdoor drainage 'perf pipe' running down to the floor so that an open water column would be exposed to all of the layers. After seeing the BS 'detrivore reactor' fuge idea yesterday, it seemed like I might be able to easily add that into this water column area. I found that trying to find out if people have raised clownfish fry inside fuges with the food sources they provide.

After getting refreshed on plenums last night, I decided to instead use a sealed outdoor drainpipe (that I already have) instead of the perf pipe (which I dont have) that forces the water up from underneath the DSB. My remaining challenge here is how to enable the BBS to leave this chamber periodically without always allowing the water to escape into the top of this fuge thru the top of this pipe.

If theres any truth to Boyd's claims, then adding all of those other filter medias with it should get results. In a couple months I can double up on Boyd or other medias, as or if needed. To save money I didn't go overkill on all of the filter medias per gallons they claim to uphold. Like with the BioPellets I decided on the smallest amount I could buy, it being $50+ on something I might not need at all.

But maximum diversity at every level is a major directive in this project and I definitely wanted at least some of it in the filter media chamber. As I freshened up on most of the filter media's out there these days, I wanted the wet/dry tower alone to be able to provide a near zero water change outcome. Stacking the square buckets is key providing access to each chamber as desired, and they only cost $1 each. At that price compared to the normal cost of acrylic W/D sumps, plenty of extra funds to have 5x the normal volume of bioball type materials you normally see underneath a 100g tank. Finding the new BIO-BALE material sweetened the deal, and I found it cheaper than bioballs (which I have 8g's of on hand).

Some people run their tanks with a few well rooted mangroves in the tank or sump. Others run it using 1 floating mangrove pod per 10 gallons of tank. This 16g vessel I got lucky on (free in mint condition) enables 84 pods at a 3" spacing. The only possible way I can use it is it will have to rest on top of the DSB tank which would have blocked me from having as many rooted mangroves as I wanted in there. I was going to not include this odd shaped box because of this, but after realizing the floating pod method last night I'm going for 84 floaters, and then one real nice size deep rooted mangrove sticking up out of the DSB fuge opening.

So I'm effectively going overkill with all of these methods (and any others that will fit in before I do the final plumbing next week), which apparently each provides zero water changes for some.

This should put them all to the test.

If I can get the BBS to successfully release into the fuge water layer while trapping the adults, I might even experiment with some attempts at raising fish fry in there. With all of the other microcritters in there it might just work when this thing matures, with a little luck.
i was wondering if you know where i can purchase some mangrove Seeds and how much they would cost.(your tank is awesome by the way and if you have no other ideas about what to put into it [in the way of fish] ide like to suggest a Giant Puffer even though they are a bit rare i think it would fit right in in your tank!or maybe a mini cuttlefish, although if you do put in a cuttlefish you might want to line the top inch or two of your tank with the soft side of velcro ,like in Octopi tanks because they are very smart and will actually escape your tank)
-Puffer
 
no water change

no water change

I started a reef tank march 13 2013. Its two 125 gallon tanks side to side with one tank stand. 3600 gph return pump. Reef octopus hurricone cat2e skimmer on 24/7 . 80 gallon refugium with three inch deep crashed coral and sand substrate and 80 lbs live rock . 900 gph uv light that is on for 5hrs/day. About 4 lbs of chaeo algae.I never do water change since then. My parameters are all in good shape. Sps, lps and some fish.
 
I started a reef tank march 13 2013...I never do water change since then. My parameters are all in good shape. Sps, lps and some fish.

6 months is still very new... why do you want to risk all LS at the cost of a bucket of salt!
 
In my experience, this method just doesn't work. There are chemical elements in the water that build through normal life/death cycles of organisms in the aquarium, as well as molecular compounds that are practically impossible to test for.

Even if NO3/PO4 and Ca/Alk are good, there are always other chemicals in the water. I figured out the hard way, there is no substitute for water changes.
 
This thread definitely proves how it can be a negative experience to share with others.
I will definitely be careful with whom I share "ALL" of my work with.
 
Looks really cool...and really scary! I can't even imagine all of that plumbing without thoughts of a poorly timed leak turning into a stream of pumped out water all over the floor.

Speaking of floors, I hope you seriously beefed up the joists and support of your floor. That is a LOT of weight!!

Best of luck! I hope you never have an issue and your experiment thrives!
 
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