is skimmer really necessary ?

laurentb

New member
after several reading i wonder if protein skimmer are really necessary. yes they remove a bunch of staff, but maibe too much. having a refugium with live sand, chateo, filter feders and water change, a reef tank can be more naturaly filtered with low DOC.
what are your thougt ?
 
i don't think skimmers are really necessary especially if you are running a refugium with a lot of macro algae... but then again, after seeing what a skimmer removes from a system, even a cheap one on a small tank, there's no doubt that it's helping...
 
Buy or build one. You'll never look back or be sorry. I did it for awhile on my last tank with a 110g sump/fuge on a 70g and even with that much cheato area a skimmer made a huge difference on water quality.
 
I'll bet it depends a lot on each system and what you're trying to keep. I had a 90 gallon mixed reef with an "ecosystem" style sump/refugium. Had a fuge of mud and cheato and all of the flow from the tank passed through this fuge, then back up through a mag 12 with a few bioballs in between. A fluval 404 was all the other filtration I had. No skimmer and I honestly did probably a handful of water changes in a couple years. Did have a 3-4 inch sandbed and ~120lbs LR. There's the background.

My LPS did just amazing- had crazy growth and extension. I worked in an LFS and would bring home a dieing galaxy or blasto with just a couple heads still alive and it would bounce back completely. The SPS, clams, and BTA's did fine, would open up and had some but limited growth. Softies for the most part thrived as well and had great color. When I broke down my tank a number of the corals went into a friends with prestine water quality (big sump, huge skimmer, chiller, auto top off, the works). The SPS and clams made clear jump in growth, but realtively the LPS seemed to almost stop growing.

Not calling these results typical or saying that they tank would have done well 5 years down the road, but just thought I'd offer a little food for thought.

-Jonny
 
I am happy to take 3 cups of sludge out of my tank per week.

I have a 10g without one, a 55g qt with one, and a 150g Reef with one.

My 10g only has one small damsel, a shrimp, a snail, a hermit, and some ricordia. I wish it had a skimmer on it. My 55g qt water is cleaner with 2 tangs, a foxface, an angel, 3 wrasses, and a clown goby...
 
Nope, don't need one. It really depends on how you want to run your tank.

I think Eric Borneman is a good example of an approach to skimming. By and large he does not run a skimmer on any of the tanks in his system. He does keep a skimmer handy and runs it while he is traveling. This is done as a preventative measure while he is not around to deal with any issues that may arise.

Eric gets good coral health and growth out of all of his corals, sps, lps and otherwise.

What you do need is nutrient processing and export capacity. A skimmer is only one type of nutrient export. The main downside of a skimmer is that it also removes a lot of food for corals: detritus, invert larvae...

If you do not run a skimmer, you need to have a deep sandbed to process nutrients and a way of exporting excess nitrate and phosphate. A macro algae refugium or ATS filter work well for this.

In my case, I keep seahorses, so I have macros growing in both my refugium and main tank. I also like all the other life that developes in a skimmerless tank.

FWIT Gary, I asked this question as well, and for me the answer turned out to be no. I would restate what you said as "If you are asking this question, you need to understand what a skimmer does in a system".

Fred
 
Re: Re: is skimmer really necessary ?

Re: Re: is skimmer really necessary ?

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8476901#post8476901 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Gary Majchrzak
IMO if you ask this question you need a skimmer to run a reef aquarium successfully.

I agree!
 
Ive done tanks both with and without skimmers.

My opinion is that you should use a skimmer if nessicary. To determine if its nessecary, simply consider your projected bioload. Anything beyond a medium bioload will require a skimmer.

And although skimmers are generally accepted as being a hobby standard, there are still debates as to what exactly the skimmer is removing and whether its good or bad.

There are so many people who run heavey setups. By this I mean, they have a heavy bioload, use lots of skimming and suppliments to keep their reef in balance.

I have SPS tanks that are skimmerless and dont receive any kind of dosing at all. The secret is keeping a low bioload.
 
By this I mean, they have a heavy bioload, use lots of skimming and suppliments to keep their reef in balance

Lots of people with 'heavy' setups do use skimmers, but it is not the only way to do things, even with such a setup. I go back to Mr. Borneman. This is someone who feeds his fish, corals, and inverts heavily and effectively uses no skimming.

Going skimmerless with a heavy bioload is probably harder to do than using a skimmer. With a skimmer, just plug it in, tune it and watch it suck tons of stuff out of the water. When using biological nutrient management, you need to ramp up your feeding gradually in order for the bacteria and organisms in your tank to keep up with the increased load.

there are still debates as to what exactly the skimmer is removing and whether its good or bad
Its very true that we do not know what exactly a skimmer is removing. I would not phrase it as good or bad exactly. It really depends on what you want to do with your tank.

On my previous reef tank I went back and forth several times and I always saw a reduction in sponges, foramineferans and feather dusters when I turned on my skimmer. Skimmers remove what would otherwise be food for these organisms, and may well also remove larvae.

Skimmers most definately remove very fine particulate mater and this stuff is food for many organisms, including coral. These organic flocs are also coated in bacteria; also a major source of food for some organisms.

For example, I have a free swimming harpacticoid copepod in my refugium that is quite abundant. The main food for harpacticoid copepods is detritus, and for a free swimming pod like this it would be small floating particulate matter. If I use a skimmer, I am directly 'competing' with my pods for their food source. Since I want these pods both as a food source for other things and for biodiversity in general, I am happy to give up my skimmer.

This is not a matter of right or wrong, good or bad, but a queation of what organisms and foods you want in your tank and why. Skimmed and skimmerless are both valid methods for maintaining a reef tank. Each method has advantages and challenges.

Fred
 
So what have we learned from this.....

You may or may not have to run one. I've asked the same question and got the same answers. Not that any of them are wrong, It's just a loaded question. I'm running a 65 w/o one and I'm now seeing some red algae in my system. So, I' considering getting one. But, I've been on the fence since I setup the system.
 
I used the ecosystem 3012 for 4 years with no skimmer and the tank thrived, no water changes(OK, once a year), just top offs, no chemicals, testing was useless, it was always perfect. Corals were just beautiful.
 
the question::::?????>>>>>>ARE SKIMMERS NECESSARY?

the answer:::::?????>>>>>>>DEPENDS ON WHAT YOU ARE TRYING TO KEEP

NO YES OR NO ANSWER....THERE IS A RIGHT ANSWER BUT "it just depends"

what is right in one situation may not be and probably isnt right in another

MY OPINION>>>i wouldnt run a tank without a skimmer
 
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