as far as pinks... i'm going by what I had in my tank under LEDs. My pink gonoipora popped nicely under the LEDs.
the colors that pop under actinic can really pop under blue LEDs, but that isn't the entire picture.
But Goniopora isn't a pink SPS coral (it's hardly even pink in of itself - similar to how some people say bleached setosa="pink" setosa). What about stylophora, pocillopora, birdsnest, pink millepora, etc.? None of them have popped under actinic for me because pink doesn't fluoresce.
Those color changes occurred within two weeks of metal halide and within one month I had a completely different tank. It was 100% evident it was the light and not a nutrient issue.
Funny how I post pictures with consistent coloration and they're "obvious those pics are touched up quite a bit" and your photos are all over the place in terms of blueness, brightness, etc.? That makes it a bit difficult to make a judgement based on your photos - not because I think they're edited but because even the ones with the same lighting are all over the place.
Quite simply, there are
too many variables that could influence coloration differences to just say "it was the LEDs." For all you know, it was even a "fluke" or "exception" (quoting you there) - a chance occurence. Not to mention, a simple change in light
intensity could certainly change coloration. In a non-lab setting, it's really hard to pinpoint cause and effect - this is a prime example.
Once upon a time I went to Vivid in order to qualify statements I made regarding the difference on coral color on either side of their LED/MH experiment. This is the same tank with the same nutrients. Here are my findings.
Were these judgements made by the owner? Or your personal observations? Because if that's the case, I'm going to have to quote someone earlier on this topic: " So basically its your word...And taking someone's word is fine but again no offense but I don't know you personally." Did you take pictures at the very least? The video has pictures - your memory does not.
And regarding Dave's tank. I was one of the main people that not only convinced him to do the experiment but also to go with Radions. Dave is a retailer who needs to sell the latest hot products in the market. This would include LEDs. We've had many discussions on LEDs. He himself admits he puts the nicer pieces on the MH side.
Are you insinuating that he lied in the video to sell LED fixtures? That might be going a bit too far and is an unfair judgement. For all we know, he was genuinely interested in
experimenting - that's it. I would be interested to see where he admits to putting the nicer pieces on the MH side? Also, how does it make sense to try to "sell the latest hot products in the market" (LEDs) by putting nicer looking pieces under the MH side? Your statements contradict eachother.
The camera doesn't pick up the difference in look. It's there as plain as day in person. Unfortunately, Dave just had to replace a bunch of lost colonies with new ones on both sides after experimenting with vodka. While the MH side still looks better, a lot of the corals on both sides haven't had time to settle in and grow out under their respective lighting.
And why wouldn't the camera pick up the difference? They appear to be using a decent camera for the pictures and the pictures don't look very edited to me. If the differences were so drastic, we would be able to see it there and simply saying "the camera doesn't pick it up" doesn't work.
I've never said LEDs couldn't grow corals. My tank didn't die for the year it was under AI's. growth was even better under the Radions than under the AI's. Traditional lighting had an immediate and sustained impact on growth and color in my tank. The thing is, it's not like LEDs are being adopted slowly. I have seen a LOT of people convert or start new builds with LEDs. My argument is that corals will not look their best under LEDs.
And I wasn't the one to bring up growth - dvanacker was. I was simply bringing up that that's been proven time and time again, even under horrible spectrum.
Regarding LEDs not being adapted slowly...you only need to look around to see that's not true. Sure, there are a lot of builds trying commercial lighting fixtures, etc. - but the results from those aren't going to be so great with crazy supplements and cool whites. But I would be interested to see more than 5 DIY LED tanks that do the fixture
alone right - that's not forgetting other very important variables for coloration, like flow and nutrient levels, which are hard enough to get "right" regardless of lighting. Again, your experiences with LEDs may have been negative, but that doesn't mean that all LED experiences are negative.
Howard lied, he is dishonest. It's on his thread which the rc mods locked, I believe it's still viewable. For me he lost all credibility and I wouldn't be surprised if he grew his corals out under halides or T5s then switched the light unit to LEDs for when visitors came over or for when photoshoots took place. With a tiny tank that's very do-able. And yes, I am that cynical.
I'm not going to argue a ban because the mods did what they felt was best. But in his defense, Howard did say:
Those folks went as far as saying my tank is sponsored by Maxspect, which is simply an insult to me, this is MY tank, which sits in my living room and I paid for everything I used, including the LED fixtures! Yes I've a discount when I bought it from the store locally (I still have the invoice), but I still paid for my equipments. If this were a Maxspect sponsored tank, I would be using full Bubble King skimmers and GHL computer and full KZ Zeolite equipments already! Instead I'm using BM and DIY equipments like every other hobbyists on a budget.
Saying he lied flat out and therefore probably doesn't even use LEDs regularly sounds a bit
too cynical and "slippery slope" for me
I don't think any one has said on this thread LEDs can't grow sps. They can. What is being said is, there's a growing number of respected reefers who feel that LEDs provide inferior lighting for sps. Personally I'd agree and I echo the thrust of Darryl's posts. There's simply a lack of stonking sps tanks with LEDs as their only source of light. I'm talking about ones that have grown from inch long frags, into several feet colonies, with pictures that demonstrate rampant growth, superb colour, health and vitality.
Actually, there was a brief implication that LEDs can't grow SPS: "Also I didnt see much frag to colony growth in his tank." I addressed it and dismissed it, and that's the end. As I've said, that's been proven and is irrelevant. However, simply saying "more and more feel LEDs are inferior lighting" is opiniated and irrelevant - Argumentum ad populum. I find it interesting that you said that LEDs can grow corals and go on to talk about needing to see tanks that have "grown from inch long frags, into several feet colonies" for proof. Isn't that irrelevant to if LEDs can keep colorful corals?
.....the colors don't look right including your tank
The funny part is the only tank in this thread that looks good is Tony's t5 tank with his progression pics. I've seen many pictures & tanks that boast colors like his & my own t5's mimic those colors.
Before that I ran MH for 8 years & seen in person & in pics how great corals can look. So far LEDs aren't gettin it done.
I'll try to keep this response brief because it does sound like an echo of what others have said above. The main thing I found interesting about this was that
your tank doesn't have such fabulous colors yourself, yet you start by saying the "colors don't look right [in my tank]." If this had been an LED tank, don't you think that your colors look "typical LEDs"? That just proves, to me, that coloration is not all about lighting in the slightest.
