Ivan's terribly slow 225 build
- Thread starter IvanTheTerrible
- Start date
IvanTheTerrible
Fish Nerd
Waiting a month could be problematic, since February/March weather is unpredictable. I'd rather not lose them all to a polar vortex because the postal service didn't know they needed to stay somewhat warm. Since the weather is nice this week, I figured I would go for it. It's not a problem if I have to give them a little food. They can also spend some time in my 20 gallon tank. No chance of them starving in there :hmm5:. It's not exactly a TOTM candidate. Once this cycle completes, I'll be moving some frags and my clowns into the tank. Inevitably, the frags will bring some algae with them so I'm not too worried.
- Ivan
IvanTheTerrible
Fish Nerd
I have two XF150's with Icecap interface modules and the interface cables that let you change directions. Right now, they are running at a max of 70%. If I go much higher, I get waves crashing into the overflow box which makes a bunch of noise. The interface cables plug into the variable speed ports on the Apex (I have a classic, I assume the new one is the same) and the interface modules. The gyres plug into the interface module too, so it all works. It's pretty much plug and play. I needed a couple of extension cables for the gyre on the left side of my tank since the Apex is on the right side and under the tank. I got the extensions from CoralVue.
- Ivan
acer
New member
I was wondering how to use the Apex with Gyre's - so no Gyre controller is used? You just use an Icecap module on each Gyre with an interface cable? So, you go from the Gyre ->power cord out of Gyre -> plug that into Icecap module-> interface cable out of module -> plug into the variable speed plug on Apex. Is that correct? Can you control the variations on the Apex - or is it random?
Last edited:
IvanTheTerrible
Fish Nerd
That's it exactly. The power cord from the wall transformer also plugs into the Icecap module. With the Icecap and the right cables you can control speed and direction independently. I suppose you are limited by the number of profiles that could can be programmed into the Apex (32), but that should be plenty. The profiles can be set up as constant speed or ramp, so you can get some pretty crazy effects if you are imaginative.
- Ivan
IvanTheTerrible
Fish Nerd
So much for the warm weather. My snails should arrive tomorrow and the forecast now calls for a high of 34 degrees instead of the 40+ that was forecast when I ordered them. I guess I'll spend my day off on mailman watch all day. Nitrite on the tank is still sky high. I thought it would have dropped by now. I guess the snails will go into the 20 gallon tank for now. At least it will get a good cleaning.
I'm not sure what's up with my clownfish lately. Today the male decided the duncan would be a nice place to hang out. I've never seen them anywhere near it previously. The duncan doesn't seem to mind, even though he's being pretty rough with it, which is also surprising. It closes up whenever the shrimp goes near it. Maybe it knows the clown isn't trying to steal its food. I guess this is part of why i enjoy having a tank, you never know what you will see.
- Ivan
I'm not sure what's up with my clownfish lately. Today the male decided the duncan would be a nice place to hang out. I've never seen them anywhere near it previously. The duncan doesn't seem to mind, even though he's being pretty rough with it, which is also surprising. It closes up whenever the shrimp goes near it. Maybe it knows the clown isn't trying to steal its food. I guess this is part of why i enjoy having a tank, you never know what you will see.
- Ivan
IvanTheTerrible
Fish Nerd
Well nothing went as expected today. I had no plans to work on a fish tank today, other than changing about 4 gallons of water in the 20 gallon tank. Before doing that, I was going to sit around and wait for the mailman to show up with my snails. Our mail usually arrives around 1:00, so I was in for a relaxing morning. It really seemed like a good idea to do nothing, right up until I got bored. About 9:30 I decided today was the day to move my 20 gallon tank into the fish room. I was planing to do this at some point, but that day wasn't supposed to be today.
A couple of factors played into this decision, so it wasn't quite as irrational as it may seem. First, I've been slowly getting the Apex set up on the new tank. Eventually, I reached the point where I either needed to buy another EB8 or use the one from the 20. I had previously moved the probes to the sump of the big tank and bought an Inkbird heater controller. So the EB8 was really only being used to control the dosing pumps. I could dose manually, but that kind of thing gets old real quick for me. The second thing that factored into this decision was algae. I had some issues with hair algae and bryopsis a while back. I tried Kent Tech M, hydrogen peroxide, and GFO. I was able to get rid of that algae but went a little overboard with the GFO. So then my corals all bleached and the everything just looked bad. I quit using the GFO and that's when the cyano started. I did a few 3 day blackouts. They helped but the cyano kept roaring back. My water parameters all tested fine, but things just seemed to be unhappy. So, I've been debating how to proceed next. A big water change seemed like a reasonable next step. In true "go big or go home" fashion, I decided to change 100% of the water. So, it seemed like a logical time to move the tank. I informed my wife of the plan and her new role as Assistant Fishtank Mover. To my surprise, she took it well. Moving the tank was much easier with two people.
I started by removing the dosing pumps, jugs, etc. Next up was the light and HOB filter. I then started draining the tank. There were some small nasty areas under the rocks, but in general the tank was pretty clean. That's when the mailman showed up. I went outside and to get my snails and couldn't believe what I saw. Apparently fragile doesn't mean much.
Luckily, the box was about 10 times bigger than it needed to be (good job Reefcleaners), so none of the bags were broken and all of the snails looked fine. Since I didn't have any water in the 20, I had to float them in the sump of the big tank for a while. I would blame poor planning on my part, but since I didn't have a plan.
When I started my 20, I siliconed most of my rocks together. Now, I had to take them apart to fit them into the buckets. I scrubbed each rock with a toothbrush to get rid of as much cyano as possible and peeled off any remaining silicone. Now, I had to rebuild an aquascape that would be stable with the benefit of silicone. After a few adjustments, I was fairly satisfied and filled the tank with new water. Once the fish were back in the tank, I went ahead and put the snails in there as well. There isn't a lot of algae left at the moment, but I doubt that I've won the algae war. So, they should have something to munch on soon. Most of them have been moving around, so it appears that most made the trip. In fact, a bunch of them decided to make a run for the light and tried to escape the tank. I might have lost a couple, but it's too early to tell. I'll check them tomorrow to see if any are dead.
I'll probably need to get more snails in the future, but this should be enough for now. I bought 10 dwarf cerith, 10 Florida cerith, 5 nassarius, and 3 nerites. Along with the snails, I ordered some chaeto. I unbagged it and through it in the sump. Maybe I was too rough when unbagging it, but it pretty quickly started to disintegrate. The small pieces were sucked into the return pump and were floating around in the display. So, I spent the next hour knocking snails back into the water and fishing for chaeto pieces with a net. Eventually, it dawned on me that I should just put some filter floss in the bubble trap (slow brain day apparently). Things have settled down now and I have a slightly smaller ball of chaeto spinning in the refugium.
With the tank moved, I was able to set up the Apex and clean up the sump wiring some more. Since the room is so small, I can run a long hose from the dosing pumps in the stand to the 20 gallon tank. Tomorrow I get to clean up the stand the 20 was sitting on and move my daughter's freshwater tank onto it.
At some point during my attempt to clean up the sump wiring, I stuck my hand in the water and felt what I thought was a shock. Just to be sure, I stuck my hand in three more times (again, slow brain day). After unplugging some equipment, I determined the shock is coming from the Mag24 on my skimmer. I guess it was getting back at me for complaining about it being too loud. Anyways, I sent Jeff at Lifereef an email to see about replacing the pump with a Vecra M1. Jeff's been great to work with so far, so I'll probably buy a vectra from him even if I can't get my money back for the Mag24.
So, to sum things up. I've got another tank in the fish room, snails trying to escape their temporary holding tank, an ongoing battle with cyano, chaeto floating around in the big tank, and a skimmer with a bad pump. But, at least I wasn't bored all day.
- Ivan
A couple of factors played into this decision, so it wasn't quite as irrational as it may seem. First, I've been slowly getting the Apex set up on the new tank. Eventually, I reached the point where I either needed to buy another EB8 or use the one from the 20. I had previously moved the probes to the sump of the big tank and bought an Inkbird heater controller. So the EB8 was really only being used to control the dosing pumps. I could dose manually, but that kind of thing gets old real quick for me. The second thing that factored into this decision was algae. I had some issues with hair algae and bryopsis a while back. I tried Kent Tech M, hydrogen peroxide, and GFO. I was able to get rid of that algae but went a little overboard with the GFO. So then my corals all bleached and the everything just looked bad. I quit using the GFO and that's when the cyano started. I did a few 3 day blackouts. They helped but the cyano kept roaring back. My water parameters all tested fine, but things just seemed to be unhappy. So, I've been debating how to proceed next. A big water change seemed like a reasonable next step. In true "go big or go home" fashion, I decided to change 100% of the water. So, it seemed like a logical time to move the tank. I informed my wife of the plan and her new role as Assistant Fishtank Mover. To my surprise, she took it well. Moving the tank was much easier with two people.
I started by removing the dosing pumps, jugs, etc. Next up was the light and HOB filter. I then started draining the tank. There were some small nasty areas under the rocks, but in general the tank was pretty clean. That's when the mailman showed up. I went outside and to get my snails and couldn't believe what I saw. Apparently fragile doesn't mean much.
Luckily, the box was about 10 times bigger than it needed to be (good job Reefcleaners), so none of the bags were broken and all of the snails looked fine. Since I didn't have any water in the 20, I had to float them in the sump of the big tank for a while. I would blame poor planning on my part, but since I didn't have a plan.
When I started my 20, I siliconed most of my rocks together. Now, I had to take them apart to fit them into the buckets. I scrubbed each rock with a toothbrush to get rid of as much cyano as possible and peeled off any remaining silicone. Now, I had to rebuild an aquascape that would be stable with the benefit of silicone. After a few adjustments, I was fairly satisfied and filled the tank with new water. Once the fish were back in the tank, I went ahead and put the snails in there as well. There isn't a lot of algae left at the moment, but I doubt that I've won the algae war. So, they should have something to munch on soon. Most of them have been moving around, so it appears that most made the trip. In fact, a bunch of them decided to make a run for the light and tried to escape the tank. I might have lost a couple, but it's too early to tell. I'll check them tomorrow to see if any are dead.
I'll probably need to get more snails in the future, but this should be enough for now. I bought 10 dwarf cerith, 10 Florida cerith, 5 nassarius, and 3 nerites. Along with the snails, I ordered some chaeto. I unbagged it and through it in the sump. Maybe I was too rough when unbagging it, but it pretty quickly started to disintegrate. The small pieces were sucked into the return pump and were floating around in the display. So, I spent the next hour knocking snails back into the water and fishing for chaeto pieces with a net. Eventually, it dawned on me that I should just put some filter floss in the bubble trap (slow brain day apparently). Things have settled down now and I have a slightly smaller ball of chaeto spinning in the refugium.
With the tank moved, I was able to set up the Apex and clean up the sump wiring some more. Since the room is so small, I can run a long hose from the dosing pumps in the stand to the 20 gallon tank. Tomorrow I get to clean up the stand the 20 was sitting on and move my daughter's freshwater tank onto it.
At some point during my attempt to clean up the sump wiring, I stuck my hand in the water and felt what I thought was a shock. Just to be sure, I stuck my hand in three more times (again, slow brain day). After unplugging some equipment, I determined the shock is coming from the Mag24 on my skimmer. I guess it was getting back at me for complaining about it being too loud. Anyways, I sent Jeff at Lifereef an email to see about replacing the pump with a Vecra M1. Jeff's been great to work with so far, so I'll probably buy a vectra from him even if I can't get my money back for the Mag24.
So, to sum things up. I've got another tank in the fish room, snails trying to escape their temporary holding tank, an ongoing battle with cyano, chaeto floating around in the big tank, and a skimmer with a bad pump. But, at least I wasn't bored all day.
- Ivan
IvanTheTerrible
Fish Nerd
Well everyone adjusted to the new tank location and it looks like all of the snails made the trip. The male clown is still loving on his duncan.
Sadly, the molly is sick. Lots of white stringy poop and her midsection looks swollen. I'm not sure if something came in with the snails, stress from the tank move, or just a coincidence. Anyway, I was moving the freshwater tank today so I had extra water. So, I flipped her back to freshwater and put her in a bucket with some of the old water and prazipro. Hopefully, whatever the issue is will be cured by the switch to FW or the medicine.
I also moved my gyres a little today. They were both in the center of the side panes near the top. In that location, the flow would periodically collide with flow from the SeaSwirls. That made for some great random movement but also created a lot of noise and occasionally some splashing. I moved them both forward, so that they are almost touching the front pane. I also adjusted the guards a little so that I could turn the speed up to 85%. Now, the front of the tank gets a strong gyre while the back gets a slightly weaker gyre but more of the random flow from the SeaSwirls. I'll leave it like this for a while to see if I like it.
Strange water tests today. Had a slight amount of ammonia. It could be from the expired test, but I don't know. It seemed to be testing fine before. Nitrite is still very high. I'm thinking about taking a water sample to the LFS to see what their tests read.
- Ivan
Sadly, the molly is sick. Lots of white stringy poop and her midsection looks swollen. I'm not sure if something came in with the snails, stress from the tank move, or just a coincidence. Anyway, I was moving the freshwater tank today so I had extra water. So, I flipped her back to freshwater and put her in a bucket with some of the old water and prazipro. Hopefully, whatever the issue is will be cured by the switch to FW or the medicine.
I also moved my gyres a little today. They were both in the center of the side panes near the top. In that location, the flow would periodically collide with flow from the SeaSwirls. That made for some great random movement but also created a lot of noise and occasionally some splashing. I moved them both forward, so that they are almost touching the front pane. I also adjusted the guards a little so that I could turn the speed up to 85%. Now, the front of the tank gets a strong gyre while the back gets a slightly weaker gyre but more of the random flow from the SeaSwirls. I'll leave it like this for a while to see if I like it.
Strange water tests today. Had a slight amount of ammonia. It could be from the expired test, but I don't know. It seemed to be testing fine before. Nitrite is still very high. I'm thinking about taking a water sample to the LFS to see what their tests read.
- Ivan
IvanTheTerrible
Fish Nerd
Bad start to the day. Something told me to check my phone when I woke up this morning. When I did, I noticed I had messages from Apex. One message said that a floor leak sensor was closed. I stumbled my way to the basement to check things out. When I walked in the fish room, the first things I noticed were a milky white 20 gallon tank and an ATO pump going crazy. Suddenly, I was fully awake and my brain was going a million miles per hour.
The float valve stuck on the ATO and for some reason the time limit didn't shut the pump off. Fortunately, most of the water went down the drain so I could concentrate on saving my fish. Both fish were at the surface and looked to be struggling. I grabbed a 5 gallon bucket and filled it halfway full with new saltwater. That's when it dawned on me to at least match the salinity. The 20 gallon was at 1.021, which isn't nearly as bad as I feared. I added some RODI to the bucket to and threw a heater in. I knew the water would be cold (about 70F), but couldn't wait forever for the heater to do its thing. So I got to work catching the clowns. That proved to be harder than expected, since they were impossible to see when they went below the surface. I caught the first one, stuck it in a Solo cup, and put the cup in the bucket. I tried to clean up a little while the temperatures equalized. It didn't take long. That little cup didn't hold much water so it quickly cooled down to match the bucket temperature. I figured I had nothing to lose, so I dumped the fish in and started trying to catch the other one.
Once both fish were in the bucket, I added some Prime and hooked another airline to the pump (which was already running for the sick molly). I couldn't find the shrimp in the cloudy water. Since things were at least stable, I quickly cleaned up and went to work - an hour late.
Fortunately, the fish are doing fine but the tank is a mess. I'm not sure how many of my snails are going to make it, but at least a few are moving around the tank. This evening the water was a little clearer, and I can see flesh falling off the corals. I was able to find the shrimp this evening, so he's in the bucket with the clowns now.
I tested the water in the new tank tonight and it still shows high nitrites. I took a sample to the LFS, just to confirm and their test showed the same thing. I bought a bottle of Dr. Tim's in the hopes that it will speed up the cycle. I'm not a fan of miracle potions, but I'm also not a fan of fish living in buckets. I dumped the Dr. Tim's in tonight, so we'll see if it works as quickly as many claim.
All in all, things could have been much worse. Had this happened a few days earlier, I would have had wet carpet. Had the ATO bucket been completely full, the salinity would have dropped much lower and the mess would have been bigger. I'm sad for my corals, but glad that all wasn't lost.
- Ivan
IvanTheTerrible
Fish Nerd
Unfortunately, I lost the shrimp today. :sad2:
Nitrites still reading high in the big tank, so the fish will spend another day in the buckets.
Water is clearing up in the 20. There is flesh falling off of the corals. Anyone have any advice on how to recover?
- Ivan
IvanTheTerrible
Fish Nerd
So, 85% on the gyres is too much. The sand shifted around and now I have bare spots surrounded by mounds of sand. I turned them down to 75% tonight. I'll readjust the sand later.
Nitrite reading is starting to fall. Down to 1 ppm today. Once it hits zero, I'll run a full set of tests to see where everything is.
- Ivan
Nitrite reading is starting to fall. Down to 1 ppm today. Once it hits zero, I'll run a full set of tests to see where everything is.
- Ivan
IvanTheTerrible
Fish Nerd
So, the tank finally cycled and all tests look really good. This meant it was time to add the fish. :bounce2: I was excited to see them in their new home. When I looked in the bucket, one of the fish was laying on the bottom. Since the lights had been out in the fish room, I figured it was just asleep. It jumped when I put my hand in the water, so I figured all was well. I grabbed both clownfish and put them in a small container of water. When I put them in the tank, the male dropped like a rock. The female got caught in the gyre flow and slammed against the side of the tank. :eek1: Eventually, she swam around to the side of the overflow and just stayed near the surface. Both were breathing very heavy and their color looked bad.
I decided to give them a little while to see if perhaps the bucket just had some bad water (it had Prime and a bubbling airline) or they were shocked by some untested parameter change. After about an hour, the female was still swimming by the overflow and gasping for breath. The male hadn't moved and was laying on his side on the sand. So, I decided to put them back in the bucket. I dumped out the old water and filled in with new. I added Prazi along with the Prime. Once it was up to temp, I grabbed the female and put her in. She was really easy to catch. Catching the male was a different story.
When I went to grab the male, he sprung to life and started swimming. He quickly found a cave in the rocks and decided to just hang there. Rather than exhaust him, I let him stay for a while. He didn't lay on the sand again and just stayed there in his cave. Once my kids were home, I decided to try to catch him again. I had no idea how hard it would be to catch a small fish in a tank this big. It makes it really difficult when you can't look through the side while your hand is in the top. Standing on a ladder doesn't really help things either. With my daughter's help I was much more successful. Once I flushed him out of his cave, he made a break for the surface. Eventually, he was swimming near the surface and hugging the side of the overflow (just like his girlfriend). This made him easy to catch and he joined her in the bucket.
This morning, I decided to give them a freshwater dip to see if that would help. When I put them in the FW, the male actually looked pretty good. This was surprising since I thought he was a goner last night. The female still looked bad and was very pale. They pulled through the dip fine and I put them back in the bucket. I had a meeting this morning, so I couldn't really monitor them to see how they were doing. I was half expecting to come home and find them floating in the bucket. To my surprise, they looked really good so I put them back in the big tank. This time, they both got caught in the gyre flow and my heart sank as they were swept sideways through the tank. Once they got to the side pane, the recovered and started swimming. For a while they wouldn't leave the area immediately over the gyre. I figured it would be just my luck for them to hang there forever, since so many people have clowns that like to hide in a corner or adopt a powerhead as a make-shift anenome. Luckily, they've now started swimming around and are slowly exploring their new home.
- Ivan
I decided to give them a little while to see if perhaps the bucket just had some bad water (it had Prime and a bubbling airline) or they were shocked by some untested parameter change. After about an hour, the female was still swimming by the overflow and gasping for breath. The male hadn't moved and was laying on his side on the sand. So, I decided to put them back in the bucket. I dumped out the old water and filled in with new. I added Prazi along with the Prime. Once it was up to temp, I grabbed the female and put her in. She was really easy to catch. Catching the male was a different story.
When I went to grab the male, he sprung to life and started swimming. He quickly found a cave in the rocks and decided to just hang there. Rather than exhaust him, I let him stay for a while. He didn't lay on the sand again and just stayed there in his cave. Once my kids were home, I decided to try to catch him again. I had no idea how hard it would be to catch a small fish in a tank this big. It makes it really difficult when you can't look through the side while your hand is in the top. Standing on a ladder doesn't really help things either. With my daughter's help I was much more successful. Once I flushed him out of his cave, he made a break for the surface. Eventually, he was swimming near the surface and hugging the side of the overflow (just like his girlfriend). This made him easy to catch and he joined her in the bucket.
This morning, I decided to give them a freshwater dip to see if that would help. When I put them in the FW, the male actually looked pretty good. This was surprising since I thought he was a goner last night. The female still looked bad and was very pale. They pulled through the dip fine and I put them back in the bucket. I had a meeting this morning, so I couldn't really monitor them to see how they were doing. I was half expecting to come home and find them floating in the bucket. To my surprise, they looked really good so I put them back in the big tank. This time, they both got caught in the gyre flow and my heart sank as they were swept sideways through the tank. Once they got to the side pane, the recovered and started swimming. For a while they wouldn't leave the area immediately over the gyre. I figured it would be just my luck for them to hang there forever, since so many people have clowns that like to hide in a corner or adopt a powerhead as a make-shift anenome. Luckily, they've now started swimming around and are slowly exploring their new home.
- Ivan
IvanTheTerrible
Fish Nerd
Thanks. I wish I knew what the problem was. When I emptied their bucket, there was what appeared to be white poop. So, I suspect whatever was ailing the molly affected them also. I just can't figure out what it was. I'm not a fish doctor, so my diagnosis skills are very limited, but in my research I haven't found anything that describes an illness that matches their symptoms and would have been cured by my actions. Maybe they just worked through it and nothing I did actually helped matters. Who knows.
- Ivan
IvanTheTerrible
Fish Nerd
Starting to get some discoloration on the rocks and a little on the sand. It would be nice if new tanks didn't go through an ugly phase.
Also, the duncan survived the kalk overdose, so I moved it to the big tank. It's not very happy and mostly closed up but I'm hoping it settles in soon. The clownfish will be happy to have his friend back. I did a 30 gallon water change today. When I tested it yesterday, alk was a little low. I didn't know if it was bad technique on my part or something else. I checked the Hanna checker with a standard and it read within spec. I also checked the water in my mix tank just to be sure and it read high (common for IO reef crystals). Checked alk again after the water change and it was still a little lower than I would like but in the acceptable range.
Now that the tank is running, I need to get back into my photography. I'm going to start shooing in RAW since that makes the white balance correction (and other adjustments) so much easier. I also need to find some cheap frags so that I have something to photograph.
- Ivan
Also, the duncan survived the kalk overdose, so I moved it to the big tank. It's not very happy and mostly closed up but I'm hoping it settles in soon. The clownfish will be happy to have his friend back. I did a 30 gallon water change today. When I tested it yesterday, alk was a little low. I didn't know if it was bad technique on my part or something else. I checked the Hanna checker with a standard and it read within spec. I also checked the water in my mix tank just to be sure and it read high (common for IO reef crystals). Checked alk again after the water change and it was still a little lower than I would like but in the acceptable range.
Now that the tank is running, I need to get back into my photography. I'm going to start shooing in RAW since that makes the white balance correction (and other adjustments) so much easier. I also need to find some cheap frags so that I have something to photograph.
- Ivan
IvanTheTerrible
Fish Nerd
So, one of my SeaSwirls quit working. I got them used, so there's no telling how old it was and how much use it has seen. I took them both apart before installing them, and they both looked good. I'm not sure if I'm going to replace it or not. I liked the flow, but they were kinda noisy. Not obnoxiously loud, but you could hear them if you were in the fish room. The clowns have taken up residence near the now broken SeaSwirl, so they're probably glad that it's not moving any more.
The duncan still isn't opening up. I moved it up a little higher since I'm not sure it was getting enough light. I'll leave it there for a few days to see if it does any better.
Since things are stable and all of the fish are settled into their new homes, I'm planning to go fish shopping on Friday. We're lucky in this area, we actually have several nice fish stores. It makes a nice day just driving from store to store and looking everything over. Hopefully, I'll find a few items from my stocking list. If not, I may have to risk an online order.
- Ivan
The duncan still isn't opening up. I moved it up a little higher since I'm not sure it was getting enough light. I'll leave it there for a few days to see if it does any better.
Since things are stable and all of the fish are settled into their new homes, I'm planning to go fish shopping on Friday. We're lucky in this area, we actually have several nice fish stores. It makes a nice day just driving from store to store and looking everything over. Hopefully, I'll find a few items from my stocking list. If not, I may have to risk an online order.
- Ivan
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