Joe's 48" LED fixture build - Coming Soon!

[RTMA]

Hey Guys. The LED build should start soon, here is a break down of what has been ordered / gathered. This will be a POC (Proof of Concept) build for my 75.

LEDS:
25 - XP-G "B" Bin R5 Cool Whites from Cutter
31 -XP-E Royal Blues from Cutter
All Mounted on 10mm Squares
48 - 10 mm Carclo Frosted Wide Optics

The Frosted Wide Optics are around 26.5 degrees. These are the ones I will try first. If I find them to be too narrow I will modify the build with either more LEDs or mount the fixture higher.

Drivers
DIY CAT4101 Drivers designed by Georgi. Replaceable resistors to allow customization of amperage. More to follow. SMD assembly should be fun.
Info available in this thread.
Awaiting Boards & components at the moment

PWM Controller
Prototype Hydra - Build has been crazy fun & many thanks to Georgi for sharing!
Info available in this thread
A lot still left to do, but it is progressing nicely.

Build Frame
(2) 44" 1 1/4" Aluminum Angle from onlinemetals.com
(3) 12" 3/4" Aluminum Square (Home Depot)
AC-Skip's Welding in Norwalk is currently welding the frame. Should be ready tomorrow.
Decided to spend a little more to have a little bit more of a finished look. Also thinking about powder coating for durability.

Heatsinks
Two - 13-1/4" x 7-5/16" x 1-5/15" Black Anodized Heatsinks from Ebay.
If I find I need more then two 13" lengths I will add LEDS mounted to U Channel or purchase an additional heatsink. Will use some Aluminum Angle to fit the 7-5/16" width to the 12" channel of the frame. This should allow me to slide the Heatsinks.

Power Supply
2 - 24V MPJA Power Supplies

Cooling - Planning on using either the two Antec 120mm Fans I already have or purchasing the SilentX 120mm. Still need to work out the details on powering & PWM based on heat readings.

Other Stuff
24 GA Pre-tinned Stranded Hook up wire from Bulk Wire.
Radio Shack Solder
Aoyue 937+ Digital Soldering Station

More to come!

 

[Wheel of Time]

The customizable drivers you/Georgi are designing are so intriguing....expands the possibilities of a lighting set-up so much. Saves so much money in the long run.

This is going to be a great build thread.
Thanks for starting it...Im taggin along.

 

[Falcao]

tagging along for the ride

 

[scolley]

tagging along for the ride

A very big +1 to that!

 

[clittrell]

Very cool. Tagging along!

 

[terahz]

This will be interesting. I'll watch too

Just to clarify, the dirvers are designed by On Semiconductor, the PCB layout was done by der_wille_zur_macht.

 

[RTMA]

Just to clarify, the dirvers are designed by On Semiconductor, the PCB layout was done by der_wille_zur_macht.

Thanks for clarifying. A big thanks to them for all the hard work.

 

[RTMA]

The Aluminum frame has been welded. Design looks like this.

Ordered two new 24" Heatsinks for more coverage & wider in case I want to add more LEDs. I plan on shortening them to 22" to fit better on the frame.

If anyone wants the Two - 13-1/4" x 7-5/16" x 1-5/15" Black Anodized Heatsinks, I'll sell them for what I paid ($39.00) just shoot me a PM.

The (2) 24v 6.5A Potrans power supplies have arrived.

LEDS from Cutter have arrived. According to the sticker on the optics case, these are the 10mm Frosted Mediums and not the wide. We'll see if these need to be swapped during the build. Need to find a way to secure the optics. 10mm is pretty small, but I saved a bit on the optics (roughly 1.15 per vs 4+ dollars for 20mm star optics). Here are some pics.

Testing the leds with optics.

Driver boards & components arrived also. (Thanks to Georgi for ordering!)

Here is a pic of the board designed by der_wille_zur_macht. I believe Georgi made some changes (to all smd components).

The ones with a gold dot in the corners are 1000ma for the XP-Gs & and the other two are 700ma for the XP-E Royals.

Here they are all populated. Soldering was a fun project.

Still awaiting the cable connectors.

The Prototype Hydra is alive.

Here it is populated. Modified a 20 pin IDE cable to connect the LCD. The whole arduino scene is pretty new to me so, I'm learning a lot each day.

Awaiting the new Heatsinks to ship from Arizona. I think with the 10mm square LEDs, drilling & screwing may not be an option.

Will also be ordering 12 more XP-Gs and 7 or 8 more XP-E Royals. This will bring the total to 36 XPG and 36 XPE. This is to better cover the tank and use the full design of the Driver Boards (4 x 18 LEDs). Each 22" heat sink will receive 36 LEDs powered by a single power supply.

More to come.

 

[scolley]

AC-Skip's Welding in Norwalk is currently welding the frame...
Decided to spend a little more to have a little bit more of a finished look.

Hey, I'm all for that! DIY's cool, but your setup is SO nice now, it would be a shame to mess it up with a clunky looking, "hey, it works great even if it does look like sh*t" light.

So I'm real anxious to see what this looks like. The pressure's on now...

The Prototype Hydra is alive... The whole arduino scene is pretty new to me so, I'm learning a lot each day.

So... this is your new science project. Cool! It's good the process is a fun learning exercise. But are you going to make all your fans wait on the controller before you light that puppy up? Over the tank? That's what I'm anxious to see. The light! Both the fixture itself, and - most important - the light it shines on your corals.

LEDS from Cutter have arrived. According to the sticker on the optics case, these are the 10mm Frosted Mediums... 10mm is pretty small, but I saved a bit on the optics (roughly 1.15 per vs 4+ dollars for 20mm star optics).

Is that high alternate cost ($4) because of the square mount? Or that they are XP-Gs? I just bought a bunch of nice looking XP-E optics (star mountable) that were about 70 cents each. What am I missing?

Awaiting the new Heatsinks to ship from Arizona. I think with the 10mm square LEDs, drilling & screwing may not be an option.

My apologies Joe. I've only read the first 10 thousand of the 40 to 50 thousand LED posts here. And because I'm reading chronologically, there may be news on this square mount stuff that I've not gotten to yet. So why the square?

And also... are those holes in two corners of each square? If so, wouldn't those be suitable for screw mounting?


Keep up the good work! Looking good! :thumbsup: And THANKS for posting.

 

[RTMA]

Hey, I'm all for that! DIY's cool, but your setup is SO nice now, it would be a shame to mess it up with a clunky looking, "hey, it works great even if it does look like sh*t" light.

So I'm real anxious to see what this looks like. The pressure's on now...


So... this is your new science project. Cool! It's good the process is a fun learning exercise. But are you going to make all your fans wait on the controller before you light that puppy up? Over the tank? That's what I'm anxious to see. The light! Both the fixture itself, and - most important - the light it shines on your corals.




Is that high alternate cost ($4) because of the square mount? Or that they are XP-Gs? I just bought a bunch of nice looking XP-E optics (star mountable) that were about 70 cents each. What am I missing?


My apologies Joe. I've only read the first 10 thousand of the 40 to 50 thousand LED posts here. And because I'm reading chronologically, there may be news on this square mount stuff that I've not gotten to yet. So why the square?

And also... are those holes in two corners of each square? If so, wouldn't those be suitable for screw mounting?


Keep up the good work! Looking good! :thumbsup: And THANKS for posting.

Yes Steve, I do not want it to look crappy! Many ideas floating around my head for strictly aesthetic purposes. We will have to see.

I do still have to wait until I get the heatsinks before anything really comes together.

The XPG lens where my choice from Cutter, which are made for the 10mm squares. I liked the smaller form factor for mounting on aluminum angle. The stars would have been fine too. Just personal preference there.

The 10 mm squares do have holes, but they really can't be used for mounting if I use optics. I'll use a very,very small amount of epoxy to adhere once everything in on the heat sinks. My initial plan was to epoxy the leds, and I still want to do that. Thanks for the offer of the drill press, it is much appreciated, but don't think I'll need it.

The hydra will be needed to dim the leds. So that will be done in the downtime between everything

 

[tank o tang]

Can't wait to see this in person. If it were me I'd wrap the frame in wood to hide everything and hang it like a pendant. I'd also flush the lcd screen into the face.

 

[RTMA]

Can't wait to see this in person. If it were me I'd wrap the frame in wood to hide everything and hang it like a pendant. I'd also flush the lcd screen into the face.

Me either! I was thinking of just that, but maybe black acrylic. I'm thinking the LCD will be mounted above my reefkeeper in my cabinet to the right, away from any potential salt spray.

As an update - according to UPS my new heatsinks are in, so I'll have a lot to play with when I get back from traveling. This hobby has certainly skewed my view of things. Now as I walk Myrtle Beach, All I can think about when I look at the shoreline is...wow, that would make a great frag plug or, hmm, I wonder if that snail is reef safe or look at all the holes in that shell, I bet a ton of bacteria could grow in there... lol.

 

[RTMA]

The Baseline...

The Baseline...

So to understand if the LEDS can really replace my current MHs effectively, I needed a baseline. This is my Baseline. My current fixture is a 250 mh with 4 T5s. It has typical, or batwing style reflectors and the T5s only have a single reflector for two bulbs. If I choose to, I could have improved the setup, but as of now, this is my baseline. 250w Ushio 10k running on Magnetic ballasts.

Here are the PAR values.

I think tomorrow, I will try and take some more readings after removing the glass splash guard for the mogul mh bulbs.

After a ton of wiring the driver enclosure is completed. It started out as a 4 port Serial switch box from Ebay for about 18 dollars shipped. Looks much better then anything I could have fabricated. (Still need to find that one standoff...lost on the carpet, and no idea where to buy a new one...)

A & C are the 6 strings of Blues and B & D are the 6 strings of Whites. I/O is 5v power & ground & PWM. Two type M connectors for the 24v power.

And the insides... still need to solder and tape that wire cap...

Many thanks to Georgi for the help!

The blues will be powered by a MPJA 24V 6.5A and the whites will be powered by a 24V 10A power supply.

Still need to wire the corresponding LEDs to their DB9 plugs as well as wire power. Still need to tinker with the Hydra and really learn how to control the PWM via code...should be fun.

**** Also - a bit of advice if anyone is laying out LEDS on a heatsink & using epoxy - remember to set your orientation from + to -. My first sink, I epoxied without thinking about which side + or - was pointing.. The second came out much better because I laid out my cable before I epoxied. Still works fine and non one will ever know once it is down..but I will know. *****

 

[rjinct]

Looking good.

(Still need to find that one standoff...lost on the carpet, and no idea where to buy a new one...)

I have a bunch of those standoffs in one of my boxes of computer parts. Will take a look this w/e.

 

[scolley]

After a ton of wiring the driver enclosure is completed. It started out as a 4 port Serial switch box from Ebay for about 18 dollars shipped. Looks much better then anything I could have fabricated. (Still need to find that one standoff...lost on the carpet, and no idea where to buy a new one...)

A & C are the 6 strings of Blues and B & D are the 6 strings of Whites. I/O is 5v power & ground & PWM. Two type M connectors for the 24v power.

And the insides... still need to solder and tape that wire cap...

Many thanks to Georgi for the help!

I've seen this in person, and it is nice Joe! :thumbsup:

Well done. A gosh-aweful amount of work inside that little box. The pics don't do it justice. But I guess all the work was the product of your hardware decision. One way or another there was going to be a lot of soldering. Glad you found such a nice unit to mount it all in. Well done!

So to understand if the LEDS can really replace my current MHs effectively, I needed a baseline. This is my Baseline....

Here are the PAR values.

I think tomorrow, I will try and take some more readings after removing the glass splash guard for the mogul mh bulbs.

This is great stuff. Thanks Joe!

So for your "Baseline", you really have two. Splash guard on, and splash guard off. I assume the splash guard on will be the baseline you use for differences in coral growth an aesthetic comparative judgments? Because you've decided you need the splashguard on that particualar light, mounted as you have it. In other words... you USE your light with the splash guard on. So that's what's fair for comparison.

As for the splash guard off baseline, it's a good thing to have for "pure" contrast of LED to your light. But IMO, you could argue that it's irrelevent if in actual use your current light requires a splash guard. That's the real baseline IMO... not the "theoretical" PAR, but the "actual" PAR.

**** Also - a bit of advice if anyone is laying out LEDS on a heatsink & using epoxy - remember to set your orientation from + to -. My first sink, I epoxied without thinking about which side + or - was pointing.. The second came out much better because I laid out my cable before I epoxied. Still works fine and non one will ever know once it is down..but I will know. *****

My hat's off to you for sharing this little mis-step! That kind of stuff is really valuable to people using what you post. But so often thread like these have the OP only share the good stuff, hiding that bad and nasty parts. Thanks for sharing - honestly sharing that is. It only increases the value of your thread. If they had "rep" points on RC (like some forums), I'd be giving you some now. :thumbsup:

 

[der_wille_zur_macht]

It's rewarding to see people using both the CAT4101 PCB and the Hydra controller. Good work! If you have any feedback on either design please post in the respective threads (linked in the original post of course).

Heck, please come post in those threads even if you don't have feedback, just so others reading them can see your successful implementation.

I like the little serial switch box driver implementation. That's a clean way to keep it all packaged up. Have you checked temps inside there with the case all closed up? Might want some ventilation depending on how much power you're dropping across the drivers.

 

[terahz]

Der, how do you manage to find these threads? Is there some monitoring feature on RC that you use? I see you active in all threads that have 'LED' anywhere in them

sorry for OT.

Joe, all looks good. Now post some PAR on the LEDs!

BTW, I know you want to drive the whites at 1A, make sure your DB9s can handle that.

 

[RTMA]

Looking good.



I have a bunch of those standoffs in one of my boxes of computer parts. Will take a look this w/e.

Cool, thanks RJ - gonna see if I have one at work...

I've seen this in person, and it is nice Joe! :thumbsup:

Well done. A gosh-aweful amount of work inside that little box. The pics don't do it justice. But I guess all the work was the product of your hardware decision. One way or another there was going to be a lot of soldering. Glad you found such a nice unit to mount it all in. Well done!

Now lets hope it works! Hopefully will get some time this weekend to test.

So for your "Baseline", you really have two. Splash guard on, and splash guard off. I assume the splash guard on will be the baseline you use for differences in coral growth an aesthetic comparative judgments? Because you've decided you need the splashguard on that particualar light, mounted as you have it. In other words... you USE your light with the splash guard on. So that's what's fair for comparison.

As for the splash guard off baseline, it's a good thing to have for "pure" contrast of LED to your light. But IMO, you could argue that it's irrelevent if in actual use your current light requires a splash guard. That's the real baseline IMO... not the "theoretical" PAR, but the "actual" PAR.

I agree, splash guard off is not going to be my baseline, I just want to see what the readings would be without it. The glass is pretty thick, so I imagine it is reducing PAR somewhat.

 

[RTMA]

It's rewarding to see people using both the CAT4101 PCB and the Hydra controller. Good work! If you have any feedback on either design please post in the respective threads (linked in the original post of course).

Heck, please come post in those threads even if you don't have feedback, just so others reading them can see your successful implementation.

I like the little serial switch box driver implementation. That's a clean way to keep it all packaged up. Have you checked temps inside there with the case all closed up? Might want some ventilation depending on how much power you're dropping across the drivers.

Der - Thanks for the review and all the hard work that went into both projects - it has been fun doing these projects and pushing my skills to the limit. As for the cooling, what you haven't seen yet is the small 40mm dc fan I plan on mounting on the side (I left enough room for a 40mm fan). Just need to find my 1.5" holesaw bit that I misplaced when I did the Minibow LEDs. I'm thinking a 40mm on one side and about 8 well placed 1/4" holes on the other side.

I'm sure I will need some active cooling as the two buckpucks I have running at 1000ma get pretty warm and that is only one string.

If you haven't seen the Minibow 7 thread that is here and what started it all...

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1814962

Joe, all looks good. Now post some PAR on the LEDs!

You know I will! - 72 LEDs should give me some good numbers - even without the optics. I intend to, like I told you guys Tuesday night, I want to test with and without the Carclo optics. I plan to place the fixture the same height as my current fixture and test. Then attach the optics and raise the fixture to get my desired PAR. Hopefully I will be able to raise high enough to really enjoy the "rimless" experience.

BTW, I know you want to drive the whites at 1A, make sure your DB9s can handle that.

The DB9s I got at Radio Shack were rated for 5 Amps. The ones for the whites are running 3 strings for each connector. That should be 3 Amps per for whites and 2.1 Amps per blue.

 

[RTMA]

Did some heat Testing with one side (36 LEDs).

Heatsink - The sink got to about 110-115F without active cooling, ambient temperature in the room was around 73. Once I added two small 40mm fans to test, the sink dropped to around 90, and probably cooler if I positioned them higher. The two 140mm fans I plan on using will easily cool the sinks. I was going to buy the Noctura fans, however I found 16 db 140mm Cooler Master fans at half the price. I'll need to fabricate some mounts for these, which should be pretty easy.

Drivers - I noticed that the xp-g Cats are getting to about 140F degrees without cooling at 700ma. The XP-Es at 700ma were barely warm to the touch. That is with my supply turned down to 20 volts. I added two fans for the driver case - push / pull.

Wired both banks to DB9s as well as created the connector for the 5v, PWM and 5v ground. To test the boards I was using the 5v pin on a USB BUB board to provide the 5v reference voltage and the pwm.

Still need to work on the Hydra portion. Hopefully I'll have some time tonight.

**Also of note - Found that the crimp style DB9s are a ton easier to make connectors. Basically I have been using "helping hands" to hold the pin. Dip the wire into a little bit of flux. Place the wire on the pin, get a little bit of solder on the iron and then touch the pin. The flux will flow the solder and make a strong connection. I then just crimp the ends (with needle nose pliers) and place it in the connector. It's a bit easier then working with the close proximity of the solder type DB9 connectors. **