Yes, but how do you initiate that flow into the corals while still managing to keep things thriving? This, at least to this novice, is where the "magic" lies.
Keeping SPS is soooo hard and expensive! Thinking about quitting after 2 years.
- Thread starter kurfer
- Start date
Yes, but how do you initiate that flow into the corals while still managing to keep things thriving? This, at least to this novice, is where the "magic" lies.
With detritus control. The longer something such as food as allowed to rot in tank the more it contributes to inorganic nutrients.
Remove the detritus asap and feed more (organic nutrients) and your increasing the organic nutrients (solid food = organic nutrients)
Made a quick video, feel free to let me know if i'm doing it wrong. Here is a quick 5g video I made to show my process of cleaning display.
I'm here to learn so any critique is welcome. I checked my ego in when I made this thread. I also hope my mistakes and lack of understanding can help others who are having similar issues.
I'm here to learn so any critique is welcome. I checked my ego in when I made this thread. I also hope my mistakes and lack of understanding can help others who are having similar issues.
mmark
New member
Let me just say sorry for all your coral loss but your tank looks great. One thing I do during water changes is take cheap power head ( that turkey baster isn't doing the job) and blow off the rocks corals and even run it over the sand. Also keep keep the power heads in your tank running. That will keep all the junk you just blew off floating around and you can siphon a lot of it out. Not sure if it helps what's going on with you .....good luck.
Yes to both powerhead parts. With a tank stocked like yours a PH would be a lot better, you can use the turkey baster up close on holes in the LR to get some of the passage ways and such
When I siphon my sand I get all the way to the bottom of the sand, I'll be vacuuming mine tonight so I'll get a video and post it
So, I guess that means big skimmer, great flow (both with DT and to the sump), GFO, carbon, filter socks, and targeted detritus removal, right? Does that also equate to no substrate in the DT?
tkeracer619
New member
There is actual no such thing. Most who advocates DSB setups don't say "no maintenance", IME it is the opposite. Of course there are a bunch of people who have never successfully kept one of those systems for various reasons spreading misinformation.
Detritus itself isn't really a big problem if you have strong enough export, it's when you have weak export and then getting everything out counts.
I cleaned the sump on the system I posted maybe 3 or 4 times over a 5 year period. I was never concerned with detritus after the first year or so when tanks are more vulnerable to algae blooms.
To the OP. I would consider my last post. I've resolved tanks with the same symptoms you describe.
Have you tested your RO water for anything other than tds? You need to check for chlorine making it through.
CStrickland
New member
It's not one way. It's the idea that you are removing the detritus from the water.
Some like a lot of flow around the dt, so that detritus cant settle there. Once it passes into the sump, it can slow down. Some folks like to have that first chamber where the water speed decreases be an empty space that they can vac easily when the detritus drops out of the water. Some use a sock but those can be more work, a lot of people have big skimmers. I think phane just has a sock, but he's not ULNS. You adapt for what you want to keep. GFO and carbon seem more common in DSB tanks to me.
About to walk into Home Depot as we speak to get a quick chlorine test kit. Hope they have something!
CStrickland
New member
Do those tests show chlorammine too? Or are you sure your town uses chlorine?
tkeracer619
New member
It shows in a total chlorine kit.
This kit may work, not sure about it's resolution.
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Pool-Tim...PIPHorizontal1_rr-_-203414630-_-100002743-_-N
This kit may work, not sure about it's resolution.
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Pool-Tim...PIPHorizontal1_rr-_-203414630-_-100002743-_-N
Last edited:
Bneufelder
New member
I'm having about the exact same problem as you. Same lights, same params. (My zoas are fine though) Had decent growth for SPS for 9 months, put my lights on acclimation mode to add new SPS and it has kicked off a non-stop STN/RTN event. I've lost 30 frags in the last 3 weeks and nearly all of my original SPS.
tkeracer619
New member
Did you QT those 30 frags? I'm not sure why an acclimation mode would set off something like that.
Mix up a batch of salt water at 1.025 test levels of new saltwater mix. And keep your tank at that level. Test with different brands of test kits. I've noticed there all a little different. Or get a salt that mix to the levels of your tank... or maybe you have a pest that eats corals. Had the same thing happen to me a couple years ago and dipped everything once every week and bam, corals where ripping. Good luck. Best thing you can do sometimes is let nature run its course in your tank and see what's killing them . If they all dies at the same time it's prob tank conditions. If you see irritation on one or a couple , prob pest. **** sucks either way. I wish you the best.
not necessarily. my system did great with the display being barebottom, about 35x flow, mostly softies & lps, only 2 sps, encrusting montipora and montipora spongodes. great growth all around. my sump was a settling chamber that I cleaned once a month with a 30% waterchange. I chose once a month because I wanted nutrients in there to support the lps and softies, im not too into sps so I was watching the lps to make them the happiest. I didn't have any algae whatsoever and only had to clean the glass once a week. I created an environment for the lps (euyphilla are my must have organisms) and lucky everything I have enjoyed that system. I just added a shallow sand bed to my system and am currently epoxying a bunch of rock together. ill change my maintenance schedule to siphon the sand once a week and siphon out the sump once every two weeks. I did have a filter sock on the system about 1/2 the time it was up.
what are you exporting though, the detritus or the inorganic nutrients? because detritus is one of the major problems and besides alk/cal/mg, ect.. its really the only other thing you need to control. control the detritus and you control the level of nutrients in the system making it easier to create the environment for your must have organisms. with dsb's ive always heard just put in X amount of sand and don't touch it. maybe rough up the top 1/2 inch every once in a while but that's it. IMO that equates to no maintenance. also why I put the ' ' on the no maintenance, I should've explained that.
yep, my system was right in the middle, ideal for LPS. low enough to where I can support some sps but high enough so softies would be happy. I ran with and without the filter sock, couldn't decide if I wanted it or didn't want it
I also think it doesn't sound like the lights did it. sounds more like a pest got introduced..
kenpau
New member
I half agree with what you are saying here. Just because you spend heaps of money it doesn't guarantee success, however buying the right equipment that is reliable can definitely help with keeping a successful reef. In your case of a dosing pump, I have one dosing Alk, Calcium and Magnesium, after a couple of weeks tuning in to find the right amount to dose for my system, my parameters are very stable. It isn't lazy to use a doser, we all know that stability is the key to a healthy reef and the ability to dose very small amounts of supplements throughout the course of a day is very helpful in reducing drops in vital parameters. Another example would be an auto top off, sure you can top up your water every night after work but having an automated system do this for you during the day keeps the salinity much more constant. Definitely not a lazy way out.
dkeller_nc
New member
Unfortunately, the kits usually sold for pool/Jacuzzi use don't help us reefers much if our municipal supply uses chloramine. Most municipalities in the US do use chloramine now, though not all. You can find out by googling your municipal water supplier and "water quality report".
You can figure out if your test strips are giving you a chloramine determination by simply testing your un-filtered tap water. Presuming your municipality is properly running things, you should get something like 2-4 ppm total chlorine. If your strips are measuring free chlorine (as most pool/Jacuzzi types do), you'll get close to zero from your tap water.
Reefin' Dude
New member
i was afraid my comment was going to be taken that way. the flow of Pi needs to be out of the coral, not into the coral. when the Pi flow is into the coral we have problems. the corals need to be in charge. they take in food. their waste feeds the zoax, then any left over is released back into the water column. when we do not feed, the zoax becomes in charge and the Pi is going into the coral from the water column. the coral is not getting the nutrition it needs. go back to the video and the reason why readable phosphates and nitrates can be high is because they are lower than what is in the coral. the coral is still in charge of the nutrients. as long as this is the case it really does not matter how high the water column Pi and Ni are.
this is not "magic" to novices. this is "magic" for everyone.
no, it just means we need to treat the substrate as an organism. it needs to be fed, and it needs its waste removed. the same as anything else. it is easier to think this way, than it is to think of each and every organisms in the substrate individually. just think of the entire substrate as an organisms.
--------------------------------------------
it is all about following known good husbandry practices. feed the organisms, and remove its waste in a timely manner. we have not been doing this. we start out feeding just great, all is good, but at some point the P sink in the system fills up and is now producing more Pi, than what is going into the system, so the corals stop being in charge. we start to see the change and assume that it is a nutrient problem so we slow the feeding down. this just make the problem worse. the Pi test better, but the problems do not go away because feeding is not increased. if the waste is removed quick enough, than keeping the organic nutrients high enough to keep the corals in charge is made easier.
G~
